Cost & Time of Hiking the AT

[-Animal]

OK, this is the math that brought me to the skepticism:

using the quoted 1 to 8 spending ratio, I went with 1000 on the low end and 8000 on the high end - to me that is a wide but realistic span of total expense (other than those who have to include international travel) - there are of course expenses other than food so 400 left for food would be about it - a fast pace would allow 4 month completion ( if everything goes almost perfect ) - so a 100 per month makes the numbers come together .......

OK, so the bucket of food, which I now remember, would be the key - enabling the majority of food purchases at the few locations along the trail that are truly econmical - I believe that is the framework of the theory .. but

in reality, the numbers still do not work out - and I stand on my skepticism for the benefit of the newbie who gets an unrealistic picture of the hardships vs enjoyment and hunger associated with a sub-minimal budget - points I consider in this conclusion:

1)hauling a lot of food makes for a slower hike, so the 4 month timetable (and hence the minimal budget) becomes increasingly less realistic

2) the extra load is nearly universally regarded to make a less enjoyable experience(especially starting and in the areas of tougher trail conditions)

3)a heavy load is more likely to result in injury - 7 years ago, less than 24 hours in the Berlin NH hospital for a broken ankle was over 30,000 for a buddy - what would it be today? - makes the food saving seem insignificant - a solid plan for economy would try to minimize, not increase chance of injury

4) As others have posted here, the needed nutrition does not jive with the quality / quantity of the food budget ( derived from using this 1 to 8 ratio ) no matter where along the trail it is purchased (but especially in the north end) - I consider my food/ and other consumables budget far from extravagant, yet with some postage etc it never ends up less than 20 per day (food,drink, fuel, TP, soap etc)


all right, in case any one is still reading this by now, I will plug in some less dramatic/ controversial numbers that would be more realistic/ repeatable / not relying on the best luck to work

The modified original:

"A cheap hike can be done and I have as much fun hiking assomeone who spends X8X - 4- times as much. HYOH"

keeping the high end the same leaves a 2000 budget

adding some to the non- consumable end leaves 1000 - stretching the schedule to 5 months leaves 200 a month - now it is looking real -

some of these months in the middle of trail the 100 with no hitching may be doable, this also coincides with less hazardous trail conditions ( and the hikers being tuned up) that make the extra load feasible - the first full supermarket within a short distance of the trail that I can recall is Erwin - before this, IMO obtaining and carrying weeks of food without outside assistance is not a plan to be promoted as feasible

so at the more expensive/ less convenient north and south ends the budget could be over 200 a month / 15 a day - that is in the range of healthy / not hungry but still a very minimal budget

In the end, I am not arguing with your system, only with your price points

George, thank you for all that effort and math. Only one problem… if you read the original quote that sparked your skepticism and think about what it says…
“A cheap hike can be done and I have as much fun hiking as someone who spends 8 times as much. HYOH”
…you will see it was not about food at all.

Just out of curiosity what is this extra $600 in expenses that you tried to take away from the $1000 so I only had $400 for food?
Cost for all my gear and to get to and from the trail is less than $400. I’m lucky enough to have flight passes.
I’ll be thru-hiking in 2014 using the same system I’ve used the last two years with success no matter who thinks it can’t be done. See you all on the trail. HYOH
Newbies, do not try my system.

[George]

and after my comment, that it would be a little hungrier - it was led into the food thing

now it may vary, but you have to acknowledge if a food obsessed ( as normal ) hiker had an 8000 budget, the tendency would be to eat like a king - in ways a budget 1/8 the size does not allow

prepaid gear, or transportation that was obtained other ways does not exclude the expense - that is accounting tricks, not reality

[Double Wide]

Wait a minute....

atskeptical.jpg

[Mags]

prepaid gear, or transportation that was obtained other ways does not exclude the expense - that is accounting tricks, not reality

That is usually (not always) how "cheap thru-hikes" are done.

In past threads, turned out a person's parents bought the food and mailed it...
OR they had gear replacements ready to go or bought for them....
Well, you get the idea.



From an earlier thread:


Marta's excellent quiz. If you can honestly answer the questions as mainly A&B, perhaps you can do a sub-$2000 hike. I'll add that perhaps Garlic's figure of $1000/mo is a good baseline. If you are more disciplined, stop less in towns and hike all day, a thru-hike is less expensive due to simply being shorter.


Can you do a cheap thru-hike?

1) What sort of car do you drive?
a) No car. I take the bus or ride a junker bike.
b) Beater more than 15 years old. Bought it used.
c) Reliable car, but nothing flashy.
d) Car my parents gave me.
e) I like nice wheels, and money is no object.

2) Where do you live?
a) Hellhole
b) Small apartment.
c) Modest single-family home.
d) I've always lived with my parents, or in a dorm room or apartment they've paid for.
e) I like to be comfortable, and make a good impression on friends and family.

