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  1. #101

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    Quote Originally Posted by Frolicking Dinosaurs View Post
    I'm very surprised to hear RJ would be hiking on the AT. It is considered a very easy trail by most serious long-distance trekkers (many call it the 'bunny slope' of long-distance hiking). I can't imagine why a trekker with the stamina and experience of RJ would even consider hiking something as easy as the AT again with all the more challenging and more beautiful trails available. Maybe he is rehabbing some sort of injury or needs to stay close to civilization to stay in touch with Jenny.
    you might be closer to towns and such,but the terrain on the A.T. is tougher than those other trails you talk about. read the A.T. VS the PCT. THREAD AND ALL THE HIKERS WHO HIKED THE PCT, SAID THE A.T. WAS MORE OF A PHYSICAL CHALLENGE!

  2. #102
    Getting out as much as I can..which is never enough. :) Mags's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by F Dino View Post
    It is considered a very easy trail by most serious long-distance trekkers (many call it the 'bunny slope' of long-distance hiking).

    Quote Originally Posted by CrumbSnatcher View Post
    you might be closer to towns and such,but the terrain on the A.T. is tougher than those other trails you talk about. read the A.T. VS the PCT. THREAD AND ALL THE HIKERS WHO HIKED THE PCT, SAID THE A.T. WAS MORE OF A PHYSICAL CHALLENGE!

    I don't know if I'm a "serious" long distance trekker, but I (and many of my fellow hiker trash friends..perhaps not so serious as well) would never think of it as the bunny slope of long distance hiking. 2175 miles through mountains, all kinds of weather, some of the steepest terrain I have ever hiked (Whites, Mahoosucs) and so on hardly makes it an easy trail. It is easier (in some ways) than the PCT, but again, hardly easy.

    Now about about that old nugget of the AT being harder physically than the PCT, again, I think the AT is perceived as being more difficult physically because (for the most part) many people new to long distance hiking will hike the AT as their first trail.

    For a variety reasons (lack of experience, generally heavier gear, not in the best physical or mental shape for long distance hiking), the first trail is often perceived as the most difficult.

    There are indeed short, steep climbs on the AT....but nothing that bad (again, northern New England being the very big exception). When I did the BMT, the grades were generally not too bad for this non-serious long distance trekker. I suspect if it was my first trail, I would think very differently!


    I was not beat up as much on the PCT as I was on the AT, but my base packweight was less than half of what I took on the AT, I weighed less when I started the PCT and I was in better shape overall for the start.

    Looking for a "bunny slope" of a long distance trail? Do the Tahoe Rim Trail. Short enough to do in a two week vacation, easy logistics, easy tread over all.


    Some people hike the AT again (or the East in general) because there is a certain beauty that is not just found out West. I loved my time on the BMT. I did not get the vast views of my current home....but I did not expect it. I went for the hardwoods, the tunnels of rhodos, moss covered logs in a blanket of fog and that wonderful smell of leaves on a sunny day.

    In this pointless debate of "Which trail is harder"..well, it is jsut that...pointless.

    I prefer to hike the trails for their unique beauty and the experience each offers. I've leave the idea of which trail is harder to the mucho macho hotdogs who care for such a concept.
    Paul "Mags" Magnanti
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  3. #103

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    Quote Originally Posted by Mags View Post
    I don't know if I'm a "serious" long distance trekker, but I (and many of my fellow hiker trash friends..perhaps not so serious as well) would never think of it as the bunny slope of long distance hiking. 2175 miles through mountains, all kinds of weather, some of the steepest terrain I have ever hiked (Whites, Mahoosucs) and so on hardly makes it an easy trail. It is easier (in some ways) than the PCT, but again, hardly easy.

    Now about about that old nugget of the AT being harder physically than the PCT, again, I think the AT is perceived as being more difficult physically because (for the most part) many people new to long distance hiking will hike the AT as their first trail.

    For a variety reasons (lack of experience, generally heavier gear, not in the best physical or mental shape for long distance hiking), the first trail is often perceived as the most difficult.

    There are indeed short, steep climbs on the AT....but nothing that bad (again, northern New England being the very big exception). When I did the BMT, the grades were generally not too bad for this non-serious long distance trekker. I suspect if it was my first trail, I would think very differently!


    I was not beat up as much on the PCT as I was on the AT, but my base packweight was less than half of what I took on the AT, I weighed less when I started the PCT and I was in better shape overall for the start.

    Looking for a "bunny slope" of a long distance trail? Do the Tahoe Rim Trail. Short enough to do in a two week vacation, easy logistics, easy tread over all.


    Some people hike the AT again (or the East in general) because there is a certain beauty that is not just found out West. I loved my time on the BMT. I did not get the vast views of my current home....but I did not expect it. I went for the hardwoods, the tunnels of rhodos, moss covered logs in a blanket of fog and that wonderful smell of leaves on a sunny day.

    In this pointless debate of "Which trail is harder"..well, it is jsut that...pointless.

