We are expecting the first leg of the hike to take us 5.5 days (cottonwood to MTR)Originally Posted by MuddyWaters
No need to help hope. The information is online. Straight from ULA.
“2. CARRYING A BEAR CAN?
Do you plan on backpacking in California, or somewhere else bear canisters are required? If so, look no further than the Catalyst or Circuit — only these 2 packs will haul a bear canister with remaining room for your other gear. The Catalyst will hold a BearVault BV500 — horizontally or vertically. The Circuit will carry the BV500 vertically only. These canisters will fit in other packs but will take up much of the pack body, limiting space for the rest of your gear. The smaller BV450 will fit in all of our packs, but you will need to pack your remaining gear with care.”
Wayne
Double post
Last edited by MuddyWaters; 07-21-2018 at 21:10.
Have you double checked that mileage and planned days?
Cottonwood to mtr is 130 miles or so i think. Are you redupplying at onion valley etc?
I could fit 8.5 days in my weekender at home. At mtr....only 7.5, even already having practiced packing it. Lots of hikers with nps rental garcias that found it holds 5 days, and they had 10.
Last edited by MuddyWaters; 07-21-2018 at 21:15.
I did HI to WP in 17 days (averaging about 13mpd). Based on the the people I would (or wouldn't) repeatedly encounter, I seemed to be going faster than 60-75% of other hikers.
Yes, we are going to resupply in Independence. I honestly think I COULD fit my food inside the scout, but it would leave no room for my other "smellables".
I like having my gear inside my pack. Having a heavy bear can strapped to the top of my pack doesnt sound ideal.
We just finished the High Sierra Trail and could have done the whole thing without bear canisters.
Sequoia/Kings National Parks has a lot of backcountry food storage lockers aka "Bear Boxes". For a JMT start from Horseshoe Meadows/Cottonwood you could camp by a bear box every night until Woods Creek. This way your small bear can will be plenty big for the portion from Woods Creek to Muir Trail Ranch or Vermillion Valley Resort. (Note that through hikers not exiting/entering Whitney Portal must camp no higher than Crabtree Meadow to do Whitney, that way you have a bear box and pit toilet. Above Crabtree you must carry out your excrement in a WAG bag)
Bear boxes are shown on the Sequoia Kings Website maps website. https://www.nps.gov/seki/planyourvisit/maps.htm Choose "Online Mapping Tools Sequoia & Kings Canyon Park Atlas", choose "I Want To Change Visible Map Layers" Choose "Hiking And Backpacking" then turn on "Food Storage Boxes", "Trails", etc.
I'm taking the BV450. Im going no cook. I eat 1.25 lbs of food per day on hikes less than a month. I packed up my BV450 yesterday and got 6 days of food in it. That's about 10 lbs of food. It went in easily and I could have fit a little more in there. Our longest carry is 6.5 days. Both my girlfriend and I are carrying our own canister since it just packs better in our ULA Ohms. Base weight is 12.1 lbs and 11.5 lbs with both of us carrying our own bear canister
Food consisted mainly of bars, nuts, dehydrated fruits, jerky.
Edit: that's about 8 lbs of food...
Weekender fit in my pack easily.
This is a goodguideline
988667_594168480617261_1580489510_n.jpg
I get a similar 7, and when needed, a few times 8 days, cook or no cook food into a BV450 for 1P at teh same daily 1.25 lbs. Yet, BV states it's a 4 day food can. BTW, your 6 days food at 1.25 lbs is 7.5 lbs. We've demonstrated when one can reduce the volume and daily wt of their consumables bear can food holding capacity recommendations can be extended up to twice as many days. I've heard of those more food advanced(like taking mainly powders) getting 9 even 10 days in a BV 450. This is another example of how wisely reducing consumable volume and wt while understanding personal needs and backpacking style plays so significantly into wt saving backpacking. It's why I harp on consumable volume and wt so often. It's the wt and volume category that is routinely overlooked by the primarily gear wt saving chit chat crowd. Under this scenario I'll do one smaller resupply and/or possibly supplement quickly at MTR, VVR, TM, Reds, and start a morning SOBO eating Bfast at YV or at WP Cafe. First days food is stored outside the pack. That allows for up to 9 1/2 days food which accommodates plenty of Sierra lookie loo around time(fishing, going off route, photography, peak bagging, watching pikas chasing each other, Speedo splashing, etc).