3) Where did you get your current winter coat?
a) Cast-off ffreebie
b) Goodwill shop
c) Big box store.
d) From my parents.
e) Quality clothing is worth the money.

4) When is the last time you went out to eat, and where did you go?
a) I can't remember that far back in time.
b) McDonald's dollar menu
c) Outback or Applebee's.
d) Wherever my parents took me.
e) What I put in my body is important, so I'm picky about what I'll accept.

5) Where do you buy groceries?
a) I scrounge.
b) Super Wal-Mart
c) Grocery store with decent selection.
d) My folks do the shopping.
e) I only buy organically-grown food.

I think you get the point.

People who always choose A have a chance of doing a cheap thru-hike. Not spending money permeates every decision they make.

B's might be able to pull it off.

C's will probably do a moderately-priced hike, which they prudently save for and execute under budget.

I think the folks who are deluded about their ability to live cheaply are often D's. They haven't been out on their own financially, and don't really have the mental tools for making the choices that will let them stretch their money far enough to finish a hike. They are shocked, shocked I tell you, at how quickly money leaks away.

E's won't scrimp on their hike, but they probably don't need to.

[colorado_rob]

For some reason this popped into my head this morning, the $4000 number I quoted for my 1000 mile AT hike last year included the cost of my wife joining me for part of it, subtracting those costs it is more like $3000 total spent. If I had been moderately frugal, I bet I could have been down in the low/mid 2’s, but no lower than that.

One important point one has to ask oneself for these costs: How much do I spend in my “normal” life to live? For me, gas, food and day-to-day expenses at home come out to about $800 a month (not including mortgage or rent/utilities/insurance, which are still there when I’m hiking). So for the 9 weeks I was on the trail, I would have spent close to two grand on living at home anyway, so the EXTRA cost of hiking the AT was maybe just a bit over a grand.
(For those youngsters living with their parents, of course this argument doesn’t apply).

[Coffee]

One important point one has to ask oneself for these costs: How much do I spend in my “normal” life to live? For me, gas, food and day-to-day expenses at home come out to about $800 a month (not including mortgage or rent/utilities/insurance, which are still there when I’m hiking). So for the 9 weeks I was on the trail, I would have spent close to two grand on living at home anyway, so the EXTRA cost of hiking the AT was maybe just a bit over a grand.
(For those youngsters living with their parents, of course this argument doesn’t apply).

I have recently discovered the same thing as I make up a budget for my 2015 PCT thru hike. When I'm on the trail, I'm not buying gas, food, and other things that I would normally be buying at home. Also, if I choose to rent out my home for six months, my overall expenses for 2015 will be lower doing the thru hike than they would be otherwise.

I think that the main cost for most people who aren't retired (or very young with few good employment prospects) turns out to be the opportunity cost of lost earnings.

[Marta]

Thanks for digging out The Quiz, Mags. I still stand by it.

A further thought--for a lot of people thru-hiking involves a great deal of suffering. For many AT dreamers this comes as a shock. (What's funny about that is that the Trail literature emphasizes the writer's suffering, which is often presented to the reader as amusing. Then somehow that same reader will be shocked--shocked--to find suffering to be far less amusing when it's their own.)

The suffering is both physical and mental. How much suffering you're in for depends on how ready you are for the journey and what your previous experiences, in life and in hiking, have been. If you have had a lot of tough experiences (a lot of vets are attracted to hiking), you'll be dealing with one set of issues; if you're very young, you'll be dealing with another set; if you're old, soft, or sad, you'll be deal with a bunch of other things.

If you stick with The Hike, you'll figure out ways to lessen your suffering. Carrying less weight is an obvious help. Figuring out what to eat, how to sleep warm, how to stay healthy, and how to appreciate the pleasures of the hiking life all happen over time.

Until then, though, you'll probably depend on expensive crutches to keep you going. The most common crutches are cigarettes, alcohol, drugs, restaurant food, hotels/hostels/B&Bs, and new gear purchases. All that will sop up as much money as you can throw at it. A significant number of hikers decide they would rather shorten their hikes rather than go without their chosen indulgences.

[Marta]

I think that the main cost for most people who aren't retired (or very young with few good employment prospects) turns out to be the opportunity cost of lost earnings.

I agree wholeheartedly.

[wornoutboots]

How many hostels are there on the trail? Just trying to calculate if one was to stay in a hostel vs a hotel when they did go into town. how much they cld potentially save?

[colorado_rob]

Yeah, I hear ya on the opportunity cost thing, and I don’t disagree; I guess that’s why there are so many youngsters (low income) and retiree’s (like me) on these trails. Still, though, “opportunity cost” can be looked at another way, like “life opportunity”, meaning if you are healthy and you do not do the trail, you’re missing an opportunity. Do it now, earn your money later. If you can afford it, of course, which is the main purpose of this thread. I wax, sorry.

[Mags]

I wax, sorry.

Wax away. Why and how to do these hikes is ultimately more important than what gear to bring.

Good discussion.

I had a good run in my 20s and early 30s. As 40 looms, trying to balance the desire of wanting to retire at a decent age but still missing the previous journeys I've done. Quite a bit.

I normally don't plug something we did that costs money, but we had a recent podcast about this. On the show was Buck-30 who is perpetual thru-hiker. He managed to line up a good off-trail housing arrangement and is fortunate enough to work seasonally in a relatively high paying job to fund the other 8-9 months of his year.

In any case, may be worth a listen for some as it is about funding a thru-hike.

[Coffee]

Yeah, I hear ya on the opportunity cost thing, and I don’t disagree; I guess that’s why there are so many youngsters (low income) and retiree’s (like me) on these trails. Still, though, “opportunity cost” can be looked at another way, like “life opportunity”, meaning if you are healthy and you do not do the trail, you’re missing an opportunity. Do it now, earn your money later. If you can afford it, of course, which is the main purpose of this thread. I wax, sorry.

Agree 100% - the opportunity cost is more than outweighed by the experience IMO.

[ratherbclimbin]

I am doing a cheap thru this year and will document all of my expenses . Id like to show people the AT is certainly possible on a shoestring budget.

[4eyedbuzzard]

I have recently discovered the same thing as I make up a budget for my 2015 PCT thru hike. When I'm on the trail, I'm not buying gas, food, and other things that I would normally be buying at home. Also, if I choose to rent out my home for six months, my overall expenses for 2015 will be lower doing the thru hike than they would be otherwise.

I think that the main cost for most people who aren't retired (or very young with few good employment prospects) turns out to be the opportunity cost of lost earnings.

I agree wholeheartedly.

Yeah, I hear ya on the opportunity cost thing, and I don’t disagree; I guess that’s why there are so many youngsters (low income) and retiree’s (like me) on these trails. Still, though, “opportunity cost” can be looked at another way, like “life opportunity”, meaning if you are healthy and you do not do the trail, you’re missing an opportunity. Do it now, earn your money later. If you can afford it, of course, which is the main purpose of this thread. I wax, sorry.

Agree 100% - the opportunity cost is more than outweighed by the experience IMO.

To those who are employed by the nation's largest employer - 2.7 million federal civilian employees and 1.6 million uniformed military - the opportunity cost is almost always too great. One cannot accumulate enough leave to do a thru-hike, and leave without pay for a hike just wouldn't be approved. There is just no way to take off that much time without essentially resigning and creating a break in service. This can have catastrophic implications for getting reinstated in a similar position, and especially on one's retirement which could be forfeited altogether as a result. I am sure there are millions of state and local government employees with similar restrictions, as well as private sector employees who are in the same boat. When the opportunity costs start to add up to many hundreds of thousands of dollars in future lost wages and retirement funds, you prudently resign yourself to section hiking and save thoughts of thru-hiking until retiring.

[followinggrandma]

I'm making the crazy attempt to do it in 120 days and for 2500. Wish me luck haha.

[1234]

I agree faster will be cheaper. Indigo hiked for 3k, she had all her gear and it was years old. 4 pair of boots $$ 100/pair. 1 new tent, $225. It is a lonely to hike cheap, while everyone else goes to town and to a restaurant you are resupplying and heading back out alone. Another cost is medial, you do not plan on getting injured and going to ER but it happens. If you have insurance that is not good nationawide, it COST$$$. Once home, MRI copay, physical therapy $30 copay 3 times a week. Oh by the way a slow hiker will surly keep up with the fastest by hiking cheap. Every 4/5 days they end up at the same place, one hiking 20 mile days and one hiking 10 mile days, one staying in towns a lot and one staying on the trail a lot.

[Buttmonkey]

When the opportunity costs start to add up to many hundreds of thousands of dollars in future lost wages and retirement funds, you prudently resign yourself to section hiking and save thoughts of thru-hiking until retiring.

Yup. That's why I'm tentatively looking at joining the AT thru-hike class of 2037.

[Zep]

Hey guys, I've been creeping these forums for about 4 years or so, and I'm pretty surprised that I've never seen anyone talk about food stamps.
I'm doing 2014 NOBO as cheap as I can, and I'm planning on taking food stamp card w/ me. I know it can be used in multiple states and you can use it practically anywhere that sells food. I've never heard of anyone doing this, but I can't see any reason why not to.
Thoughts?

[horicon]

Do you already have the card???

[capehiker]

Hey guys, I've been creeping these forums for about 4 years or so, and I'm pretty surprised that I've never seen anyone talk about food stamps.
I'm doing 2014 NOBO as cheap as I can, and I'm planning on taking food stamp card w/ me. I know it can be used in multiple states and you can use it practically anywhere that sells food. I've never heard of anyone doing this, but I can't see any reason why not to.
Thoughts?

I think this falls under the umbrella of ethics. Using food stamps and the SNAP program to supplement a hike is not keeping within the spirit of the program. This is for individuals/ families who can barely keep their head above water, not someone choosing to go on a six month hike.