Flat Tarp - size opinions

[litetrek]

I would like to get back to using a tarp for shelter. The reason is to cut some weight from my pack. I currently am using a Big Agnes Seedhouse SL1 tent which is a nice weight (around 2.5 to 3 lbs if I remember right) but its pretty confining. I backpacked with a tarp 30 years ago and always like the open feel of it. Anyhow I've been looking at a 8 x 10 or a 9 x 9 silnylon flat tarp and don't really know which to choose for my purposes. I'm not thru hiking but I might go out for as much as a week at a time once a year and for a couple of nights many times a year. I'm usually hiking with a group but staying in my own shelter. Sometimes (seldom) my wife comes with me and shares the shelter. I know I'll get some comments that both of those are too big for one or two people, but I don't like to get wet, I like plenty of space and I don't like using a bivy. I also like the versatility of a flat tarp. Whatever I get has to be less than half the weight of my tent when the ground cloth and stakes and guy lines are added to the tarp. Cost is really not a big factor BUT anything over $150 would start feeling too expensive. The downside of a flat tarp big enough to suit me is finding a suitable place to pitch it on the AT or most trails in Georgia. So my questions are 1) 8 x 10 or 9 x 9 flat tarp ? 2) Other good roomy lightweight shelter options that weigh around a pound.

[aficion]

I love my 10 x 10. Versatile and roomy for one or two. Light and cheap enough for your requirements, even with added tyouts.

[hauptman]

I often opt for a length of cord and a heat sheets two person emergency blanket set up A-frame style with the edges weighted down with whatever is at hand(rocks/snow/sand/branches/etc...).Quick,simple, and warmer than plain tarp---especially with a fire in front.

[Feral Bill]

I use an 8x10 sylnylon tarp. Roomy for one, workable for two, and light. Before that I used an 8x10 taffeta tarp for many years before handing it down to my daughter. I've been very happy with both. I add a bug net as needed.

[CarlZ993]

This 9.5 X 10 silnylon tarp looks promising. It may replace my 8 X 10 tarp that I've used a few times.
http://www.bearpawwd.com/tents_tarps/tarps.html

[litetrek]

I discovered that tarp too and it got my interest. Those tarps have lots of tie outs as standard and they look well designed and sewn. That particular manufacturer has or had a B- rating from the better business bureau, though. I really don't know what that means and if it is accurate or even up to date. BUT it made me think twice before ordering. That doesn't mean that I wouldn't order from them, but finding that one thing made me decide to look around first. buying sight unseen on the internet requires a certain level of trust.

[Hosaphone]

I've been wanting to replace my 8x10 silnylon tarp with a cuben one for a while, and have been doing tons of research. 8x10 in an A-frame is just an outrageous amount of space for a solo hiker. I thought I had settled on a 7x10, when I read this BPL article: http://www.backpackinglight.com/cgi-...l#.UQyNi_K5yVs

You need to be a member or buy the article for $5. If you're planning to drop $100 on a tarp (or $200 if you go cuben), IMO it'd be worth the 5 bucks to read it. There's a lot of really good info I didn't stumble upon in my research elsewhere. At the very least read the forum companion thread (no need to pay any money to read that).

I bought some 1mil plastic from home depot so I could cut it to size and experiment with many different dimensions. After much research and playing around, I've settled on an 8.5x8.5 tarp. A square tarp with lots of tieouts (the mid-panel pullouts are especially important for creating space inside when it's pitched low) will actually give you more space than a rectangular depending on how you pitch it, and it is more versatile in pitches available to it.

I've only ever used 8x10 in the field so take my advice with a grain of salt. Fortunately you can't really go wrong with either size. 8x10 will get the job done just fine... But after a lot of experimenting I think a square tarp will be better. That's just the conclusion I personally came to. I would encourage you to go to home depot and get a roll of 1mil plastic drop cloth for $5, and do your own experimenting.