As Hipbone states a JMT Thru is a "short LD" hike so body wt loss is not that significant if it does happen. JMT is a well used trail. When I'm carrying the can I tend to use a frameless ULA CDT. It goes inside the pack. Typical JMT thru timeframes I'll have a sub 9 lb base wt. with the 2 lb can. I could definitely use a lesser volume pack than the ULA CDT in this situation but I use what I have. Hipbone's ULA Ohm is a good alternative. When on a get er dun JMT thru I dont take a can and use a MLD Burn. And, I stay legal.
QUOTE=blue indian;2216232]We are expecting the first leg of the hike to take us 5.5 days (cottonwood to MTR)[/QUOTE]
Two people? That's a Weekender.
Two people? That's a Weekender.[/QUOTE]All good advice. Also 7.5 lbs of food is 8 lbs if you count wrappers...that was my discrepancy (10 lbs in the original post was 8 lbs of food plus a 2 lb bv450)
I find the Ohm to be a really good size for a bv450. Its a good size but I like frameless...so I took out the Ohms frame hoop. It's essentially a bigger CDT with the Ohm hip belt (I like the Ohm hip belt pockets). My BV450 stands up and I pack soft things around it. This is my first hike with the bv450 (or any bear canister) so I'll let you know how it goes when I get back :-)
Thanks Dogwood and Hipbone! Super solid info, just the kind of was looking for.
THe Bearikade Scout is 60 cu in larger than the BV450. I have a similar food and gear (weight) loadout as Hipbone. It sounds like I could easily fit 5.5 days of food in it. It should also fit nicely into my ULA OHM.
I totally forgot about the bear box rule! Thank you !
Except that I can fit the black garcia can (the one that the park/forest services rent) inside the much smaller ULA CDT, so I know that isn't necessarily true. You do have to be very careful how you pack it so you don't distort (eg. make even rounder), the back of the pack else it will pull on the shoulder straps more and you will feel it after several hours. Like a lot of things, they give the lowest common denominator answer so that even inexperienced people can do it.
Double post. I know I only hit the submit button once.
IMO non freezer bag Ziploc(double seal) standard size sandwich bags are heavy at about an avg 1.62 grams. They aren't always needed. The 1.2 - 1.5 mil thickness is often overkill. Ziploc freezer bag thickness is 3 mil. Cheaper off brand standard sandwich size Dollar Store and Walmart Brand(Great Value) one time use ones with a thinner mil(thickness) and single seal(non fold over) have weighed .82 to 1.34 grams on my scales. Fold over standard bags weigh less but have the habit of spilling contents and releasing odors. Same size Ziplocs with sliders are heavier too. 28.35 grams in an ounce. No need to allow for 1 oz or more of food packaging wt each day. Choose food that isn't sharp that pokes through thinner bags. Roll up baggies. Use a thin rubber band weighing .5- .7 gram if desired. One dinner always fits into such baggie. An XL sandwich size Great Value baggie weighing 1.12 grams fits two dinners for me. Snack size baggies are exactly that. They are used for a diversity of consumed on the move snacks combined with bars.
The biggest wasters of volume and added packaging wt for food are of the prepackaged store bought Mountain House, Backpackers Pantry, etc type. Always repack these. You dont need moisture absorbers when food is going to be shortly consumed either. These type meals are probably what bear can manufacturers are basing their total days food capacity.
In the northern 1/2 to 2/3 of the JMT it's rather logistically easy(I'd say within most people's ability if they looked into it) to never carry more than 3 days food and legally avoid carrying a bear can altogether. Southern half is more strenuous. One would have to adjust their approach more. Use Jimqpublic's info. It's been shared here on WB several times previous. As an aside, my guesstimate is that if this info gets out with more trying to skirt bear can carries it will lead to illegality, inappropriate execution of doing it as rules mandate, and greater negative bear/human encounters. The NPS and others will mandate a bear can carry with no loop holes from JMT start to JMT finish regardless.
If all this sounds extreme maybe it is but IMHO so is paying $600 sometimes more for a cuben shelter that saves a person 3 oz from their current shelter or a cuben backpack that may or may not save an oz or two from a comparable Dyneema X or Robic pack.
Yeah, but you cant take it with you, so what.
I recall a puchaser of cuben CDT that was upset the pack had NO wt savings at all after spending $300. They obviously didnt do the math first.
Internet myth or legend says that one enterprising soul embarking on a Brooks Range traverse or something similar after filling his bear can proceeded to fill the remaining voids with a quick cooking grain. Oats, grits, etc.
I read it on the Internet. It must be true.
Bon apetite!
Wayne
250 miles, 20 days, 3 neros with one true zero; John Muir Trail complete!
Entered at Cottonwood pass and exited in Yosemite with a sunrise summit of Half Dome that morning.
Im still trying to process everything that has happened over the past few weeks but what an adventure....
Im going to post about some things I found interesting or that surprised me along with a quick gear "likes and dislikes"
Things that surprised me:
1. THe amount of people on trail. Im not sure if hikers were concentrated bc of the fire issues but we saw a minimum of 15 people each day. Ive seen less people on AT section hikes..
2. The hike was harder than I was expecting. I guess I was expecting more of that "PCT tread".
3. THe weather was imacculate; we got rained on once for 40 minutes on day 4. I only used my puffy once and rained jacket for 40 minutes the entire hike.
4. Bugs; I didnt get bite by a single mosquito. I might have seen 8 total.
5. There was more forested hiking than I was expecting;I could have hammocked camped every single night (the exception was Guitar lake) without even really planning to.
Gear likes:
1. Zpacks Duplex- I am a hammock guy on the east coast, grabbed this tent specifically for this trip and loved it. SUper easy to set up and weighs a little over a lb. People get all worried about a single walled tent and condensation so I paid close attention to my friends double walled tents and condensation. Any time I had issues with it, their tents were soaked too. I only had condensation issues a few times. I slept with at least 1 door open at all times (mostly 2 though)
2. BRS titatnium stove- I was concerned about its performance at high elevations but she did was she was meant to do. Horrible in windy conidtions but make a little effort to protect it and you will be fine.
ULA ohm- tried and true; its the older version
Gear dislikes:
1. Katadyn Befree- This filter was amazing. For about 40 miles. After that the bag developed a pinhole leak and the filter slowed down considerably. I backflushed it 2-3 times. As much as I wanted to love this filter when compared with my old Sawyer Squeeze, I could not recommend this filter.
2. Black Diamond Ion headlamp- So Im going to put this on my "dislike" list bc it ultimately failed, albeit on the last day. It was relatively new headlamp but on the last morning going up Half Dome in the dark it refused to turn on. Replaced the batteries and nothing. SO it was everything I needed until it didnt work anymore.
3. Smartwool PHD socks- I was so disappointed with these. They were brand new for the hike and developed holes in both heels in under 80 miles resulting in a blister. I guess my shoes could have had something to do with it but my last pair lasted much longer. I bought Darn Toughs in Mammoth
The scenery was so interesting and consistent that I became spoiled quickly and probably took advantage of it; almost expecting it.
Favorite areas
1. Kings Canyon National Park. Simply amazing and wild.
2. VVR- favorite stop along the way; good people,good food, good beer, good times. highly recommended.
3. Even though its not on the JMT our sunrise summit at Half Dome was too cool. We only shared it with 4 others while seeing HUNDREDS of people on the way down into Yosemite Valley (which was a zoo btw but it was also a holiday weekend)
4. Evolution Valley
5. Ansel Adams wilderness
Thank you WB for helping me make my first first thru hike a success. It wont be my last! Im going to attempt the mini triple crown. Long Trail fall 2019...?!? CHeers !
Posting Permissions
Reply With Quote