Exploding Stoves Etc.

[rafe]

thats the catch though, "if used properly and properly maintained" lol. Any advice for me on the proper maintenance....and um well the use is done by instinct soooo....any tips there are welcome too!

Whisperlite usage? Prime it. Let the primer flame die out completely. Then open the valve and light the sucker. If it's been primed properly, you will hear a hiss of gas when you open the valve. That means it's good to go. Act quickly between the end of the priming and the lighting of the stove, but make sure the sound you hear is the hiss of gas.

If it hasn't been primed properly, you'll get liquid gas, which is no good. In that case: close the valve, re-prime, and try again. The main cause of clogging is trying to use the stove without a good prime.

If the stove acts balky, use a strand of wire (or the tool from the maintenance kit) to clean out the jet. With the newer "shaker" models you clean the jet simply from shaking the stove properly. Don't over-pump the thing. It really doesn't need much pumping, at all.

[sweetpeastu]

thanks for the advice! I think when I have issues it comes from lack of good timing with the priming. Sometimes it works fine, other times I get too much gas in the little ....pan or whatever and then I have to wait forever for the flame to die down...etc. I should prolly just use it more. lol.

[rafe]

thanks for the advice! I think when I have issues it comes from lack of good timing with the priming. Sometimes it works fine, other times I get too much gas in the little ....pan or whatever and then I have to wait forever for the flame to die down...etc. I should prolly just use it more. lol.

Yeah, you need to be consistent with the priming. Always let the priming flame die out completely before trying to light it "normal" mode. Act quickly between the end of priming and lighting the stove. Listen for that hiss.

You might also just lay down a couple of sheets of newspaper on a table, and disassemble the stove just for kicks. The burner unit, not necessarily the pump. I'm quite serious. It's a good exercise, and may make you feel more comfortable with the stove. It's dead simple. Anyway, that's what an engineer would do.

[fonsie]

Yea I had a pepsi stove blow up.....Now I own a Vargo titanium alchohul stove. Yea and it has'nt blown up yet, and it weighs less than a ounce.

[bubba295]

I have never had a Pepsi Stove blow up.....and I hope I don't. I don't use the pressurized type though.

[oldcoot]

I own, and have owned, for more than a few years, with no problems, a very dependable whisperlight internationale. That being said, there are two very rare failure points on the whisperlights. If the stove is more than a year or so old and has the second generation pump on it, it can fail at the point where the pump handle fastens into the rest of the pump. Fatigue and/or over zealous pumping causes the plastic "nubs" that retain the handle to break. (those little things you have to do the quarter turn to disengage if the leather cup needs oiling). Not a terrible problem if the check valve is in good working order, otherwise the handle comes out gas leaks and uh! oh! The worse of the two problems is again a fatigue and/or over zealous pumping problem, the pump at the point it screws into the bottle next to the o-ring will crack/break giving the o-ring nothing to push against. This allows gas to leak rather rapidly with spectacular results. I suspect this is what Jack witnessed. MSR has dealt with both these problems on their new pumps by using a fuller/beefier rubber piece next to the bottle and a design that does away with the weak "nubs" on the handle end. Just inspect the pump every now and then and don't try to get a 100 PSI into the bottle with it and you got nothing to worry about.

[sweetpeastu]

so how many times are u supposed to pump it...safetly? (I think mine is the newer kind with the beefier rubber piece)

[oldcoot]

Short answer, who knows? Long answer, it depends on bottle size, how full the bottle is, and to some extent outdoor temps (my opinion only on this one). The bigger the bottle the bigger the air space in it if it is filled to the correct line on the side, and the emptier the bottle the bigger the air space. The bigger the air space the more pumps it takes to compress the air inside to a given pressure. In the end sometimes less is more, I find I can get the whisperlights to do a fair job of simmering if I keep the pressure on the low side. A weak yellow flame, pump some more, a nice blue hissing flame OK no more pumping, a big tall yellow flame, see above posting and run like hell. Light it up, experiment, have some fun, if they were really dangerous they wouldn't be able to sell them now would they?

