Page 3 of 3 FirstFirst 1 2 3
Results 41 to 54 of 54
  1. #41
    Registered User
    Join Date
    08-28-2007
    Location
    Georgia and Hawaii
    Posts
    17,315

    Default

    I'm wondering if blood can be made less appealing to ticks by introducing something to it? Take the internal systemic control approach rather than external. In Horticulture we can take a similar systemic approach in making plants less appealing to insects where the insects evolve - "learn" - to not to eat some plants just as they eat some plant parts and avoid other parts of the same plant for different reasons. Some plants have evolved to defend themselves against insect, disease, and animal predation taking an analogous approach.

    I also wonder if some moose aren't already less prone to tick predation in the same region because they are already evolving to defend against the ticks?

  2. #42
    Registered User
    Join Date
    06-15-2008
    Location
    Randolph, NH
    Posts
    10,382
    Images
    34

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Dogwood View Post
    Ohh, Mods.
    When I once innocently commented that longer falls and earlier springs were due to climate change in a thread, my post was deleted and got my hand slapped by Alligator and put on moderation when a climate change denier made a fuss about it.

    I'm pretty sure the plastic soda straw ban was more to do with how it can impact wildlife due to it's shape then addressing the overall plastic problem. The same reason those plastic 6 pack holders are no longer common.

    Most of the plastic in the ocean comes from Asia where single serve plastic containers are even more common then here. These countries don't have a good waste disposal system like we do, so it all goes into rivers and finds its way into the ocean. Of course, the USA contributes it's fair share too.
    The AT - It has it's ups and downs...

  3. #43
    Registered User
    Join Date
    06-15-2008
    Location
    Randolph, NH
    Posts
    10,382
    Images
    34

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Dogwood View Post
    I'm wondering if blood can be made less appealing to ticks by introducing something to it? Take the internal systemic control approach rather than external. In Horticulture we can take a similar systemic approach in making plants less appealing to insects where the insects evolve - "learn" - to not to eat some plants just as they eat some plant parts and avoid other parts of the same plant for different reasons. Some plants have evolved to defend themselves against insect, disease, and animal predation taking an analogous approach.

    I also wonder if some moose aren't already less prone to tick predation in the same region because they are already evolving to defend against the ticks?
    So, you going to track down all the moose and inject them with something? Maybe spray then down with Permethrin.

    The problem with the ticks is it's not just a few ticks, it's thousands of them all sucking the blood out of the poor critter. Once infected, the moose rub themselves raw trying to get them off, which just makes it worse. A tick has a much shorter life span then a Moose, so I'm sure a tick could adapt much quicker then a moose could.

    I had a tick infested moose in my yard towards the end of winter a few years ago which had to be put down. Once most of the moose die off and the ticks no longer have a host, then they will die off too. Some locals blame the ticks on the power compony which brought in hay from outside the area for erosion control. Not too sure of that, but could have been a factor.
    The AT - It has it's ups and downs...

  4. #44
    GSMNP 900 Miler HooKooDooKu's Avatar
    Join Date
    02-25-2007
    Location
    Birmingham, AL
    Age
    52
    Posts
    4,014
    Journal Entries
    1
    Images
    5

    Default

    I've got some thoughts and options on the issue of global warming...

  5. #45
    Registered User
    Join Date
    08-08-2012
    Location
    Taghkanic, New York, United States
    Posts
    2,885
    Journal Entries
    11

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Slo-go'en View Post
    ... Some locals blame the ticks on the power compony which brought in hay from outside the area for erosion control. Not too sure of that, but could have been a factor.
    Forgive us Father, for we no not what we do.

  6. #46
    Registered User
    Join Date
    08-28-2007
    Location
    Georgia and Hawaii
    Posts
    17,315

    Default

    So, you going to track down all the moose and inject them with something? Maybe spray then down with Permethrin.


