After reading this thread, me thinks perhaps a thread is needed on commom trail ethics and manners. Burning crap paper at a fire pit!!! Are you kidding me?
After reading this thread, me thinks perhaps a thread is needed on commom trail ethics and manners. Burning crap paper at a fire pit!!! Are you kidding me?
Oh, ya, finding justification for stealing. It's not the monetary value of the toilet paper being stolen that is important, it's just stealing. I remember an old saying, "if a person will steal a buck, they'll steal ten of 'em". Even most thieves live by some minimum codes. They try not to steal from family and friends, not unless they are maybe H-junkies or crack heads. Folks along the trail that provide services to hikers should be treated like family.
If I'm more diligent with the paper usage in the stall, then I feel that the 8-10 sheets I saved would be be alright.
So, is it stealing if you wad up a big ol' pile of TP and waste half a role on one dump. I've come into a crapper after this has been done, and if I owned an establishment, I'd rather just lose a few sheets of my bulk TP rather than deal with a clogged toilet.
Also, the TP in the hotel room is paid for with the room. End of story.
Like I said, "..finding justification for stealing." No one cares about 8 or 10 sheets of crap paper, unless 15 hikers come into your establishment one morning and each one takes 8 or 10 or a handful and you learn about it when another customer tells you your restroom is out of paper, so you have to stop what you are doing to restock the bathroom. When it becomes a routine you may start to get a negative attitude towards the inconciderate hikers.
If you wad up a big pile of TP and clog up the crapper, that would not be theft, that would be either vandalism or just being a not so nice person.
It's everyones own business as far as the definition of theft I suppose. For me, if I didn't pay for it, or if the owner doesn't know I am taking something, it's theft. Would you have the strenth of character to inform someone that you were taking some extra TP for some silly reason. Doesn't it sound kind of dumb. Would you ask the hotel clerk if you can take "leftover" TP after your stay?
I'm far more interested in what happens to the TP once it get's onto the trail. The trail has been degraded over the years by the lack of actual backpacking and hiking skills, ethics and behavior of hikers.
So, if the paper is flushed at the establishment is it stealing? What if I returned the paper to its original bathroom after trail use and flushed it?
The bathroom is a free service. If you're gonna jack a roll of TP, thats abusing the system, using the term theft is just a way to guilt people (and stealing a roll is a jerk thing to do).
But the whole argument about being out of TP and that being an inconvenience for the clerk, doesn't that happen to TP, or has Georgia Pacific come up with a new finding that I am currently unaware of (regenerating TP). How does one tell if the TP was stolen? What if someone got the runs from filtering their water and used all the TP? What if I don't buy anything at the store and I use the restroom, is that stealing? If I am hiking in TX and I drink water out of a stream, am I stealing (technically yes by Texas water law, since I am using water w/o having water rights)?
Just think about it :
Gee people, buy a roll for under a dollar and if don't want to (or can't) carry all that weight, take what you want and give the rest to someone else or leave it in the hiker box or donate it to the hostel where you're staying.
I was in one town and the grocery store didn't have single rolls so the lady at the laundromat sold me one when I asked. I let her name the price and she said $0.50.
TP and TB- trash talkin!! Ah ha ha!!