Ignoring the Shelters

[BobTheBuilder]

I'm a goal-oriented person, so setting daily distances based on shelters keeps me motivated. I don't usually sleep in them, preferring to hammock nearby, but it is usually a good place to eat and have a fire.

[tdoczi]

I also am now on the mindset of - If I am carrying this tent I am gunna use it every chance that I legally can. Which is another reason for the above mentality.

I know from personal experience that people use the shelter sites out of fear. Knowing that they probably will not be alone, there will be water there, whatever reason. But if people can break from that and dry camp, or use tenting sites - it may benefit them.

Thoughts? Can others relate?

i'm increasingly of the mindset "why am i carrying this piece of equipment i really dont want to use"? (and before someone goes there, dont read that as i am walking around without any sort of shelter in case of unexpected events).

i use the shelters out of a desire to maximum time spent hiking and minimize time spent not hiking. simple as that. me being the only one there is fine with me, preferable even. and i dont mind carrying water in from elsewhere.

[Huntmog]

Same as tdoczi...a year ago i was exclusively sleeping away from shelters due to solitude. Then a torrential rainstorm drove me to the paul c wolfe shelter and I learned....how amazing it is not dealing with a tent. Now i am almost exclusively in shelters. Unless milage lends itself differently, i.e. this summer i stayed up on ravens rocks, i much rather not hastle with a tent set up or take down.

Iv also learned that outside of bubble season, the socializing is over hyped. Most folks just bed down and everyones quiet by dark. To each his own though.

[Lone Wolf]

I just replied to littlerocks yellow springs thread about ignoring shelter sites which got me to thinking. A lot of folks wish the shelters were not there. But they are and always will be.

So on both my LDH's this year, I more or less excluded the shelters as nightly stops and chose camp sites that made sense with my day. The end result was more MPD, less annoyance of the cliental at shelters and overall I had a real great experience with that mentality. I would make sure that before I stopped I would have both smart water bottles filled up, and as well I carried a 2 liter sawyer bladder so I could fill that up if water was a couple miles prior to the tent site and then I had a full refill for the AM before leaving camp.

I also am now on the mindset of - If I am carrying this tent I am gunna use it every chance that I legally can. Which is another reason for the above mentality.

I know from personal experience that people use the shelter sites out of fear. Knoon the ATwing that they probably will not be alone, there will be water there, whatever reason. But if people can break from that and dry camp, or use tenting sites - it may benefit them.

Thoughts? Can others relate?

hate 'em. will never stay in one ever again. haven't for many years. not needed on the AT

[Gambit McCrae]

I have been in some torentual downpours on the trail. Some absolute rain all night “is this rain gunna rip thru my tent??!” Kinda downpours. I have never not ever once had an issue staying dry in my tent or thought “Man I wish I was in a shelter right now with a bunch of wet strangers.
But then again I am also the guy that preaches “buy once....”, “ya get what ya pay for...” etc etc...

i appreciate everyones input to the topic thus far, alot of thought in the responses

[Huntmog]

Gambit, let me clarify. No matter the tent, it still sucks to climb into one soaking wet with all of the wet gear. Especially with a hiking partner. I have 4 tents, 2 of which i would trust in any weather. It still is easier to sleep in a shelter in that weather than set up and break down in an ongoing storm.

[Dogwood]

It's more than just attracting more people. It's also the typical problems that tend to occur at places where people frequently congregate... such as issues with mice and bears. (Of course such 'problems' are not unique to shelters but also at popular camp sites as well).

And, garbage, contaminated water, exposed human feces and urine and soiled TP flowers, beaten down environments, nasty fire rings with food and packaging and all manner of other refuse, wildlife taken out of their natural patterns, depressed ground prone to mud and standing water, dog and "trail support animals" wastes not properly disposed, diseases/bacteria/viruses spread by human animals, noise/light/odor/other pollution point sources,... All from that loftiest supposedly most evolved most unique of animals, the human animal.


Very little appeal to staying at beaten down AT lean to's personally. But from the stand point of trail maintenance and exhibiting some control over the masses lean to's are fabulous.

