Do AT hikers need a permit for GSMNP?
Hello All, Looking at that permit process on line. Looks pretty messed up. How could you even know where you might be on any given day. Please, enlighten me. Thanks, Kevin K
I've hiked it, north to south, before. About 10-15 years ago. I think I signed a book at an unmanned Ranger Station. Gotta be different rules for AT hikers. kk
If you are a through hiker, you need a permit. The permit allows you to stay 7 nights in the park. You don't have to file an itinerary. More info here. https://smokiespermits.nps.gov/index...er%20is%20full.
''Tennessee Viking'
Mountains to Sea Trail Hiker & Maintainer
Former TEHCC (AT) Maintainer
Quick summary of the permit rules you need to know as an AT thru hiker:
1. You must obtain your permit no more than 30 days before you enter the park.
2. Once you enter the park, you have 8 days (7 nights) to leave the park.
3. You are only allowed to camp at the shelters (or campsite #113) along the AT.
4. Unlike "general" back packing permits, you don't need a 'reservation' for the campsite/shelter.
5. To qualify as a Thru hiker, your hike must start and end at least 50 miles beyond the boarders of GSMNP.
Short answer & long answer
Plain and simple: you don't. You just make your best guess, and then follow the itinerary you agreed to follow.How could you even know where you might be on any given day.
No question but that the system is far different from just about every other part of the A.T. -- but it's the only way the National Parks Service can obey the law that REQUIRES that they "conserve the scenery and the natural and historic objects and the wild life therein and to provide for the enjoyment of the same in such manner and by such means as will leave them unimpaired for the enjoyment of future generations." Unregulated & unrestricted camping in the back country areas of GSMNP was unquestionably leaving that area "impaired," so the permit system was instituted to end this problem.
Also:Originally Posted by HooKooDooKu
- “Thru-Hikers may tent in the immediate area around shelters only if the shelter is full. Thru-hikers are required to stay in shelters when there is space available. Thru-Hikers must always give up bunk space in shelters to those with shelter reservations.”
At the moment, the National Park is allowing everyone (thru hikers and general backpackers) to tent in the immediate area around shelters to allow for "social distancing".
One thing that I would add is that you cannot stay more than one night at any shelter or CS 113. (No Zero days in GSMNP)
How frequently are permits checked?
Not asking so much as to avoid getting a permit myself, more curious how well the permit process works in making the scofflaws behave and follow the rules.
During the thru hiking season, I understand that there are usually two ridge runners hired to help keep an eye on things along the AT in GSMNP.
Ok, Thanks for the link. I see it now. That's not so bad. I was looking at the "party of 8" stuff. Yes, I'm definitely for preserving the park. Didn't I read somewhere it's one of the most remote sections of the AT? I remember hiking on a ridge in GSMNP and you were on one side of the ridge for a while and then on the other. It was cool. Down below I think, you could see Gatlinburg in the distance? KK
The only thing I don't like is you have to stay in the shelter then your supposed to give up space if someone comes in with a different permit. Before dark no problem but I heard stories of people coming in hours after dark then thru hikers have to give up their space. I just made sure I got to shelters early because your supposed to give up space based on the last thru hiker to get there. I never saw it happen but heard stories.
NoDoz
nobo 2018 March 10th - October 19th
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I'm just one too many mornings and 1,000 miles behind
Since covid they allow hikers, thru or not, to camp around shelters as to avoid overcrowding but I don't know if they made it official.
Not sure what you mean by "official"...
The current "official" word as noted on the web pages where General Backpackers select a reservation for a shelter is "With a valid permit, backpackers are authorized to tent outside the shelter."
Oddly enough, the web page for obtaining AT Thru hiker permits leaves out this detail (it still shows the old wording about required to stay in the shelter unless it is full).
This all suggests that the "official" policy allowing everyone to tent around shelters is currently still considered a temporary measure.
Other than really bad weather...Why stay in a shelter with the mice, farts, and norovirus.
''Tennessee Viking'
Mountains to Sea Trail Hiker & Maintainer
Former TEHCC (AT) Maintainer
I guess what I meant is that it is not permanent. Last summer i met a ridgerunner in the Smokies who told me that they allow any hiker to tent around shelters because of covid and that they are debating whether to make it permanent.
Yeah, I'm hoping that after two years, the park service will see that tenting around shelters isn't causing a major degradation in the environment and will make the current policy permanent.
Pretty much every shelter has a few spots near-by that it's easy to setup a tent, and I saw these spots getting used with regularity (outside thru-hiker season) even before covid.
I've never seen where a limited number of tents created an issue around the shelters, so I'm hopeful the current policy will become permanent.
Only time I've seen tenting around shelters to be an issue is thru-hiker season when you can get 30 tents setup at a shelter.
Seems like that's an issue that is in dire need of being addressed rather than going back to pre-covid rules.
But it seems like there's only two ways to address that issue:
1. Add more campsites/shelters along the AT. But that's something the park service seems loathed to do. In the last 25 years, I've never seen the park service establish a 'new' campsite except as a replacement for an existing campsite getting closed (and I've only seen that happen twice).
2. Limit the number of thru-hikers in a given window of time. Plenty of other trails and parks issue limited permits via a lottery. I feel like such a system is eventually going to become inevitable. Hopefully they can find a way to phase something like that in so that they don't suddenly clamp down on the number allowed and simply encourage people to hike without a valid permit and hope not to get caught. But I'm afraid the park service doesn't seem to have that mentality.
FYI: Along those lines...
The park service has proposed doubling fees in GSMNP for 2023. As a part of that, they are looking to doubling the AT-Thru hiker permit from $20 to $40. But what made me think to bring this up is that the park service has also proposed requiring a "parking tag" (i.e. a fee) to park in the national park (a substitute way to raise money since they can't charge an entrance fee). But as a part of this new fee, they also propose limiting parking to marked parking spots and making it illegal to simply park along side the road. The issue there is that there is one very popular trailhead that only has about 40 marked parking spots, but on a holiday weekend, there can be 250 cars parked along the road. Seems like they are setting themselves up for "different" problems when a trail has that much demand and they try to severely limit the supply. Limiting AT thru-hiker permits wouldn't sound much better.
3. If they could establish 3-4 alternate paths through the Smokies (the BMT being one option), and make them all officially recognized by the ATC, that would help to spread the crowd out. When you leave the AT and the popular dayhike trails, the backcountry is mighty empty most of the time.
Yes, you do need a permit. I'd suggest getting it a couple of days before you enter the park. Headed NOBO, we got our permit at the NOC Outfitters, (They allow you to use the computer for free to purchase the permit.) There are green hiker "permit boxes" at each entry/exit point, depending on whether you are NOBO or SOBO. We guessed our time would be about seven days to give us a little wiggle room. We hiked through in 5-1/2 days. The top half of the permit goes into the entry point box, the bottom half goes into the exit point box.
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