[litetrek]

My tarp 30-ish years ago was something similar. My two friends and I hiked up the tree less ridge on the AT going east at Lehigh water gap in the dead of winter and nearly froze. I'll never forget that night. It was way too cold and windy for a tarp on that trip. The next night was in a cozy AT shelter down the trail. We didn't quite make our destination at the Delaware water gap, but we did survive.

[litetrek]

Thanks. I know an 8x10 is really big for one Anything much shorter in the long dimension seems too short to me though because I thrash and move around a lot in my sleep. The research I've done on the internet indicates that 9 feet is the shortest length you can use without a bivy and not get wet. I started my backpacking days in PA, NY, DE and NJ and tarp camped in those places. I now live in GA and the woods here along the AT are very dense in comparison. Sometimes its hard to find a place to put up a tent, let alone an 8 x10 tarp, so I thought I'd get some input. I appreciate your opinions and especially appreciate the good link.

[Hosaphone]

I think 9 feet would be insufficient length for me, or at least it would force me to be careful to the point that I'd rather just have the longer tarp. I'm 6'3 and use a 6'6 bag. Actual length of the bag is a bit longer than that, even. A shorter friend of mine (he's like 5'10 or something) has a 7x9 tarp that he uses without bivy. When pitched in an A-frame, the width is adequate for him but sometimes he needs to cover the foot end of his bag with something to protect it. He says if he could do it again, he'd buy a 7x9.5.

Consider that you won't really ever be pitching a square tarp in a traditional A-frame - you want to take advantage of the long diagonal. An 8.5x8.5 has a 12 foot diagonal, so pitching it in an "A-frame" with the ridgeline across the diagonal can give you a ton of space. You can also do some pretty cool things with low half-pyramid-ish pitches - you can bring the sides down very low, and then use mid-panel pullouts to raise it up inside. The thing that annoys me most about my silnylon 8x10 is that it doesn't have enough of those pullouts, so if you have to pitch it low most of the space under it becomes unusable.

In my experience, it's easier to find a place to pitch a tarp than it is to find a suitable spot for a tent. The tarp "takes up more space", but it doesn't have a footprint. This means you can pitch it right over those tiny little shrubs that are everywhere, and not worry about trampling the vegetation or getting holes poked in the bottom of your tent.

[litetrek]

Is the square shape that much more versatile than the rectangular shape? Also a 10 x 10 is 20 % heavier than an 8 x 10. The 10 x 10 gets you good coverage all around at the expense of 20 % more weight and my main goal is to cut weight. I'm getting older (50+) and heavier and having a lighter pack makes backpacking more enjoyable and doable for me. I'm just trying to nail down which will work best for me. If I can't get the weight down from my current tent by at least 1.5 pounds its not worth it. The issue of finding a place big enough to put it up is something I'll have to decide. GA has dense woods and frequently part of that is poison ivy covered ground - everywhere. You can always keep hiking and find ivy free ground but sometimes its a long ways and when you've hiked all day who wants to do that?

[Hosaphone]

I've never hiked in GA but geeze, if there is poison ivy everywhere maybe a tarptent style shelter would be a better choice (but even then I guess you'd get it on your hands when packing up in the morning?)... Fortunately I don't have any reaction to poison ivy so I can't really comment there.

I think a 10x10 would be waaaaaay too big for a solo hiker, at least for me, in the dense forest of New England. I meant if I was going for a rectangular tarp, I'd want a 7x10 or 8x10. For a square tarp I think 8x8 or 9x9 is about right. 9 probably overkill, but as a tall person 8 might not be quite as luxurious as I'd like.

Realistically, a square tarp is probably not THAT much more versatile unless you just enjoy the challenge of learning and using different pitches. I'll likely end up using just a few different pitches all the time either way. Some pitches work better with a square tarp than with rectangular, though. Also an 8.5x8.5 is 72.25 square feet, whereas 8x10 is 80, so a tiny bit of weight saved.

I think the biggest thing to look for is to make sure you have enough tieouts. Most commercially available silnylon tarps don't have enough, imo. If all you have or all you use is 6 tieouts (2 ridgeline, 4 corners) every single one of those stakes MUST go in just the right spot, and if it isn't perfect you won't be able to get a taut pitch. If you have a bunch of tieouts and mid-panel pullouts, it is much easier to get a taut pitch even when using some weird irregular pitch that you've adapted to the surroundings.