    That is what's happening in part with attempts to save some plant species on a more limited scale such as saving mature otherwise healthy eastern hemlock species that possibly demonstrate some natural resistance being attacked by non native woolly adelgids. These mature trees can be of reproductive age. Progeny may have these alterations handed down to them. It could involve turning off the odds of certain gene expressions that involve hormones, proteins, or other genetic traits that involve tick predation mechanisms with moose. It could involve cross breeding. Animals are cross bred! It could involve the relocation of species into changing more favorable environments. It could involve lower populations of species regionally where they were once native. It could involve more concentrated attacks against the attacker to provide a 'better' ecological balance. You can bet on there being winners and losers! Nature often finds a way. Look at where coconut palms have spread and now seem native yet are not! We tend to overwhelmingly welcome this "invasion", this change, referred to often as 'natural' evolution. Sometimes, however Nature doesn't change exactly as humanity desires. The nature of Nature is to evolve and adapt. Species are lost as this happens. That's a fact of evolutionary and biological history... but I don't see it as an excuse to be ignorant self species serving resource stewards.


    Look at some of the control approaches for elms bred for Dutch Elm Disease resistance or different Ulmus species to replace native American elms, pines that display a higher resistance to pine bark weevil or the use pine bark beetle killed wood for construction or energy( burning wood), crosses or different species use of white bark birches against bronze birch borers and leaf miners(some birches do better in colder environs yet humans try to unnaturally extend their native ranges where they've historically thrived), and some of the Chestnut advances against chestnut blight resistant specimens back crossed into creating stronger more resistant chestnut blight cvs and specimens, or the crosses of different Lagerstromia species(Crepe myrtles) to increase favorable traits like cold hardiness or inflorescence. Look through the GSMNP canopy from on high. Ever note some isolated trees seeming to have evolved advanced defenses against diseases that succumb weaker trees of the same Genus and species? It could be we are witnessing adaption, evolution in action. So how about making the moose stronger in balance of an emerging greater entomological threat? Humanity has to be careful doing this though. We don't see all the angles when we environmentally tinker.

  7. #47
    Registered User
    Join Date
    08-28-2007
    Location
    Georgia and Hawaii
    Posts
    17,315

    Default

    If the Earth's climate(NOT the same as localized weather patterns, often muddled by deniers) is changing, and there is a mountain of scientific global evidence and scientists on board already that say it is, and govt's preparing for it, including military branches of govt's, we can expect big changes in where and how people live, where and how food is produced, economic winners and losers, what species adapt and evolve, what species are lost/which thrive, etc. We as humans will have to adapt. And, we can expect what we may perceive as unchanging, such as the AT corridor, to change, likely seeing those changes more and more significantly during a human lifetime. It's been this way. It will continue. It involves human behavioral modification issues on a global scale which tends to be 'a loser' topic.

  8. #48
    Registered User
    Join Date
    08-28-2007
    Location
    Georgia and Hawaii
    Posts
    17,315

    Default

    https://www.nrs.fs.fed.us/disturbanc...tant_hemlocks/

    Look at natural variation among Tsuga(hemlock). I wonder if there're any moose where increased tick predation is overall occurring that show resistance to ticks or the bacteria that ticks transmit?

  9. #49

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by MuddyWaters View Post
    Actually, im not.

    While they get co2 from ice cores i think, the age is calculated by depth, and temps are estimated too . Its not data, its calculations
    CO2 levels are from ice cores in a number places including Greenland, Antarctic, glaciers etc.. Age of the ice cores can be read like the growth rings on a tree by each years snow fall so they are not estimates of age. Temperatures are determined by a variety of indicators including tree rings, oceanic plankton from oceanic sediments, oxygen isotopes in sediments etc. which all correlate with each other independently. https://earthobservatory.nasa.gov/fe..._OxygenBalance
    At one time I was a skeptic but an unbiased examination of the data convinced me that as CO2 levels rise so will temperature as they have in the past and as they will now and in the future. It is fundamental in geo-science that processes that operated in the past operate today.
    If you don't stand for something, you will fall for anything.

  10. #50

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by TexasBob View Post
    CO2 levels are from ice cores in a number places including Greenland, Antarctic, glaciers etc.. Age of the ice cores can be read like the growth rings on a tree by each years snow fall so they are not estimates of age. Temperatures are determined by a variety of indicators including tree rings, oceanic plankton from oceanic sediments, oxygen isotopes in sediments etc. which all correlate with each other independently. https://earthobservatory.nasa.gov/fe..._OxygenBalance
    At one time I was a skeptic but an unbiased examination of the data convinced me that as CO2 levels rise so will temperature as they have in the past and as they will now and in the future. It is fundamental in geo-science that processes that operated in the past operate today.
    The only problem is that the data collected from ice cores show that temperature changes occurred prior to increases is co2, sometimes by as much as 100 years. Kind of blows the whole carbon caused global warming thesis out of the water.

