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  1. #41

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    Ratio, No where near what it should/could be. thanks for the reminder to give back.

  2. #42
    Registered User Monkeywrench's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jack Tarlin View Post
    Also, hikers need to do the right thing when they encounter maintainers working on the Trail. A good friend of mine who has maintained in Tennessee for years told me that many hikers walk right by trail workers without so much as a "Hello!", never mind a "Thank you!" or stopping for a few minutes to talk. And the number who ask the workers if they need help with anything or an extra set of hands for a little while is such a tiny fraction of hikers so as to be non-existent. So please, if you see men and women out digging, building walls or staircases, moving logs or boulders.......if you're in too much of a hurry to offer them a hand, at least offer a smile or a word of thanks. Your trip and your Trail would not exist without them.
    I probably spend more weekends doing maintenance than I do "just out hiking." I've been working maintenance in Vermont with the GMC for decades. Most hikers we meet out on the trail are friendly and appreciative. A small minority are complaining jerks ("You need to cut the ferns. They get my socks all wet in the morning!") I can't recall anyone ever offering to help, though I never expected anyone to either; after all, they're out for a hike.
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  3. #43

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    Quote Originally Posted by Monkeywrench View Post
    A small minority are complaining jerks ("You need to cut the ferns. They get my socks all wet in the morning!") I can't recall anyone ever offering to help
    You need to hand out scythes, "just leave it at the next road crossing, we'll pick it up, thanks."

  4. #44

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    Quote Originally Posted by RED-DOG View Post
    I have done three thru-hikes,and i have done several sections, and i haven't done any trail maintenance I don't think a thru-hiker needs to do trail maintenance in order to give back to the trail, It's up to the person, some do and some don't.
    You're right of course, threepeat thru-hikers don't have to do trail maintenance to give back to the trail. They can do other stuff like volunteer for a week at the ATC in Harpers Ferry, or clean toilets at the Place.

  5. #45
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    To some degree hiking is itself a form of trail maintenance. For example animal trails are solely maintained by the passage of said animals. So in that sense one's ratio is always one to one.

    Having said that, dedicated trail maintenance is as important to the AT as it is rewarding to the participant. Volunteer today!

  6. #46
    Coach Lou coach lou's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by lambsknoll View Post

    Having said that, dedicated trail maintenance is as important to the AT as it is rewarding to the participant. Volunteer today!
    I can attest to this sentiment!

  7. #47
    Registered User LIhikers's Avatar
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    My wife and I are boundary monitors in NY, near Graymoor. We make at least 2 trips a year, spring and fall. Depending on how much time we spend clipping, cutting, and clearing, each trip is 1 or 2 days. If there's painting and blazing to be done we usually do that in extra trips. But no matter how much we do you'll probably never see it as our "trail maintenance" takes us out to the edges of the property the trail runs through, not along the trail itself. But that's ok because we do it for our own satisfaction and enjoyment. We've had such good times hiking sections of the AT that we wanted to help maintain this fantastic resource so that others can enjoy it too.

    Back to the original idea of a ratio of maintenance to hiking, I have no idea. We are required to keep track not only of our time working but also travel time when we do our boundary thing but I don't have a clue how much time we spend hiking, except to say, not enough.

  8. #48

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    Don't do too much. Us trail workers will be out of a job!

  9. #49
    Some days, it's not worth chewing through the restraints.
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    I don't really think anyone should feel that they have to contribute in order to hike. Many contribute to other things in other ways. That said, I've been a trail or shelter adopter for more than 10 years, and wouldn't think of not doing something.

    One caveat for those that want to do some ad-hoc trailwork... please check with the club or agency responsible for that trail before you begin. Someone else may be assigned to that trail and have plans. It sucks to haul tools for miles only to find that the work you had planned is already done!

  10. #50
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    My ratio, alas is infinite, as I have done zero formal trail maintenance. I do have hopes of retiring soon, and that's certainly something I plan to do when I have the time.

  11. #51
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    My ratio is about 0:1 and I am very OK with that. There are no hard requirements nor would I ever want them to be. That said I do help out fellow hikers, my knowleage of medicinal plants has earned praise from some and my out of my way drives to see if a thru needs a lift into town also speaks to trail maintenance being not a requirement or obligation, and to semi-quote a highly controversial source, to each according to their needs, from each according to their ability.

  12. #52
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    Im not sure how to tabulate this because in addition to doing two seasons of trail work with the SCA and with the Montana Cons. Corps, I find myself doing trailwork on every hike I go on. Ooo theres a shortcut developing, let me brush that in.. Knock that crud out of the waterbar with your heel (dont use toe! destroys boots faster)... hey you, stay off those alpine plants!

  13. #53

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    Quote Originally Posted by Deadeye View Post
    I don't really think anyone should feel that they have to contribute in order to hike. Many contribute to other things in other ways. That said, I've been a trail or shelter adopter for more than 10 years, and wouldn't think of not doing something.

    One caveat for those that want to do some ad-hoc trailwork... please check with the club or agency responsible for that trail before you begin. Someone else may be assigned to that trail and have plans. It sucks to haul tools for miles only to find that the work you had planned is already done!
    Very good point. The only obligation people should feel to maintain trails should be from their own internal drivers.