[Huntmog]

And again i'll say that a year ago i wouldve sworn up and down in agreement with you. Could never understand the allure of shelters.

It also taught me to not knock it until i.v tried it....

[Dogwood]

I'm not of the opinion the AT doesn't need them. I'm of the knowing, I don't need them. If anything AT lean to locations tell me where NOT to sleep or NOT to gather water or NOT to linger.

[kevperro]

Shelters are great if you love rodents climbing on your face at night and enjoy listening to people snore. But it is an HYOH type of thing. I admit to using them when it made sense. If it is raining buckets shelters are a nice break. I was southbound though off-season. I cannot imagine what it would be like traveling north with the mob. I'd imagine shelter sites would be like visiting a small carnival in the thick of the thru-hiking season.

[MuddyWaters]

I have been in some torentual downpours on the trail. Some absolute rain all night “is this rain gunna rip thru my tent??!” Kinda downpours. I have never not ever once had an issue staying dry in my tent or thought “Man I wish I was in a shelter right now with a bunch of wet strangers.
But then again I am also the guy that preaches “buy once....”, “ya get what ya pay for...” etc etc...

i appreciate everyones input to the topic thus far, alot of thought in the responses

If its pouring
And you and gear is all wet

Everything gonna be wet when set up.
If its dry, it will be wet with condensation after take it out its little dry storage bag.

I hate hate hate setting up in rain, soaking wet. I dont mind hiking wet, but i like to dry up before setting up. Easy out west, hard on AT.

I will set up at 1 pm and call it a day to stay dry sometimes.
I can make those miles up another day, a nice day.
When people hike by me in rain after i set up before rain
I usually pass them next day while they drying their stuff

Shelters are handy in rain..especially for eating.

[Slo-go'en]

Gambit, I guess you've never been in a tent when the wind from a thunderstorm rips out the stakes and it collapses on top of ya. Fun you bet.

More often then not I'll opt to set up my tent at a shelter location rather then use the shelter which still has plenty of room. I have on occasion used a established and documented tent site between shelters. But only if there is water near-by.

What I will not do is leave a shelter area an hour or two before dark, hoping to find some random spot along the trail to camp at. That will often bite you in the butt and you'll end up having a very uncomfortable night on the side of a hill. Once you get into Virginia, the number of places one can set up camp along the side of the trail without a lot of site work is limited, by both vegetation and terrain. Finding a good spot as the sun is setting is like winning the power ball. It does happen, but rarely.

[Gambit McCrae]

Muddy / Slo- I respect you guys experience but have not had the same experiences. I have many times walked all day in the pouring rain. All my things are in a dyneema roll top pack liner. Set up the tent wet. Put pack against trekking pole, close door. Sit on tent floor and get out my 1 of 2 dry pack towels. Dry tent floor if needed. Change clothes. Put wet clothes in corner of tent. Put on dry clothes. Now i am sheltered(takes me about 2 minutes to setup my duplex). Now i can get out my dry pad, and sleeping bag. And let it continue to rain all night for all i care.
I have had a callapsed tent issue twice: once on jane bald in the roan highlands prior to a hurricane(was an awesomely violant night) and once at the shelter near wolf road in MD during a downpour on a tent pad that became eroded during the night.
As for VA being hard to find sleeping spots I cant relate. I completed Va in 13 trips. Most of which starting at between 10 pm friday night and 1am saturday morning. To me, if I only have to walk a couple miles after leaving the parking lot? No big deal. If i have to walk 6-11 miles after driving 5 hours to get to a designated spot? Turn on the enjoyment mode. I just sat in a car for 5 hours to walk. Now im walking. So lets walk till we find a spot to crash for the night.

I understand some folks like the shelters. And that others do not. The point of the thread was to let people exercise their thought process to brouden trip plans, to not limit themselves to hunkering down at the bold shelter location in the guide books.

I enjoy toms response the most. Everyone is at a different experience level. And the shelters serve their place. I personally am at a point where i feel more free on the AT ignoring the shelters as a “must have” destination for the night. My fear is, entering the whites in 2019, i will have to reverse this new found mentality, to stay at places i do not wish to stay at. Similar to the smokies

[rickb]

My fear is, entering the whites in 2019, i will have to reverse this new found mentality, to stay at places i do not wish to stay at. Similar to the smokies

The good news is the shelter areas in the Whites are generally in good condition, thanks in large measure to the AMC, which subsidizes about 50% of the cost to maintain them with member dues and profits from the Huts.

What makes the decision on whether or not to camp elsewhere difficult is the mix of places where camping at non designate sites is strictly prohibited or where it is simply impractical, and where it is absolutely wonderful.

There seem to be a lot more of the former than the latter - but worth the effort to consider all options.

[Odd Man Out]

I have never slept in a shelter. I do exactly what the OP described. About an hour before sunset I start looking for camp sites, by looking around and by checking maps. I will usually stop at a shelter for meals but then hike on to sleep elsewhere, even if it's only a mile or two. If I'm not cooking at the camp site, I don't worry so much about water. But love the OP I have two extra bladders I can fill up for dry camping where i have to cook. My best camp site ever was on the top of Sinking Creek Mtn. I could see from the map there was a long ridge walk with no water. I figued i may noy get down the other side befor sunset so I carried enough water for dinner and camping. I will stop in a shelter to sit out a storm, but have not yet had to set up camp in the rain. On my last SNP hike I was really lucky to come up to a shelter literally just seconds before a tremendous storm rolled in. But when it calms down, I keep hiking. However all these shelter stops are just fotuitous. I never plan a days schedule around shelter locations.

[TexasBob]

Gambit, I guess you've never been in a tent when the wind from a thunderstorm rips out the stakes and it collapses on top of ya. Fun you bet. ...............

This. Being in a shelter during a vicious thunderstorm beats a tent every time in my book. Tenting in nice weather is great but shelters have their own charm when the weather turns nasty.

[wordstew]

If you are talking about the 7 individuals killed on the AT proper, at least 6 of them were killed at shelters.

Molly LaRue, 25, from Shaker Heights, Ohio
Geoffrey Hood, 26, from Signal Mountain, Tennessee
Susan Ramsey, 27 from Ellsworth Maine
Robert Mountford, 27, from Ellsworth, Maine
Janice Balza, 22, from Madison, Wisconsin
Joel Polsom, 26, of Hartsville, South Carolina

The exact location of the killing of 7th individual, Scott Lilly, has not been published, though his body was found not far from one.

Other murders have been associated with the AT (bring the total to 11) but none of those were on the Trail itself. However in one of those crimes, one of the victims and her partner had an uncomfortable run in with the killer at an AT shelter.

One common thread to each murder at a shelter is that they occurred at time well outside of the busy season and the bubble of thru hikers. Another commonality is that all (or most, not sure about Joel Polsom) were AT thru hikers or in one case, a long-distance section hiker

Well from the looks at the list of people killed you you don't have to worry about getting murdered on or near the AT if you're older then your twenties

[QiWiz]

I tend to avoid shelters unless weather is awful. I may stop to socialize and even make a meal (usually dinner) but then usually move on to a more quiet and non-mousy place to camp. My shelter is small enough to fit just about anywhere I can throw down a sleeping pad. I tend to be an early to rise and early to bed kind of hiker. I sleep better and disturb others less when not in shelters. YMMV

[Gambit McCrae]

This. Being in a shelter during a vicious thunderstorm beats a tent every time in my book. Tenting in nice weather is great but shelters have their own charm when the weather turns nasty.

Geepers what in the world do the poor souls do on trails without shelters during those dreadful thundersterms? I guess they just sleep it out in collapsed tents everywhere.

3500 trail miles, 1 collapsed tent due to wind...Ill take my chances. I have many times arrived to an empty shelter location in the rain and set my tent up. I sleep as well in my tent as I do at home and personally love nothing more then the sound of rain hitting my tent. So I cant wait to have it set up during rain. Rain is rain, its all wet. Heavy rain or light rain ill be over here in my tent.

[Slo-go'en]

I guess I'm a lot more selectitve about where I camp then some of you. I'm also convinced that those who wander off the trail and into the brush to camp are much more likely to encounter Lyme infected ticks then those who stay on the trail and camp in well trodden areas clear of vegetation.