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  1. #21
    Registered User tagg's Avatar
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    I'm not saying a random lion couldn't wander into the area, but if there were any sort of established population I would assume one would have turned up dead on a road by now. Lots of reports/videos of them being struck by cars out west, but I haven't seen any from the Smokies.
    -tagg

  2. #22
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    Thumbs down A problem with your conclusion

    These animals have been evolving for thousands of years to be as stealthy as possible
    And yet a breeding population that was so small, that the entire sub-species would have died out in a few decades without human intervention
    http://www.tampabay.com/environment/...says-20190719/
    left a LOT of proof of their presence.

    I find it difficult to conclude that a LARGER breeding population of cougars -- remember, it MUST be larger than the one that was easy to spot in Florida, or it would died out -- has existed north of there for a far longer period without leaving any physical evidence of the presence of a breeding colony.

    These animals live in Appalachia
    Nobody denies this. Illegal pets have been released into the wild. Male cougars have traversed 1000s of kilometers in the fruitless search for a female.
    Neither of these is a sustainable breeding colony that has existed for decades.

    If you want to insist, "The fact that no evidence exists for a breeding colony north of Florida is PROOF of a cover-up," please understand why I disagree.
    BTW, neither is "I heard from a friend of a friend that THEY are covering this up." These stories are VERY good at creating paranoia, but they're not very good as evidence of reality.

  3. #23

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    I've never seen a mountain lion but I have seen a bobcat. 4-2-2011 9:30 AM EST at junction of Balsam Mountain and Sterling ridge (picture is time stamped lol), Could not get camera out fast enough to get its picture but did get tracks:

    Spring-Trip-4-1-11-027.jpg

    Spring-Trip-4-1-11-028.jpg

  4. #24

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    Quote Originally Posted by HooKooDooKu View Post
    The woods are full of bears, but I don't recall having ever seen a bear paw print in GSMNP back country.

    .
    Wow that's genuinely surprising HooKoo, given how much you're in the park, I see bear prints all the time. Like hundreds of times. I just saw one large enough to make me wince weekend before last near Pretty Hollow gap.

  5. #25
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    Quote Originally Posted by PatmanTN View Post
    I've never seen a mountain lion but I have seen a bobcat. 4-2-2011 9:30 AM EST at junction of Balsam Mountain and Sterling ridge (picture is time stamped lol), Could not get camera out fast enough to get its picture but did get tracks:

    Spring-Trip-4-1-11-027.jpg

    Spring-Trip-4-1-11-028.jpg
    Never seen a Bobcat... but I've got a ghost story I've written about before here in WB about hearing one.

  6. #26
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    Quote Originally Posted by PatmanTN View Post
    Wow that's genuinely surprising HooKoo, given how much you're in the park, I see bear prints all the time. Like hundreds of times. I just saw one large enough to make me wince weekend before last near Pretty Hollow gap.
    Can't say for certain I've NEVER seen a bear print. If I have, none currently stand out in my mind. Seems like the times I've seen prints in the mud, it's been pigs or dogs (coyote).

    Bear scat on the other hand... ALL THE TIME.

  7. #27
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    Bear scat on the other hand... ALL THE TIME.



    bottom line---you have seen evidence of bear in the Park.....

    unlike mountain lions where no credible evidence of them living in the Park has surfaced.....

  8. #28

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    I have seen a mountain lion print in GSMNP. I know what I saw because I've seen the same prints when hiking out west. I was stunned when I saw it but there was no mistaking what it was. It could have just been passing through, who knows, but it was there.

  9. #29

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    Quote Originally Posted by TNhiker View Post
    i'll just put it this way-----over ten million visitors to GSMNP every year and not one credible photo has surfaced of a mountain lion in the Park.....
    The very vast majority of those “visitors” just drive the road across the mountain. They don’t see much at all.

  10. #30
    Registered User SawnieRobertson's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rain Man View Post
    So, the illegality of killing animals of any sort in the National Park, ... nor the fact that they had no such hunting license nor the fact it wasn't mountain lion hunting season stopped them, only their alleged good judgment?
    .

    Always good to hear from Rain Man. Judgment is always required. I wonder how I would react if I found myself in one of those kitty's crosshairs. I know...--Do not run (no matter how much you want to. --Make yourself appear larger than you are. I have considered how effective a pop-openumbrella would be at convincing it that I am a formidable foe. --Make noise. That ought to worry it. They apparently exist in silence, very stealthy.
    You never know just what you can do until you realize you absolutely have to do it.
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  11. #31

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    I have lived in the inland northwest for forty years. Mountain lions are common here, one even visited my yard in Spokane when we were not home. I have seen scat now and again, but only one big cat. They are stealthy, but they are seen on occasion, as are definite signs. Since a very pro cougar group concluded several years ago that no breeding population exists in the eastern mountains, I remain very skeptical.
    "It's fun to have fun, but you have to know how." ---Dr. Seuss

  12. #32
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    Quote Originally Posted by FreeGoldRush View Post
    The very vast majority of those “visitors” just drive the road across the mountain. They don’t see much at all.


    yes, they do......

    every animal in the Park----especially large mammals---has been spotted by someone in a vehicle.........

    stands the reason that a mammal as large as a cougar, would be seen from a visitor in a vehicle.....

    also---along with the number of people who spend a night in the backcountry, and add that number to the number of people doing day hikes, some of which are doing double digit miles so they dont have to stay in the backcountry, and the hikers who are just doing casual hikes--------somewhere in there, someone would get some sort of credible evidence.......something---scat, a sighting, fur, anything..............yet nothing....

    and trust me, i'd like to be proven wrong and find out there are cougars in the Park, but i need to see some evidence........

  13. #33
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    Quote Originally Posted by martinb View Post
    I have seen a mountain lion print in GSMNP. I know what I saw because I've seen the same prints when hiking out west. I was stunned when I saw it but there was no mistaking what it was. It could have just been passing through, who knows, but it was there.



    picture?.................

  14. #34
    GoldenBear's Avatar
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    Lightbulb Cougars can EASILY be seen by car drivers

    Indeed, the problem is that cars HIT cougars.

    http://www.fox13news.com/news/florid...orida-panthers

    There are about 100 to 200 adults panthers in Florida, about the MINIMUM number to have a sustainable breeding colony. If there are cougars in Appalachia, their population MUST be AT LEAST that number, or they would have died out in a few decades.

    In Florida, that number of cougars has resulted in 147 deaths by vehicles in the last five years.
    How many cougars have been killed by vehicles in Appalachia in the last five decades?

  15. #35
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    Default Mountain Lions in GSMNP

    Quote Originally Posted by Traveler View Post
    At some point cougar will migrate and fill the predation niche that exists in eastern forest areas without apex predators, the question remains when that may be and at what point will evidence support the premise.
    Yeah, it’s exciting. Coyotes are relatively new to us and now they’re everywhere. We actually had our first confirmed cougar sighting in Tennessee in generations a few years ago in west TN. There was a bear roaming through Davidson County (Nashville) last year.


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

  16. #36
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    I live 7 miles fro the entrance to Grayson Highland and 6 from Elk Garden. I have had 2 encounters with MLs while trail running. One started to attack my dog but saw me when it was within 3' of my dog and took off. Tail was at least 5' long and it looked to weigh twice as much as my 60lb retriever.

    Last June while trail running, I witness a ML take down an adult doe in the center of a creek and carry it out of the creek....at which point I left the scene.

    A local oncologist and his wife saw one several times on a hill looking down on their goats.

    Another local friend saw one with 2 cubs 4-5 yrs ago.

    All of use are intelligent professionals who have never been abducted by aliens.
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  17. #37

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    Quote Originally Posted by DownYonder View Post
    I live 7 miles fro the entrance to Grayson Highland and 6 from Elk Garden. I have had 2 encounters with MLs while trail running. One started to attack my dog but saw me when it was within 3' of my dog and took off. Tail was at least 5' long and it looked to weigh twice as much as my 60lb retriever.

    Last June while trail running, I witness a ML take down an adult doe in the center of a creek and carry it out of the creek....at which point I left the scene.

    A local oncologist and his wife saw one several times on a hill looking down on their goats.

    Another local friend saw one with 2 cubs 4-5 yrs ago.

    All of use are intelligent professionals who have never been abducted by aliens.
    Tail at least five feet long? Kinda hurts you credibility.
    "It's fun to have fun, but you have to know how." ---Dr. Seuss

  18. #38

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    Quote Originally Posted by DownYonder View Post
    I live 7 miles fro the entrance to Grayson Highland and 6 from Elk Garden. I have had 2 encounters with MLs while trail running. One started to attack my dog but saw me when it was within 3' of my dog and took off. Tail was at least 5' long and it looked to weigh twice as much as my 60lb retriever.

    Last June while trail running, I witness a ML take down an adult doe in the center of a creek and carry it out of the creek....at which point I left the scene.

    A local oncologist and his wife saw one several times on a hill looking down on their goats.

    Another local friend saw one with 2 cubs 4-5 yrs ago.

    All of use are intelligent professionals who have never been abducted by aliens.
    Unfortunately, anecdotes are not data. While your experience may be enough to prompt an investigative look-see by professional biologists, Park Rangers, or Game Wardens, especially with wounds on your dog that are common to cougar attacks, anecdotes by themselves are on par with sightings of other things like Bigfoot and space aliens. The adage "Extraordinary claims require extraordinary evidence" kind of rings true on this issue. Its a shame you didn't have a cellphone or camera handy or weren't able to take someone back to look at the attack site quickly to find tracks and other evidence.

  19. #39

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    Quote Originally Posted by TNhiker View Post
    picture?.................
    Kev, I have it somewhere. It was taken about 10 years ago and I got a lot of pictures in several storage devices. Looking.

  20. #40

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    Bobcat. they are everywhere. Not to worry.
    ---Where ever you go
    There you are---

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