Survival Camping

[Rag-Tag Jack]

I'm planning on doing a thru-hike from Georgia to Maine this coming summer. I know there are campsites and official places to camp. But Can I free camp?

Is it illegal to camp off the trail? I want to do a survival style camping situation without using modern convinces such as campgrounds. I plan on bringing emergency supplies such as personal medic kits and reserve M.R.E's.

But is it Illegal to do this? Do I have to camp in designated areas or do I only have to avoid areas where it is posted that I am not allowed to camp?

[Mags]

First, not sure what you mean by "survival" camps. Do you plan on using primitive skills ala Tom Brown? Making base camp with a fire? Hunting/gathering? I'm not being sarcastic..just honestly curious as to what your definition of survival camping may be.


Having said that...

There are often spots for camping near the shelters (but not always). In many places along the trail, there are great flat spots to get away from the crowded shelters and offer great views in addition to solitude.

In some places such as New Hampshire and Vermont, fragile and/or high use areas are pay sites. Areas near the sites may have restricted camping.

The AT databook will often list good campsites that are not at shelters as an FYI. The various guidebooks will list which sites are pay sites.


As for MREs. You may want to think of different food. MREs area bit heavy, kind of expensive and bulky. The military uses them for their soldiers..but the soldiers are using motorized transport for carrying the meals! When the military has their soldiers hoof it over long distances, they use meals not far different from commercial backpacker meals.
http://www.wornick.com/military/MCWLRP.html
http://www.dscp.dla.mil/subs/rations...mcw/mcwabt.asp

Your local grocery store will have light, inexpensive and decent food more suitable for backpacking vs. an MRE.

[beakerman]

MRE's pack a big calorie punch (somehting like 1100 to 1500 each if I recall correctly) but are truely heavy...even I don't carry them and I am not anything like UL. They are fine for short hauls but as a "back-up" you will be humping them most of the way--assuming you don't eat them right away and you replace tehm when you do eat them. That is a large weight penatly. Just my opinion of MRE's.

i haven't done a thru yet on the AT but I'm sure someone else will be along to answer your camping question. My understanding is there are a few sections that are regulated when it comes to camping but I defere to others with more AT miles....

[beakerman]

dang it mags you hit post before me....

[Rag-Tag Jack]

First, not sure what you mean by "survival" camps. Do you plan on using primitive skills ala Tom Brown? Making base camp with a fire? Hunting/gathering? I'm not being sarcastic..just honestly curious as to what your definition of survival camping may be.


Having said that...

There are often spots for camping near the shelters (but not always). In many places along the trail, there are great flat spots to get away from the crowded shelters and offer great views in addition to solitude.

In some places such as New Hampshire and Vermont, fragile and/or high use areas are pay sites. Areas near the sites may have restricted camping.

The AT databook will often list good campsites that are not at shelters as an FYI. The various guidebooks will list which sites are pay sites.


As for MREs. You may want to think of different food. MREs area bit heavy, kind of expensive and bulky. The military uses them for their soldiers..but the soldiers are using motorized transport for carrying the meals! When the military has their soldiers hoof it over long distances, they use meals not far different from commercial backpacker meals.
http://www.wornick.com/military/MCWLRP.html
http://www.dscp.dla.mil/subs/rations...mcw/mcwabt.asp

Your local grocery store will have light, inexpensive and decent food more suitable for backpacking vs. an MRE.

Yes. I plan on pretty much living off the land by primitive skills. Thanks for the update on MREs. I knew they were big but I didn't know what options I had. As far as the price, my uncle sells them and would give me a huge discount.

I pretty much plan on using basic equipment, such as an A-frame and a sleeping bag, so doing this in a campsite would defeat the purpose. Solitude is a must. As far as hunting/gathering goes I plan on using edible plants, eating snakes and squirrels and fish. I plan to fish using the survival knife spear method.

Pretty much the whole point of this is to survive in natural manner without the aid of modern tech if i can help it.

[Mags]

Yes. I plan on pretty much living off the land by primitive skills.

In a heavily used area like most (if not all) the AT corridor, you may find this method to not work too well.

You may want to check out this thread:
http://www.whiteblaze.net/forum/show...ht=living+land

[Mags]

dang it mags you hit post before me....

Too many copy and paste posts over the years.

(I gleefully admit to recycling my posts/articles/whatever over and over again. )

/Hike turned into a trail run..damn, I feel good...

[Dogwood]

Can you explain what you mean by "survival camping?"