[oldfivetango]

I put my beautiful brass SVEA 123R aside for alcohol
only because of the weight and partly because I felt
a little uneasy with the pyrotechnics involved with
starting it.Plus,although it is simple in its design it is
still a mechanical device and, as such, is not immune to
failure.Alcohol,being so much lighter and simpler is my
current choice but requires a little more systems management
in its use.The size of the pot and the fit of the windscreen etc
are all an intergral part of the mix as someone stated earlier.
I took some advice from SGT Rock awhile back and made a simple
burner out of a can of Frito Lay Bean Dip.In a matter of minutes I
punched holes with a push pin,sat the stove in a small primer pan
left over from a worthless (imho) stove I had purchased and was
cooking in short order.Maybe I should say boiling in short order instead
of cooking.For cooking I use the Brasslite Turbo 2D and it is a Champion
of a stove from my perspective.I do not use the base reflector that I
sometimes see others using since I am using my little primer pan on
BOTH stoves.The little primer pan add a great deal of stability to either
setup and makes lighting the stove real easy and more than a little
safer as one doesnt necessarily have to hunker down over the stove to
light it.So the question is-what is that reflector ring actully do?When I
tried it all I got was a fuel flash so I discontinued its use.
Thanks,
Oldfivetango

[zelph]

--1996--
Join Date: 03-13-2004
Location: North, Georgia
Year of thru-hiked: 1996
Posts: 1,633

When I thru hiked in 96 a lot of the hikers using various alcohol stoves had trouble boiling water in the cold windy environment along with the near freezing creek water. One of the guys even got burned pretty bad using a less than sturdy homemade one.

Came across the above info posted by Ridge not to long ago. Just a reminder to be careful.

[Peaks]

I own, and have owned, for more than a few years, with no problems, a very dependable whisperlight internationale. That being said, there are two very rare failure points on the whisperlights. If the stove is more than a year or so old and has the second generation pump on it, it can fail at the point where the pump handle fastens into the rest of the pump. Fatigue and/or over zealous pumping causes the plastic "nubs" that retain the handle to break. (those little things you have to do the quarter turn to disengage if the leather cup needs oiling). Not a terrible problem if the check valve is in good working order, otherwise the handle comes out gas leaks and uh! oh! The worse of the two problems is again a fatigue and/or over zealous pumping problem, the pump at the point it screws into the bottle next to the o-ring will crack/break giving the o-ring nothing to push against. This allows gas to leak rather rapidly with spectacular results. I suspect this is what Jack witnessed. MSR has dealt with both these problems on their new pumps by using a fuller/beefier rubber piece next to the bottle and a design that does away with the weak "nubs" on the handle end. Just inspect the pump every now and then and don't try to get a 100 PSI into the bottle with it and you got nothing to worry about.

Yes, I've had those problems with the MSR pump. However, thanks to the liberal exchange policy at EMS and REI, I have exchanged them for the new pump at no cost.

[atraildreamer]

He over-primed the stove, flicked a lighter, and the flame that shot up almost took off his eyebrows. His hair wasn't quite on fire, but it was real close.

Is this how a mountain top becomes a "bald"?

[zelph]

This is just a reminder to be careful when experimenting at home in the kitchen. Don't mix fuels and firestarting products. Notice that gun powder was mixed in with shavings, oh my!!!!!

03-14-2007, 16:30
No Belay
Savoring Happy!
Magnesium Fire Maelstrom
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Was on Whee-bay a couple of weeks ago and saw a listing for magnesium shavings to use as fire starters. Thought "this has got to be cool" and bought a pound. I was expecting a sandwich bag full but when it got here, I was surprised to see it was a gallon zip-lock full of saw shavings and little fuzzy balls coated in gun powder. Thought "this really is cool."
My girlfriend was using the stove so I couldn't try it under the exhaust fan where I usually do my Alky stove training. Instead I got a coffee can, bad choice, turned it over, and poured about a tablespoon of the shavings over one of the fuzzy balls that I set on the bottom of the inverted can. Expecting a nice subtle tinder drying type fire, I struck a match to the fuzzy ball. It initially just kind of smoldered but then a small shaving of the magnesium ignited and that's the last thing I remember seeing before the big flash. Have you ever heard 6 smoke alarms going off at the same time?
Anywho, as my vision began to come back, I was pleased to see there was very little flame left on the top of the coffee can, just allot of smoke. Then I realized the magnesium had burned through the can and was now devouring the top of my kitchen island cabinet. Being a cool headed experimenter, I grabbed an oven mitt and the turkey roaster pan. In total control, I knocked the can off onto the floor and as I wiped the burning magnesium off the counter and towards the roaster pan, there was another blinding flash. Kinda looked like the 4th of July, New Years Eve in New York, and Hiroshima all rolled into one. Thank God, somewhere between the counter top and the pan, the remaining metal from hell had ignited and disappeared. All that remained were little black shards stuck in my forehead, arms, and stomach. The underarmor T I was wearing had been reduced to a Richard Simons look alike. Didn't get lucky that night...in fact didn't even get dinner.


http://www.whiteblaze.net/forum/show...51&postcount=1

[zelph]

I think this one is worthy of this thread:

IdahoDavid
Rather than creating a smaller hole, I have punched four 1/8 inch holes in the center for fill. The only problme I had was when I got impatient and refilled the stove before it had cooled completely so I had premature faborization and it blew up inside the chamber when I tried to light it. Very exciting.