Around ~3:30 in this video gives a good idea of what I was talking about above regarding "half pyramid-ish pitches":



You'll probably be happy with either size... But again I'd recommend going to home depot and picking up something like this: http://www.homedepot.com/h_d1/N-5yc1...1#.UQ1F0_K5yVs

You can make a pretty functional tarp with 1mil plastic. To make tieouts wherever you want, put a piece of duct tape on both sides of the plastic and then poke a hole through it with something. Probably wouldn't hold up too long on the trail, but it works well enough that you can play around with pitching it, different places for tieouts, etc, and figure out exactly what you want in a tarp.

[BirdBrain]

I prefer a square tarp. 10'x10' can be a bit heavy and expensive, but very versatile. I made my own from syl-nylon material bought at Wal*Mart. They have partial bolts sold at various times for next to nothing. The material I bought cost about $10 total and I still have some left over.

[Alligator]

I had an 8X10 silnylon. I made my own cuben, square tarp which is a little over 10 feet on each side. It's large but weighs about 9 oz. It's definitely large for one person but the weight difference was negligible to me. At 6'2', I too would not have considered anything less than 9' square as I wanted a square one. I will probably add two pullouts off the edges to better handle a pyramid pitch as it is oversize and the slope is a bit shallow.

You can fit two in sizes upwards from 8X10 IMO.

[Tinker]

A tapered tarp might be an option, too. This one's not quite flat

http://www.bearpawwd.com/tents_tarps/lagarita.html

but is probably quite versatile. It's similar to the tapered SpinnTwinn that Gossamer Gear used to make (and I own), but it has front closure tabs, very worthwhile, imo, when the wind gets real nasty. The ridgeline on my SpinTwinn is catenary cut, so it sheds wind a bit better when pitched as an A-frame (over my hammock, mostly), but it limits the versatility. The La Garita (Garage in Spanish, I guess) is not catenary cut, so it could be more esily deployed in more configurations.

[litetrek]

thanks everyone for the help and info. I' kind of a gear nut and looking at the options and all the available gear is almost as much fun for me as actually buying and using the stuff. has anyone bought from bear paw wilderness designs? They seem to have nice tarps? oware has nice tarps also but they are a little more expensive. I can sew and IF I could get cheap silnylon here at the Walmart it might be worth the effort. All the Walmarts near me got rid of fabric a few years ago. they also shrunk the sporting goods area to the point of being almost useless. Everyone once in a while I used to get some fairly good gear there for cheap. ,.... I'm known for being frugal.

[Hosaphone]

I've heard only good things about Bearpaw. Another custom option is Borah gear - http://www.borahgear.com/tarps.html I have a borah bivy and it's solid, but I can't speak to their tarps. I would think it can't be too difficult to sew a tarp, though...

Probably tough to go wrong. Just make sure you get something with panel pullouts and tie-out loops instead of grommets.

[litetrek]

Bearpaw has some pretty negative posts online about them and they have (or once had) a b- from the better business bureau. Most of it was service related. Thats why I asked. I'll check out borahgear... I didn't know about them. I like the looks of bearpaw's gear and their prices. I'm just a little hesitant because of some of the stuff I found.

[Hosaphone]

Bearpaw has some pretty negative posts online about them and they have (or once had) a b- from the better business bureau. Most of it was service related. Thats why I asked. I'll check out borahgear... I didn't know about them. I like the looks of bearpaw's gear and their prices. I'm just a little hesitant because of some of the stuff I found.

Ah... I haven't heard a lot about them, but a friend bought a shelter from them and had no complaints about service or craftsmanship. I haven't done tons of research so I dunno, but I've always thought they were pretty well respected.

[litetrek]

Well, I too was impressed with what bearpaw has to sell. I suspect making custom gear could set you up for complaints or dissatisfaction due to possible communication problems. Custom usually means you have to keep it and pay for it even if its not what you expected.