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  1. #21
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    Quote Originally Posted by HooKooDooKu View Post
    Are they "making up their own rules", or trying to dynamically deal with complex situations?
    tomato, tomahto.

    "the rules state this but because of how i chose to deal with a dynamically situation, i'm going to do it the exact opposite" is making up the rules as you go along.

  2. #22
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rain Man View Post
    I read it as "I know it's against the rules" not as "Is it against the rules?" If I read it wrong, I apologize.
    and i apologize if you're reading of it is correct.

  3. #23
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    Sorry for the ignorant questions,
    Thank you to the few who understood my (first timer questions)
    Been trying to section hike for the last 4 years, starting at Approach trail.
    From Florida, hard to train and far away. Sorry I don't care for mice crap in my hair.
    So far the trail has been,,, Freedom.... I admit I don't like the smokey rules. But it seems that setting up my tiny tent really IS a big deal when there are tent sites around the shelters available ?. I'm shocked.

    I just wanted to hear the real deal. And Thanks I did.

    I will most likely be canceling this years trip to contemplate if my pride will let me skip this section, I wanted to see every mile.

    And maybe continue in Sept.
    Last edited by sittinguy; 04-16-2019 at 21:57.

  4. #24

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    Quote Originally Posted by TNhiker View Post
    it's part of the planning process...

    know your daily mileage and do the math for mileage between shelters and figure it out.....
    Some days will be harder than others. Be ready for that.
    "It's fun to have fun, but you have to know how." ---Dr. Seuss

  5. #25
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    Quote Originally Posted by rmitchell View Post
    Sittinguy

    If you are doing sections I recommend AWOL's guide or an app that shows elevation profiles. Mileage also can be deceiving in GSMP doe to the climbs and descents.
    Ditto on AWOL Guide. Also, look into Guthooks. (I suggest BOTH - not just one!)

  6. #26
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    Here ya go, distances between shelters and points of interest, elevation profile, etc - http://www.hikinginthesmokys.com/app...il-smokies.htm
    Plan on conservative distances. If you get into camp early, gather firewood, cook a nice meal, read a book, police up any litter, etc. Or just relax.

  7. #27
    GSMNP 900 Miler HooKooDooKu's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by 4eyedbuzzard View Post
    Here ya go, distances between shelters and points of interest, elevation profile, etc - http://www.hikinginthesmokys.com/app...il-smokies.htm
    Plan on conservative distances. If you get into camp early, gather firewood, cook a nice meal, read a book, police up any litter, etc. Or just relax.
    And to add to those resources, a ready profile of the AT thru GSMNP
    https://tnlandforms.us/at/gsmnpat.html

  8. #28
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    But it seems that setting up my tiny tent really IS a big deal when there are tent sites around the shelters available ?. I'm shocked


    but, see?

    it's not all about you and your tiny tent----its about over 90,000 other backpackers and the millions of other people that visit the Park....

    Which is the most popular national park in the national park system....

    with people, and in those numbers, comes the good and the bad......


    at some point, rules need to be set in place to protect what is there....

    and to be quite honest----the rules aint hard to follow....

    it's sad when people want to skip over the Smokys just because they cant follow the rules.........

    but, hey, HYOH......

  9. #29

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    Quote Originally Posted by TNhiker View Post

    it's sad when people want to skip over the Smokys just because they cant follow the rules.........

    .
    Seems like a win-win to me. Nothing sad about it imo.

    If someones pigheaded and self centered enough to ignore regulations, best thing is for them to skip it.

  10. #30
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    So wanting to get the most enjoyment out of my hard earned time off is pigheaded and self centered? Wanting to get a good nights sleep and not be up all night listening to snoring people and mice scratching around ALL night.
    And some of the shelters did not show on the map when applying for the permit.

  11. #31
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    Many times I have got to a shelter I intended on staying at. But I felt good and had daylight left, and a group would be debating if they wanted to push on to the next shelter, and I would go for it. It was rewarding to push the extra miles.

  12. #32
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    Sittinguy,
    You mentioned earlier not wanting mouse crap in your hair. One small suggestion: don't sleep with your head at the back wall of the shelter. Mice prefer to run at the perimeter. Doesn't mean they won't explore elsewhere, but hopefully could reduce the contact.

    I agree the GSM rules are a bit of a pain for people who don't like shelters. But it really is a great section of the trail. I hope you don't skip it. It's not all that long, just a few days. Maybe it will help if you think of the shelter/mouse experience as just part of the trail terrain. In some areas you might see a bear. In other areas you might see a moose. In GSM you might see a mouse.

  13. #33
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    Hike 50+ miles on each end of the park to meet the definition of "thru-hiker" under GSMNP rules, Wayah Gap, S.R. 1310 to Allen Gap, N.C. 208, Tenn. 70
    You'll still have to use shelters when space is available, but you'll have 8 days to get thru the park staying at whatever shelter/area you get to that night.