    I maintain about 8 miles of Blue Trail in CT, which has a very popular high spot view at the end of about a mile or so of trail. The balance of my trails go into the back country without attractions to the casual walker but provide nice, challenging hikes. The high spot trail I have to visit every few weeks just to remove litter and make repairs to the viewing area, removal of dog crap, etc. The back country trails are twice a year, removing mostly deadfalls and tree branches. If anyone has an itch to maintain a trail, they could be most effective in moving branches or small, easily move limbs from the treadway. That can be done with low effort and not slow a hike much if you are good with the pole. If every fifth or tenth hiker were to flip a branch or two off to the side of the trail and pick up a little litter (or clean up after Fido) my job would be a lot easier and I could spend more time doing trail improvements instead of custodial work.

    Deadeye is absolutely correct about doing trail maintenance without talking to the managing organization. Many times work that is done ad-hoc has to be torn out and redone. Train maintainers typically have standards of repair, construction, routing, and treadway care that people may not be aware of. For the same reason leaving a scythe at a trail head for people to use to keep brush down (as was suggested, and a pretty neat idea) isn't an option for organizations that manage trails due to the liability of use by untrained people. Our organization requires supervision of people using tools who are not members of the organizations trail maintenance group(s) and have completed a training process.

  14. #54
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    Quote Originally Posted by AT Traveler View Post
    Deadeye is absolutely correct about doing trail maintenance without talking to the managing organization. Many times work that is done ad-hoc has to be torn out and redone. Train maintainers typically have standards of repair, construction, routing, and treadway care that people may not be aware of. For the same reason leaving a scythe at a trail head for people to use to keep brush down (as was suggested, and a pretty neat idea) isn't an option for organizations that manage trails due to the liability of use by untrained people. Our organization requires supervision of people using tools who are not members of the organizations trail maintenance group(s) and have completed a training process.
    This is going to sound incredibly conceited, but I've been trained well enough to know my strengths and limitations. The stuff I do while Im hiking is the simple stuff that I KNOW is necessary and not so much a matter of opinion (brushing in a developing shortcut, not exactly rocket appliances). Sure, I would love to build some bog bridges while Im at it haha, but Ill leave the technical stuff for when there are management types around to direct the action.

  15. #55
    Registered User somers515's Avatar
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    Interesting topic. One thing that made me laugh was JustaTouron's quote. "Mt. Katahdin would be a lot quicker to climb if its darn access trail didn't start all the way down in Georgia." Is that quoting someone or is that a JustaTouron original?

  16. #56

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    Quote Originally Posted by gregpphoto View Post
    This is going to sound incredibly conceited, but I've been trained well enough to know my strengths and limitations. The stuff I do while Im hiking is the simple stuff that I KNOW is necessary and not so much a matter of opinion (brushing in a developing shortcut, not exactly rocket appliances). Sure, I would love to build some bog bridges while Im at it haha, but Ill leave the technical stuff for when there are management types around to direct the action.
    Not conceited at all, many people know how to use trail tools, know what needs to be done, and perhaps more importantly understand the standards that have to be followed in various projects. Cleaning out water bars, brushing out game/illicit trails, and doing light maintenance is a great help. I'll take that kind of help anytime I can get it and sure wish you lived near here!

    Putting in rock stairs, or puncheons are pretty technical and are not routine in trail maintenance as much as clearing/cutting brush and the above activities. However these projects are usually beyond an individuals ability or desire to do by themselves. We get requests to do work like this by folks outside of the organization, both individuals and groups like Scouts. They more often than not get the green light too. The person responsible for the trail section usually has to be involved to ensure the proper surveys are done prior to the work and construction/repair standards are maintained. Its when people don't contact us that problems can arise. Like rerouting a bit of trail around an eroded spot that goes through a stand of protected plants.

  17. #57

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    I have Thru-Hiked the AT three times done several Long/short sections, Hiked the FootHills Trail, The MST and several other trails, including trails in the Colorado Rocky Mountains and Yellowstone National Park, Glacier National Park. and several other places through out the Rockies but the only time I have actually done trail work Is on my 2006 AT thru I was in the SNP and I came across the trail club that does that section, they was putting water breaks in so I stopped and helped them It took 6 hrs and i had a very nice lunch with them, they treated me to a Bolagna/cheese sandwich a bag of chips and cola, so any body that has the opportunity to stop and help out even if your on a Thru-Hike stop and help.

  18. #58

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    I brought the longest handle loppers and a curved blade green saw to my first "trail grooming". Me and one man made short work of the trail assigned to us. Others came back to have lunch there and to help us. We had finished our trail in half a day. Those are thr best tools for what long handled loppers and a curved green saw will cut growing over a trail. We could easily handle "the big stuff" as well as "the little stuff". We didn't hack or whack. The trail looked entirely natural.

  19. #59
    Registered User John B's Avatar
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    Second Saturday of every month spent with the Red River Gorge Trail Crew. I haven't missed a Saturday in ages. On the other hand, I haven't gone on an overnight hike in years.

  20. #60
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    Quote Originally Posted by AT Traveler View Post
    I'll take that kind of help anytime I can get it and sure wish you lived near here!
    Well give it a couple million years and another orogeny and maybe Connecticut will have big enough mountains to attract me!

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