You can camp for no money amost all the way. In parts of the White Mountains you are required to stay at designated sites for a fee. Yes, there MAY BE WAYS to stay at SOME of these sites if you do a work-for-stay, BUT let me communicate in no uncertain terms this IS NOT GUARANTEED. Camping in non-designated camping sites in some areas, and not just in the White Mountains, is both illegal, and yes, these areas are patrolled, some vigorously so, and gives ALL hikers and the hiking community a bad rap when you are caught. I get the feeling that you don't want to hear this and are not going to accept this reasoning, but if you are intending to hike 2200 miles through the woods over the mountains in 14 states you should have sufficient funds set aside for thru-hiking. There are many threads and well written articles here at WB that go into great detail about how much a thru-hike costs. Even though there are many different ways to hike or how much to spend I strongly suggest that it's necessary that you read these threads and articles and prepare for your hike. There will be many new things you will learn that you have not yet thought of.

Not saying you are in either one of these groups, but I ocassionaly come across a homeless person or one who wishes to hike ala Survivalist Style(basically meaning living off the land so to speak, I call it being a hobo, usually this style is ignorantly adopted after glancing through a survivalist oriented book or made for Hollywood TV show). After a very short time, when the romance of adventure begins to wear off, they come to the realization that living this way for 2220 miles through the woods is much harder than they ever thought and were not prepared for in the first place, no matter what style or method they originally adopted or intended!

[Rag-Tag Jack]

In a heavily used area like most (if not all) the AT corridor, you may find this method to not work too well.

You may want to check out this thread:
http://www.whiteblaze.net/forum/show...ht=living+land

Actually after reading the thread it seems not only possible to do this but also live this way. I've often thought of working seasonally and living wild in the summers. The hunter/gatherer part may be hard, but that depends on knowledge and experience i think. And I wouldn't do this on the trail. I have experience in orienteering. I would periodically leave the trail to collect food in the wilderness and camp.

[Rag-Tag Jack]

Can you explain what you mean by "survival camping?"

You can camp for no money amost all the way. In parts of the White Mountains you are required to stay at designated sites for a fee. Yes, there MAY BE WAYS to stay at SOME of these sites if you do a work-for-stay, BUT let me communicate in no uncertain terms this IS NOT GUARANTEED. Camping in non-designated camping sites in some areas, and not just in the White Mountains, is both illegal, and yes, these areas are patrolled, some vigorously so, and gives ALL hikers and the hiking community a bad rap when you are caught. I get the feeling that you don't want to hear this and are not going to accept this reasoning, but if you are intending to hike 2200 miles through the woods over the mountains in 14 states you should have sufficient funds set aside for thru-hiking. There are many threads and well written articles here at WB that go into great detail about how much a thru-hike costs. Even though there are many different ways to hike or how much to spend I strongly suggest that it's necessary that you read these threads and articles and prepare for your hike. There will be many new things you will learn that you have not yet thought of.

Not saying you are in either one of these groups, but I ocassionaly come across a homeless person or one who wishes to hike ala Survivalist Style(basically meaning living off the land so to speak, I call it being a hobo, usually this style is ignorantly adopted after glancing through a survivalist oriented book or made for Hollywood TV show). After a very short time, when the romance of adventure begins to wear off, they come to the realization that living this way for 2220 miles through the woods is much harder than they ever thought and were not prepared for in the first place, no matter what style or method they originally adopted or intended!

I guess I'll have to read up more on which parks and areas prohibit camping off site. As far as the hobo thing goes, I just plan on doing this for the summer with sufficent funds for emergencies or if i switch up my camping style. And I know what you mean. I was inspired by "Into the Wild" to hitchike cross country and i did it very succesfully. But I learned the importance of social responsibility as well. I would love to live wild in off seasons. But I do intend on getting my college education and getting a career.

[Mags]

Actually after reading the thread it seems not only possible to do this but also live this way. I've often thought of working seasonally and living wild in the summers. The hunter/gatherer part may be hard, but that depends on knowledge and experience i think. And I wouldn't do this on the trail. I have experience in orienteering. I would periodically leave the trail to collect food in the wilderness and camp.

You may be surprised.

If you want to be a hunter/gatherer (nevermind the legal issues in the AT corridor) there are probably easier areas to do it in than the AT area.

Good luck with whatever you decide to do...

[Rag-Tag Jack]

You may be surprised.

If you want to be a hunter/gatherer (nevermind the legal issues in the AT corridor) there are probably easier areas to do it in than the AT area.

Good luck with whatever you decide to do...

Thank you. But I want the best of both worlds. and it will be nice to run into other hikers. Maybe I'll even meet you Mags. that would be interesting as you seem to have a lot of knowledge. If you see a scruffy, brown hair, blue eyed kid going by the name of Jack Sage, it'll be me. And yeah, that's not my real name. But I use it online and when I talk to people I haven't known longer than five days.

[Mags]

People who know me well say I am full of something. Knowledge ain't it....

[simon]

I always wonder the persons age when they talk about "surviving" off the land. Maybe i'm old,lol.