His post can be viewed here (pepsi can cut out size)

Hole size in pop can stoves can be important!!!!

[Bohican]

This isn't about problems with MYOG stoves, but what can happen when "improvements" are made to a production stove.

I got a really good deal on a Vargo Titanium, but I'm using a Heinie Keg as a pot. The problem is the pot stand portion is too small for the keg. I decided to use another Heinie can as a combination windscreen/ pot holder.

Attachment 1652

It was a little too efficient at keeping the heat under the pot, and caused the alcohol to vaporize at an alarming rate.

Attachment 1653

Luckily, wasted fuel was the only bad thing that happened. I've since made a better adapter for the Heinie with this stove, but I ran across the idea of using a bottle cap and some fuel to "prime" the stove. So, I filled the bottle cap with fuel, placed it under the full stove, lit the alcohol in the cap, set the stove on the flaming cap, and within 10 seconds had the vargo erupting balls flame all over the electric range it was set on. No pics, as I was in a hurry to dig out a stock pot to smother the blaze before I lit my apartment complex on fire. I now test "improvements" to my stove outdoors.

I now seem to recall that little bit of advice being included in the vargo instructions (ETA: The Outside part).

[rjprince]

Pretty sure there is no way to make the FireLightStove blow up. I have burned all kinds of fuel in it and have melted a few, white gas, naptha, diesel, kerosene. THESE ARE NOT APPROVED FUELS FOR THE FIRELIGHT, just some things I tried on a crazy afternoon. (ONLY USE DENATURED ALCOHOL OR AN EQUIVALENT in the FireLightStove) In any case, with my design there is no way to build up pressure since the inner and outer walls of the burner are touching each other.

[zelph]

Pretty sure there is no way to make the FireLightStove blow up. I.

Somewhere in this thread there is a post saying that your type of burner tipped over and flaming fuel was spilled. It was an open flame type just like yours.

Some stoves are more scary than others. We should be careful with all stoves. Some stoves can tip over and the fuel wont spill out, less scary.

Would you like to add an experience that might be of some value to this thread, something that went wrong during the 5 gallons of fuel that you burned 1/2 ounce at a time. The hundreds of stoves that you made, did any of them fail in any way?

Thank You

[rjprince]

Oh, absolutely. Fire does burn things, no doubt. I do not know of any alcohol stove that will not spill some fuel when turn over while in operation. If the fuel spills, then the fire spreads where the fuel goes. This is true with the Trangia as well. Kinda tend to believe that any liquid fuel stove could have this potential. Have not tried to turn over my white gas stove while in operation, but pretty sure that it would be unpleasant. AND water does not put out a petroleum fire like it DOES a small alcohol fire...

In my instructions, I specifically warn, "If you turn this stove over while in operation, the fire will be out of the stove and onto whatever surface the stove was at the time..."

In another place I warn, "knives and sharp edges can cut... fire burns things". In that sense stoves can be like people. Their greatest strengths can become their greatest weakness, if they are not kept under control...

If a person is a strong leader with a forceful personality, it is potentially a very good thing. If that person uses that strength to dominate and hurt others, it is a bad thing. Strength out of control = weakness.

SO yes, any stove which has the potential to allow the fire to get out of control has a weakness. Ever drop a kitchen towel onto a red hot electric burner? Anything that will cook food has a weakness. Its strength is its ability to generate heat. It weakness is it ability to generate heat. Strength must be kept under control.

Do you agree?

[rjprince]

Some of the stoves burped and sputtered out small droplets of fuel when burning. As long as I was on a non-flamable surface this was OK. Final design does not have this problem and the windscreen/shield would take care of it if it did.

As far as a problem in burning all that fuel (I am on my 8th gallon now), only time was when I got careless and added fuel to a burner that had not gone completely out. The fumes in the plastic bottle ignited and forced burning fuel out with great intensity! Did not burn down the house or damage the stove. Did result in immediate increase in heart rate, blood pressure, and respiration. But for the potential danger, kinda reminded me of the time when I was a kid and accidently dropped a lit match into a coffee can full of firecrackers, only this was much more quiet....

Ray

[Minot]

I just picked up a Vargo and I am very disappointed in it.

It sputters and leaks around the edge. I didn't overfill it but it still burned off the fuel too quickly.

It's a marginal design in my opinion. I know some people have had great times with them, but it's not going in my pack.