    I prefer to hike the trails for their unique beauty and the experience each offers. I've leave the idea of which trail is harder to the mucho macho hotdogs who care for such a concept.
    mags i agree with what your saying , i just found it funny she said it was a cake walk (THE A.T.), somedays yes not NOT always! she said it like she's never hiked any of the hard parts of the trail(A.T.)?

  4. #104
    Registered User Frolicking Dinosaurs's Avatar
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    Mags, you are certainly a serious long-distance hiker - one of the very few found on this site. I agree completely with what you said - especially the part on the beauty of each trail and the pointlessness of fussing over what trail is hardest. Will file away the info about the Tahoe Rim trail for when I'm out west. Thanks.

    CrumbSnatcher, I really wouldn't take what is said on a thread on this site about the PCT vrs the AT to be the overall opinion of really serious long-distance hikers. There are just too few of them posting here to make a judgment.

    I should have known better than to post on this site - somebody will try to pick a fight with you every time.

  5. #105

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    Quote Originally Posted by Frolicking Dinosaurs View Post
    Mags, you are certainly a serious long-distance hiker - one of the very few found on this site. I agree completely with what you said - especially the part on the beauty of each trail and the pointlessness of fussing over what trail is hardest. Will file away the info about the Tahoe Rim trail for when I'm out west. Thanks.

    CrumbSnatcher, I really wouldn't take what is said on a thread on this site about the PCT vrs the AT to be the overall opinion of really serious long-distance hikers. There are just too few of them posting here to make a judgment.

    I should have known better than to post on this site - somebody will try to pick a fight with you every time.
    i haven't been on this site that long, i don't pick fights! im grown up.IMO you made the A.T. sound less important.you don't go out and hike in MAINE OR NEW HAMPSHIRE to rehab an old injury! MAGS even said he wouldn't call it a bunny slope! i take hiking serious too! next month i will have 4 completions of the A.T. its a big part of my life. and i hope my daughter will enjoy hiking someday soon too. have you hiked the hard parts of the trail ?

  6. #106

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    i do take what was said In the A.T. VRS the PCT thread serious! people like MAGS,A-TRAIN ,NEAN,JESTER and a few others said the A.T. could be and was more physically tougher at times,and and can beat you up now and then. as i know to be true. so i think i could take that to the bank! and no i don't believe everything said here on the net,i know how to seperate the bull! i know both trails are different in alot of ways. i wouldn't say either one was easy, not when you hike for 4-6 months.

  7. #107

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    I agree with Mags. I don't like a lot of his ideas but there is no way you can deny what Ray Jardine did.

    He also revolutionized trad climbing with the friend.

  8. #108
    Registered User Wolf - 23000's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by High Altitude View Post
    I agree with Mags. I don't like a lot of his ideas but there is no way you can deny what Ray Jardine did.

    He also revolutionized trad climbing with the friend.
    He didn't do crap besides write a book just like many other hikers have done. It wasn't even a very good one either - neither one of us like his ideas. It strange, that so many people will agree he didn't have the greatest ideas but yet they still want to give him credit for lightweight backpacking and yet he didn't even travel all that light himself.

    I personal found his book next you useless other then the town information in the back which is why I bought the book in the first place.

  9. #109
    Registered User Wolf - 23000's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Frolicking Dinosaurs View Post
    I'm very surprised to hear RJ would be hiking on the AT. It is considered a very easy trail by most serious long-distance trekkers (many call it the 'bunny slope' of long-distance hiking). I can't imagine why a trekker with the stamina and experience of RJ would even consider hiking something as easy as the AT again with all the more challenging and more beautiful trails available. Maybe he is rehabbing some sort of injury or needs to stay close to civilization to stay in touch with Jenny.
    Frolicking Dinosaurs,

    As a hiker who has done the AT more than once, I can understand why someone like RJ would still want to do the AT. Outside of hiking the AT in the winter, a normal thru-hike really is not that hard for a seasonal hiker but yet it is still a nice walk in the park. It nice to run into other serious hikers, or even see hikers just starting off. The AT can also be a simple mindless walk needed to clear your head. What ever the reason, the AT can still be very enjoyable regaurdless of how many miles you have walked.

    Wolf

  10. #110
    Henry birdog's Avatar
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    I know that Ray was not the first to promote the lightweight revolution but it is almost certain that he was one of the first to take on the large backpacking companies and call them out on the carpet for promoting heavy, overbuilt, and ultra-expensive gear that 99% of us dont need. Everest is real and the dangers are real but honestly, how many of us get the chance to find out first hand? Just like most large companies tell us that we need certain equipment to be safe and comfortable, we really can do with less; a lot less.
    Birdog

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  11. #111

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    I'm with Wolf-23000, Ray Jardine is the worst hiker of all time and quite possibly the cause of global warming, swine flu and Lindsay Lohan.
    Yahtzee

  12. #112
    Registered User Wolf - 23000's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by birdog View Post
    I know that Ray was not the first to promote the lightweight revolution but it is almost certain that he was one of the first to take on the large backpacking companies and call them out on the carpet for promoting heavy, overbuilt, and ultra-expensive gear that 99% of us dont need. Everest is real and the dangers are real but honestly, how many of us get the chance to find out first hand? Just like most large companies tell us that we need certain equipment to be safe and comfortable, we really can do with less; a lot less.
    birdog,

    Who fault is it if someone buys a heavy, overbuilt, and ultra-expensive piece of gear - the person who is selling it or the person who is buying it? I donít think anyone put a gun to a hikers head and said you must buy this gear over a more reasonable price piece of equipment that did the same job.