[Ranc0r]

The AT corridor is heavily populated, sparsely wooded, and generally a thin strip of nature in the midst of cities and towns. Of course you can go off-grid. But the big game that makes off-grid living a real possibility has long been hunted to near extinction, especially along this corridor. Seems to me you're either situated and hunting an area in which you are living, or you are hiking through an area, and there really isn't time for laying snares, pulling them up when you move, and taking proper care of the the higher placeholders of the food chain. And who wants to be a daisy or a woodchuck, when there's bear, moose and serious bucks in the area?

HYOH, but bring yer own pre-dead food items, unless you are staying to smoke them and take them with you, albeit slowly.

Ranc0r
.

[Chip]

FYI
When hiking thru the Great Smokies you will have to camp at designated shelters or campsites. Hikers who hike off any trail in the Smokies must obtain a special cross-country permit, available only from designated park rangers. A person really needs to know what he or she is doing to obtain this type of permit and file a hike plan with the rangers. For further info contact the GSMNP backcountry office (865) 436-1231.
Off trail would be bushwhacking on not on the AT.
Happy Trails,
Chip

[Chip]

Sorry for the typo.
Bushwhacking would be off the trail and not on the AT.

[Wise Old Owl]

After watching Bear Grills & Les Stroud and Ray Meyers for a couple of years and reading several books on the subject, if you can hike the trail and avoid yog'ing & dumpster diving I wish you a lot of luck. Even Les got tired of starving himself during the shows. I am not saying it isn't possible - just terribly impractical.

Simple idea-gee Indians lived here for 100 of thousand years, but they had something different going on. They had a community where everyone had different tasks, but as a group they had survival. Gathering nuts, honey, fruits, and occasionally fresh meat, while others plant or sew corn seeds to reap the benefit in the long term. There was time because they were not on the move. They only moved when they ran out of food or other resources.

Recent discoveries in science discovered people came to this continent not so much by a land bridge, but by traveling by boat and farming rich sea life by kelp beds just off the coast. With that in mind I find fault with the whole idea of survival while hiking. Partially because you will be burning far more calories than you can take time to gather.

[Dogwood]

Rag Tag Jack, great you talk about wanting to live off the land, you know the importance of social responsibility, and you want to go to college. All sounds admirable. I really wish you well with your pursuits, but, when you also make statements like: "as far as hunting/gathering goes I plan on using edible plants, eating snakes and squirrels and fish. I plan to fish using the survival knife spear method"
and " I just plan on doing this for the summer with sufficent funds for emergencies or if i switch up my camping style" and "but I learned the importance of social responsibility as well. I would love to live wild in off seasons" it clues me in to your current lack of what this will take and your lack of knowledge about what you will encounter along the AT. It makes me think even more about what else you are not telling us or what other things you are not aware of. Despite the AT often being touted as a journey through the wilderness, like RancOr stated, it maybe something a lot different than you are expecting. It might not be the best place to practice true survivalist skills or the idea of "living wild off the land." If you are going to spend time hunting and fishing for your survival on the AT and you also plan to thru-hike do you really expect to include all these activities and also have enough time to make it to Mt Katahdin in one summer? Seems like your schedule isn't going to allow for all the time it takes to both thru-hike and live a hunter-gatherer lifestyle. Have you considered the financial costs and legal ramifications of purchasing all the fishing and hunting licenses you will need to be legal and "socially responsible" in 14 states?" Do you understand or plan to get informed about all the fishing, hunting, and trapping laws in all the different states in which you plan to take game? For example, if you plan to spear fish are you aware that some states don't allow it or don't allow spearing of some species? Do you understand there are some areas like National Parks, Shenendoah and Great Smokey Mountains for examples, where you will not be allowed to hunt and spearing of fish may not be allowed? And, if you do know it have you planned on finding other ways to survive legally? Do you also know some areas like NPs prohibit the destruction of plants? Do you also comprehend that separate permits may be required to hike cross country or that you may impact private property near the AT corridor or that you will not be able to trespass into some areas near the AT corridor, thereby limiting a hunting-gathering lifetyle in some areas. Are you prepared to fully recognize which areas are legal to hunt, gather, and fish upon? Do you understand the impact you will have on humans(both hikers and non-hikers), flora, and fauna if you intend to live a hunter-gatherer lifestyle on the AT?

[TD55]

The AT is a hiking trail. It is not designed to be a trail for "living off the land". When people leave the corridor they are often tresspassing on private property. Gathering edible plants on private property is theft. Gathering on public property such as state game lands. NPS lands, NF lands etc. is also often illegal. Gathering in the corridor is selfish and damages the trail. It's one thing to collect a small amount of edibles to flavor or suppplement, it's another to pick every edible plant or berrie in sight so that there is nothing left for the next person, or for regrowth to occur.
There is an unlimited number of great places where a person can experiment with the "survive off the land" thing. Attemping it on the AT is a dumb ass idea and indicates a total lack of understanding of wilderness survival and the AT.