  14. #34
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    there are people who have broken down the smokeys into a set of day hikes without ever camping overnight in the backcountry. maybe try that if the mice bother you that much.

    do mice crap in people's hair? i find that a fascinatingly specific worry. i also have to wonder, if the OP doesn't like mice crap in his hair, is that to suggest that people who sleep in shelters do? i slept in those shelters and neither would i enjoy mice crap in my hair nor do i believe i experienced any.

  15. #35
    GSMNP 900 Miler HooKooDooKu's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by sittinguy View Post
    Many times I have got to a shelter I intended on staying at. But I felt good and had daylight left, and a group would be debating if they wanted to push on to the next shelter, and I would go for it. It was rewarding to push the extra miles.
    OP's situation is a section hiker that would require a general permit requiring a reservation at each shelter and sticking to a fixed schedule.

  16. #36

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    Quote Originally Posted by MuddyWaters View Post
    Seems like a win-win to me. Nothing sad about it imo.
    If someones pigheaded and self centered enough to ignore regulations, best thing is for them to skip it.
    No one on this thread is discussing how to break rules or how to do anything that is even remotely pigheaded.

    Not everyone is required to follow their rules! Only the people camping in the park are required to follow them. So please stop acting like the rules apply to everyone. They do not. The OP is being entirely reasonable when he is thinking about avoiding the rules by avoiding the hike. That is not pigheaded.

  17. #37
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rain Man View Post
    I read it as "I know it's against the rules" not as "Is it against the rules?" If I read it wrong, I apologize.
    Dang rain man. Ease up. Quit trying to play forum police and let people air their thoughts.

    This is why WB is dying.

  18. #38

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    Quote Originally Posted by sittinguy View Post
    So wanting to get the most enjoyment out of my hard earned time off is pigheaded and self centered? Wanting to get a good nights sleep and not be up all night listening to snoring people and mice scratching around ALL night.
    And some of the shelters did not show on the map when applying for the permit.
    I can sympathize with this. I don't like planning each day and I don't sleep very well in busy shelters either. They are legitimate factors to consider for a section hiker. One option is to skip it and come back and do it in off season at some point. Won't change some of the factors, but less people
    A big part of the reason I enjoy AT hikes is the route flexibility. I generally don't book shuttles back... and just walk until I'm out of time. Sometimes I go way further than I thought I was going to

  19. #39

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    Quote Originally Posted by FreeGoldRush View Post
    No one on this thread is discussing how to break rules or how to do anything that is even remotely pigheaded.

    Not everyone is required to follow their rules! Only the people camping in the park are required to follow them. So please stop acting like the rules apply to everyone. They do not. The OP is being entirely reasonable when he is thinking about avoiding the rules by avoiding the hike. That is not pigheaded.
    Theres two possibilities

    Follow regulations

    Or skip it

    It doesnt take normal people pages of discussion to know what they want to do.

    And it aint the first person to cop an attitude about the regs here. Doing so identifies you in unfavorable way .
    Last edited by MuddyWaters; 04-17-2019 at 10:36.

  20. #40

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    Quote Originally Posted by sittinguy View Post
    So wanting to get the most enjoyment out of my hard earned time off is pigheaded and self centered? Wanting to get a good nights sleep and not be up all night listening to snoring people and mice scratching around ALL night.
    And some of the shelters did not show on the map when applying for the permit.
    Here's the deal, you came here and stated that you didn't like the rules, because you don't like mouse crap. That's not pigheaded. No one likes mouse crap, and everyone wants to enjoy their vacation. You were told, yes there are indeed rules, and they're usually enforced, and these are the reasons they're enforced, and these are your options.

    Now, even after hearing about the millions of people sharing the park... if you choose to continue to maintain that your experience, that your comfort, that your vacation is more important than everyone else's enjoyment of the park... then yes, that's pigheaded. We can forgive ignorance, we can forgive a little bit of of "oh, I never thought of the situation in the light of the big picture before."

    Having hiked the AT through the park, it was a wonderful hike. It's very close to a rain forest, with quite a bit of unexpected beauty around each corner. There are also a lot of problems from pigheaded people who ruin the experience for everyone else. There's a whole field of toilet paper blossoms, because a hundred or so people in the preceding days felt that their experience was more important than mine, and they were too special to dig cat holes for their waste, so I had to tip toe through their crap to dig my own cat hole just to poop.

    If everyone tented every night, there would be a hardened area of dead vegetation 200 feet back from the entire length of the trail, and we'd all be hiking through a swath of dead ground and campfire pits.

    So again, it's not pigheaded to ask, to clarify, or to want a pleasant experience, but it is if you maintain that you specifically are entitled to that experience at our expense.

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