    The equipment to travel lightweight or ultra lightweight was also offered too during the 1990ís. An average hiker could have bought all his gear and travel just as light weight or lighter than Jardine for about the same amount of money. Jardine also to make his equipment spent nearly 40 hours doing it. To someone who is not working, spending 40 hours to make your own gear may not mean much. If your most hard working average American worker that same 40 hours equals to about a weeks of your pay that was spent making gear that has no warrantee, nothing backing it up.

    Wolf

  13. #113
    Registered User Wolf - 23000's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Yahtzee View Post
    I'm with Wolf-23000, Ray Jardine is the worst hiker of all time and quite possibly the cause of global warming, swine flu and Lindsay Lohan.
    Yahtzee,

    I never said Jardine was the worst hiker of all time but I do think he should have written his book better.

    Wolf

  14. #114

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    It doesn't matter if his ideas where good/bad, original or not. Ray's book let lots of people know about his ideas of carrying less, lighter weight gear, quilts, tarps, make your own gear, umbrellas, running shoes vs boots, stealth camping etc....

    What this did is spark an entire community of backpackers to start looking at new ways to do things. Whether his ideas are original or not doesn't make any difference. It is not his ideas but the affect his book had on a lot of people that is important.

    Ray's book was definitely a turning point in backpacking history with respect to the masses thinking about going ultralight or using other types of gear or techniques compared to the norm.

    So many backpackers gained interest in changing their ways from the standard 50lb pack with full grain leather boots because of that book. Websites and forums about ultralight weight backpacking where started because of that book.

    Terrible ideas or not he opened up the eyes of a LOT or people. This is his accomplishment, not his ideas themselves. Although I will say more people started to carry tarps or make their own gear because of his book.



















    Quote Originally Posted by Wolf - 23000 View Post
    He didn't do crap besides write a book just like many other hikers have done. It wasn't even a very good one either - neither one of us like his ideas. It strange, that so many people will agree he didn't have the greatest ideas but yet they still want to give him credit for lightweight backpacking and yet he didn't even travel all that light himself.

    I personal found his book next you useless other then the town information in the back which is why I bought the book in the first place.

  15. #115
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    Had Ray taken another 2-3 years before he published his first PCT book, he would have never been given "credit" as the same knowledge would have spread on the new and improved Internet (thanks to Al Gore ).

    The reason he is often given credit for expanding the popularity of lightweight hiking is because he wrote his ideas down. In our world, the written form get's "credit" well before the any type of oral communication, just ask the patent office.

    Regarding alcohol stoves, Ray never even talks about them in any of his books, except for the most recent version of his book (in which he makes just a passing reference). He is a proponent of cook fires. I also found his most recent edition significantly more humble and "tolerable" (he actually says a few nice words about trekking poles!!!!) than any of the previous versions (I've read all three, PCT, BB, and TL) and it seems to contain significantly less of the "wackiness" that was found in the earlier versions ("If I think hard, the mosquitoes will leave me alone!"). In short, the current editions is what BB should have been once he removed all of the PCT specific stuff that was in the earliest versions.
    Yellow Jacket -- Words of Wisdom (tm) go here.

  16. #116
    Registered User English Stu's Avatar
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    His Beyond Backpacking book worked for me, yes there are some personal ideas in it but I put that down to his style of writing and a publisher not up in the subject to challenge some of the statements .Encouraged by Bill Brysons book I wanted to experience the AT and never had any heavy gear so with RJ's book it gave great advice and I started off light
    Gear has moved on now.I have now retired my Golite Breeze and Tarp in favour of a ULA Conduit and Henry Shires Tarptent but I will be forever grateful to RJ's book.
    From a Brits point of view I was unaware of the other people being mentioned so his book spread the going light idea over here,and I would guess to other Europeans and Antipodeans as well.

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    Good comment, Stu.

    Especially the last bit. Wonder how many thousands of Whiteblaze folks had to go look up the definition of "Antipodean".

  18. #118
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jack Tarlin View Post
    Good comment, Stu.

    Especially the last bit. Wonder how many thousands of Whiteblaze folks had to go look up the definition of "Antipodean".
    We ain't gotta look it up. That rascist bastage hates Podeans.

  19. #119
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    Back on-topic, RJ finished his NoBo thru-hike a couple days ago.
    Yellow Jacket -- Words of Wisdom (tm) go here.

  20. #120
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jack Tarlin View Post
    Good comment, Stu.

    Especially the last bit. Wonder how many thousands of Whiteblaze folks had to go look up the definition of "Antipodean".
    That would be a +1 here.
    Midway Sam
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