Would a federal freedom to roam law work in USA?

[rafe]

Do you know why europeans come HERE to hike?

because its much less restricted than in europe.

Heres the problem in a nutshell. Too little land there, too many people.

Were working on the same problem.

Europeans do lots of hiking. They're not as anal about private property as we are in the USA.

[Connie]

I love to hike, camp , and roam, but there is more than enough public land to do that.

Permits aren't that tough to get when you need them.

I wouldn't be surprised if we have more public land designated for recreational use than some entire countries' land mass.


quick Google..
http://www.nrcm.org/documents/publiclandownership.pdf

[Nodust]

I wouldn't be surprised if we have more public land designated for recreational use than some entire countries' land mass.

That wouldn't surprise me either.


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[Dogwood]

Basically UNLIMITED opportunities to hike, backpack, trek, walk about, roam, etc in the U.S. However, as also in Norway, freedom does not equate with the absence of any rules or regulations.

Enjoy your walks wherever they may be.

I highly doubt that many Europeans come to hike in the US. Do you have any numbers?

In Norway half the population hike one or more times every year. How many Norwegians have thru-hiked the Appalachian trail?…

https://www.nps.gov/tourism/Research...ndvisitors.pdf

The NPS is the place to go to find out how many non U.S. citizens visit the U.S. National Parks each year. According to this 1998 report 21% of the nearly 24 million foreign visitors to the U.S. who arrived here by airlines visited the then 50 U.S. National Parks then in existence. These are only the 50 NPs not the several hundred places the NPS oversees. The majority of these foreign visitors are from Europe. If you allow me the latitude to hypothesize those numbers are significantly higher in 2015. These numbers don't include foreigners who visit and hike in U.S. State Parks, Wilderness Areas, National Seashores, National Monuments, Wildlife Refuges, land overseen by Bureau of Land Management, National Forests, etc.

Don't assume the Appalachian Trail IS THE PLACE that foreigners, or ALL AMERICANS flock to hike in the U.S. The AT is not the center of the global or U.S. hiking world despite easily coming to this mistaken conclusion because one may only be familiar with forums such as White Blaze where the AT is by far the focus. For reference, as a rather socialite on some LD hikes(at least I was in 2006), on a 2006 AT 4.5 month NOBO Thru-hike I recorded in my trail journal meeting AT hikers from 29 different(non U.S.) countries.

[Connie]

For most people, their "entire world" is a city. This is so not true.

Here is a helpful map:

image.png

[SWODaddy]

I am a Norwegian, and I spend most of my vacations in the US (about seventeen now). I have also worked there, and been a student there. There are a lot I love about USA, but the lack of freedom to roam has annoyed me quite a lot.

What is freedom to roam, and how does it work?
Well, there are differences between countries, but here is how it works in Norway:
- You can hike in any wilderness areas, who ever owns it (also on private land), and no one can deny you that.
- You can put up a tent, as long as it is at least 150 meters from the nearest building.
- You can stay in the same spot at a maximum three days in a row.
- You can even bike on the trails.

What has annoyed me in the US.
- Most land you can’t hike freely on, because it is private property. And if it is not private, you often have to have a permit. In Norway a permit is unheard of, and we don’t pay anything to enter National parks.
- You have to have knowledge about who owns the wilderness you want to enter. You don’t have to check anything in Norway. If it is wilderness, you can use it.

Could this work in the US? Would anyone here on White blaze want this system?

How is depriving someone the use of their land a freedom?

[rocketsocks]

A perfect example of why freedumb is never really free and someone will always have to pay.

[Gnomad]

How does one "own land". If we all got past that...

[rafe]

About 5 years ago, just after midnight on Christmas Eve, I held two millennial punk trespassers face down in the dirt at gunpoint for two hours until the Game and Fish wardens arrived.

I'm sure Jesus would have been proud.

[MuddyWaters]

How does one "own land". If we all got past that...

Well, we dont actually own land in the US.
We only rent it
If you dont believe it, try not paying your yearly rent to government
They will give it to someone else that will.

[cliffordbarnabus]

I am a Norwegian, and I spend most of my vacations in the US (about seventeen now). I have also worked there, and been a student there. There are a lot I love about USA, but the lack of freedom to roam has annoyed me quite a lot.

What is freedom to roam, and how does it work?
Well, there are differences between countries, but here is how it works in Norway:
- You can hike in any wilderness areas, who ever owns it (also on private land), and no one can deny you that.
- You can put up a tent, as long as it is at least 150 meters from the nearest building.
- You can stay in the same spot at a maximum three days in a row.
- You can even bike on the trails.

What has annoyed me in the US.
- Most land you can’t hike freely on, because it is private property. And if it is not private, you often have to have a permit. In Norway a permit is unheard of, and we don’t pay anything to enter National parks.
- You have to have knowledge about who owns the wilderness you want to enter. You don’t have to check anything in Norway. If it is wilderness, you can use it.

Could this work in the US? Would anyone here on White blaze want this system?

i cycled around the world for 6 years. and i loved scandinavia. just throw it down wherever. mutual respect.

however, i do remember there being like an $80 entrance fee for the national park at the north cape. i began engaging in a u-turn. then the guy at the booth starts yelling at me, kindly. he says, "bikes are free...that fee is only for cars." sweet.

[CamelMan]

I would love a law like this, Oslohiker, I've heard it's the same in Sweden. I don't believe in private property. It's just a fiction enshrined in law.

[Kaptainkriz]

That and eminent domain. Land was actually taken (forced buyout) from people to establish portions of the AT using eminent domain.

Well, we dont actually own land in the US.
We only rent it
If you dont believe it, try not paying your yearly rent to government
They will give it to someone else that will.

[Connie]

$80 entry to a national park? Not here, so far.

We believe we should keep a rein on government.

We should do more of that!

[Connie]

blah blah

I wrote: a few good laws..

[adamkrz]

Reminds me of the 70's song from the five man electrical band - sign - sign - everywhere a sign do this don't do that can't you read the sign - I'm the holder of a few illegal camping tickets myself.

[rocketsocks]

How does one "own land". If we all got past that...

i find the whole concept of owning land a bit of a farce, but the laws of the land hinge on the ideas and mutual understanding of a modern society, and with those we maintain decency and an expectation reed on to do with your land as you see fit. Don't pay your taxes and the land your family has own for 400 years will be sucked up, so freedom ain't really free is it.

[rocketsocks]

Expectation of freedom to do with your land as you see fit.

[rocketsocks]

Reminds me of the 70's song from the five man electrical band - sign - sign - everywhere a sign do this don't do that can't you read the sign - I'm the holder of a few illegal camping tickets myself.

me too, they just haven't been handed to me yet.

[35king]

Not sure I'd go as far as allowing free roaming wherever, whenever but I sure would like to see more freedom to disperse camp through out my area (northern Illinois, southern Wisconsin area) I like to hammock camp and if you're with a few friends, you need to find the right spot to hang multiple hammocks. We shouldn't be as confined as we are (in my area) to a few sparce camping locations.