    Sent from my PH-1 using Tapatalk

  11. #51
    Registered User
    Join Date
    09-08-2014
    Location
    Georgia
    Age
    66
    Posts
    488

    Default

    Trying to play nice and stay on topic here.Treating Moose and Deer for tick infestations is not a far fetched idea.
    Cattle producers treat their livestock all the time and even wild animals could be treated.Build an enclosure that has salt blocks and/or some feed to train the wildlife to come to the site.When Bull Winkle or Bambi exits the enclosure the sprayer applies a nice little shower of tick killer.I would be in favor of this because it's my understanding that ticks are now imparting diseases to deer that can affect the health of people who eat the meat.

    A few weeks ago I read something about scientists genetically altering disease carrying mosquitoes in Africa to eliminate them.So I wonder if science could introduce diseases to kill off the tick population.The real question is "should we?"
    Last edited by Five Tango; 03-02-2019 at 09:59. Reason: misspelled word

  12. #52

    Default

    Unlike most other tick varieties the winter tick does not need an intermediate host. They do not inject a disease into the moose, they just suck its blood. Kind of hard to genetically alter a moose to deal with massive blood loss. The life cycle is they attach to the moose, live their life sucking blood, reproduce and then drop to the ground, gang up with other ticks and then wait for a new host to latch onto. Drop the moose population density low enough and the ticks looking for new host dont find one and the tick population drops. Note the whitetail population in the region is very sparse and they actively groom for ticks so they are not a backup host of any significance. I expect the boom bust cycle of moose population happens in nature just no one around to see it.
    Last edited by peakbagger; 03-02-2019 at 11:16.

  13. #53
    Registered User
    Join Date
    09-08-2014
    Location
    Georgia
    Age
    66
    Posts
    488

    Default

    Thanks,Peakbagger,I stand corrected.Here's an article I found.Note:always cook your lynx,bear,and Walrus to a minimum of 160 degrees F.I doubt all that many people will be inconvenienced though. https://www.adfg.alaska.gov/static/s..._parasites.pdf

  14. #54
    Registered User
    Join Date
    08-28-2007
    Location
    Georgia and Hawaii
    Posts
    17,315

    Default

    [QUOTE=peakbagger;2239315]...Kind of hard to genetically alter a moose to deal with massive blood loss. They do not inject a disease into the moose, they just suck its blood./QUOTE]

    Blood loss anemia. Get it. That's what takes the moose life. How can that be interrupted?

    Systemic insect controls involving plants are introduced via uptake of toxins or repellents making the plant unpalatable and toxic to the insects that might consume them, protecting the plant from within instead of through external insect foliar applications like insecticidal dusts and liquids. The insects "learn" to find food elsewhere or they die. Humans can introduce these controls but many plants have naturally evolved defenses that make them toxic to that which might or once had predated upon them. This approach might be considered if saving moose was made a priority as it was saving the Bald Eagle, the alligator or Channel Island fox, all positive examples of what humanity is capable when willing to make the effort. I was suggesting that could be an approach.

    However, as Five Tango stated ranchers run their animals to tick trough baths. Ever see a heavily infested cow, quite parasite alarming? Can moose populations in selected areas receive similar through feed or baths?

    Like mosquitos ticks have host preferences among the same host species. In another recent insect thread it was mentioned mosquitos are attracted through known chemical mechanisms - ammonia in sweat and urine and CO2 in human exhalation, for example. When those chemical scents/trails can be masked or diminished it has been shown humans are less prone to be bitten by mosquitos. Within the same environment, it has also been shown some humans are less prone to tick bites than others. This should be researched further. Ticks too have an olfactory component or chemical tag in initiating their feeding response, ammonia and CO2 are two compounds. It has been shown diet, for example, can affect a human's odds of appealing to mosquitos as a blood meal. This can be likened to a form of systemic control. Perhaps, with further research that approach can be used to protect the moose. In other words, there is something in blood or that's associated with a potential blood meal in mosquitos and ticks feeding cycle beyond warmth that make some hosts more or less prone to being a host.
    https://www.lymenet.nl/forum/viewtopic.php?t=4400 Much like pheromones involved in female humans being attracted to a male mate? i.e., better smell attractive men.

Page 3 of 3 FirstFirst 1 2 3
++ New Posts ++

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •