This is getting crazy

[Venchka]

Ahem, quit advertising it I'd like to keep it that way, very little use.

One of my favorite places to hike, too.

Ditto Ditto Ditto.
For anyplace that’s not yet ruined!
Wayne

[importman77]

Go take a gander at Alum Cave, Newfound Gap or the Chimney Tops Trail in the smokies on a pretty Sat or Sun, cars parked for as far as the eye can see.

The Byron Reece Parking lot down at Neel gap, overflowing.

I've seen those, you're not kidding. Another one albeit a short one is Laurel Falls down from the Sugarlands Visitor center on little river road. Unreal.

[KnightErrant]

I'm with Puddlefish-- I'm thrilled that hiking is getting more popular. LNT is more important than ever if increased use is going to be sustainable, but I think new people getting out of cities and into nature during their free time makes me more hopeful for society in general.

My family lives near McAfee's Knob, and when I see that parking lot overflowing every weekend, I think it's great! When I go, I try not complain about the "crowds" because we all have equal claim to the enjoyment of public land. I've been going there for years, and I donate to ATC and volunteer with RATC, and now I've done a thru-hike, and I have absolutely no more right to be there than the teen who saw an Instagram pic and wanted her own selfie there. How could I whine about someone else enjoying the exact same activity I'm enjoying, even if our motivation to be out there is different?

[Dogwood]

I'm with Puddlefish-- I'm thrilled that hiking is getting more popular. LNT is more important than ever if increased use is going to be sustainable, but I think new people getting out of cities and into nature during their free time makes me more hopeful for society in general.

My family lives near McAfee's Knob, and when I see that parking lot overflowing every weekend, I think it's great! When I go, I try not complain about the "crowds" because we all have equal claim to the enjoyment of public land. I've been going there for years, and I donate to ATC and volunteer with RATC, and now I've done a thru-hike, and I have absolutely no more right to be there than the teen who saw an Instagram pic and wanted her own selfie there. How could I whine about someone else enjoying the exact same activity I'm enjoying, even if our motivation to be out there is different?

The degree of interest and usage is a double edged sword.

LNT even if it was optimally applied doesn't address the complexity of challenges.

As we recently observed on a LNT thread LNT educators were seen by some as interfering nosing into - personal - outdoor affairs unnecessarily. Consider these were campers and hikers making those comments on that thread.

Then, there is, "...we all have equal claim to the enjoyment of public land." What happens when the "all" include those far more organized, powerful, and financed that also strongly assert implementing their version of "equal claim" to access their definition of "enjoyment of public land?"

[Slo-go'en]

Then, there is, "...we all have equal claim to the enjoyment of public land." What happens when the "all" include those far more organized, powerful, and financed that also strongly assert implementing their version of "equal claim" to access their definition of "enjoyment of public land?"

Especially those who own ATVs.

[KnightErrant]

Perhaps "enjoyment" of public land was too vague a term, because obviously I don't want a swarm of ATVs on a designated walking path, and I suppose that is how some people would define their enjoyment.

But besides the question of making trails handicapped accessible-- in which case equal accessibility would come at the cost of substantially impacting the environment, making it a much more complex issue than simple equality-- I don't see how how the statement "we all have equal claim [to hike on a hiking trail]" is controversial. Maybe my post was overly simplistic, but the point was that just because someone's a Real Hiker TM who has been hiking the trail since before it was popular, he/she doesn't have more right to the trail than the Fake Instagram Hikers TM who learned about it more recently. Both on my thru-hike this year and online, I've found it humorous more than once to note just how hipster a lot of long-term A.T. hikers can sound when they talk about the trail being "ruined" by new hikers. For folks who tend to mock hipster millennials relentlessly, they can sound eerily similar to a flannel-clad twenty-something talking about how much better a band's music was before they got, like, mainstream, you know?

*NOT* to discount the very real negative impact of overuse like erosion, litter, wildlife losing fear of people, etc. These are legitimate problems that need solutions: better (and more tactful) LNT education? More resources designated for trail maintenance? Caps on visitors in particularly fragile environments? I think it's great to discuss and solve real problems caused by increased traffic on the trail. But I think it's a bit absurd when long-term hikers accuse other people of being a problematic crowd on "their" trail. When I hear people complain about the crowd at McAfee's on a Saturday (when they too have chosen to hike McAfee's on a Saturday), all I hear is "HOW DARE all these other people want to do the same thing I'm doing, GOSH." It's silly.