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  1. #61
    Registered User Just Bill's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Chair-man View Post
    There's always a risk on the trail or anywhere. I would think some guy attempting a FKT would be for more concerned with ticks, rattlers & bears than someone making him squeal like a pig.
    Joey is pretty tough, pretty fearless- he's terrified of ticks.

    Sometimes the simplest answer is the truth.
    On her PCT hike, the chief source of controversy for Heather's claim was that people were TOO inspired by her hike. And came out to specifically provide trail magic to her. This culminated in a well meaning, but poorly informed, boyfriend who surprised her with a pizza.

    On Joey's first AT attempt; his family did the same for him and came out to host a hiker feed or sorts in anticipation of running into Joey. Unfortunately his hike was not successful from an FKT standpoint, but if it was he would have had to face a similar issue that Heather did.

    There are many reasons to delay your tracking location. With no comment on it's validity- Nature Boy's assault is brought up as a safety reason. And just because it hasn't happened, as things grow, personal safety could become a real concern. Anything from a Nancy Kerrigan/Tonya Harding problem to simpler motives could be easily imagined if one wanted to.

    That said: As I have said before, the primary reason for all the guidelines is to protect the person on the attempt.
    Not revealing your location in real time means that your loved ones, fans, or well wishers are unlikely to attempt to reach you. Heather was very emphatic on this in here AT FKT announcement precisely to avoid any controversy with her hike.

    As has been said- why go to all the trouble to attempt a FKT, and not take simple steps to ensure that it is a valid one?
    At the root of it all- that is the simple truth. The guidelines preserve the integrity of the effort. They have been developed and evolved over the years in reaction to problems with each attempt. Scott did several hikes before he finally went solo and refined his standards. Heather refined her guidelines after her first FKT. Joey learned lessons from his first attempt and reached out to Matt to try and improve transparency, while maintaining anonymity.

    Williamson said no cars- why? So nobody could garner an advantage, and nobody could claim he got one. How do you prove that a hitch you received was not planned? You simply refuse to get in a car, and you institute that guideline so that the issue is never discussed again.

    Heather refused to disclose her real time location. Why? So nobody could ever claim that she garnered any advantages. How do you prove that trail magic was truly random? If nobody knows where you are, nobody can help or harm you.

    I have proposed eliminating trail magic for that reason. I feel it's as clean as on Scott's stance on vehicles.
    If you refuse all trail magic of any kind then nobody can claim you got any inappropriate assistance.

    However that may be one too far. But to me it seems a logical step.
    It invites questions, but it also then invites anyone at anytime to say that they 'helped' somebody. So it gets to be a difficult standard to disprove too.
    Trail magic is also a big part of long distance hiking, something that makes it special. So I understand the mixed feelings from that standpoint as well.

    Matt and Joey are doing something unique. It's a beta version. I think it shows a lot of progress in evolving to meet all the goals.
    Yar I hyped it up as a good way for spectators to participate- but the plain simple truth is it protects the integrity of the hike.

    Stringbean was doing well with his insty feed, but without a clear head and amidst all the problems encountered on one of these solo... it may be too much to manage.
    Matt's system is on auto pilot. Pings go out, they automatically get delayed, and when finished- the same set of GPS evidence we were all watching gets released. You can't fudge the story and you don't have to 'match up' or clean up any thing.

    When Matt pioneered his hike he was pacing, not racing. He was in many ways an explorer. His goal was simply to find out if it could be done, and in doing so- document that trip so others could follow. That extra level of documentation took time. Holding back in spots to ensure he made it took time.

    But he did prove it could be done. And now he's helping others to race. To put it all on the line, devote every ounce of mental energy to going faster.
    The guidelines ensure that if you do win that race, nobody would question your effort.

    I'm not saying we are there yet, but we're getting closer.
    The two go hand in hand- racing and documenting the race. I really do feel this is easier than before, but that might be it's own problem too. We take for granted many things these days, including technology. This is a hiking website- we all understand that things fail. But we also all love hiking because at the end of the day it comes down not to gizmos or gear you have- but who you are. Even if everything fails; do you? That is the ultimate responsibility that underlies backpacking. It's why you can't lie to the trail, the only thing you are really exploring is yourself.

    It is also the underling truth to a self-supported or unsupported FKT.
    Did you fill your head with enough knowledge to get yourself out of any jamb.
    Did you prepare your mental lists, backups, self made guidelines and hard rules that protect you from failures.
    Do you know and trust the gear you brought, the systems you've developed, the style you hike with.

    Have you prepared your body for the task at hand, realized it and your mind are the only gear you truly carry.
    Do you accept that you have taken personal responsibility for all the many things nature will throw at you.

    Do you accept that if everything fails, you are on your own.

    In short- have you traveled the trail as a backpacker?

    That is perhaps the word most easily taken for granted these days. It carries quite a bit of weight, has a very serious meaning and life or death implications. But 'long distance hiking' is not quite the same thing. The trails are easier to access, the penalty for failures is relatively low. To an extent though this simple difference in backpacking and hiking is at the root of the issues with these hikes. To some of us, it's inconceivable to not be willing and able to accept all those responsibilities. For others, there's an app for that. There is a gizmo or gadget missing from their list. Some magic bullet to resolve it.
    There are hardships, problems, failures, issues, and times you just have to bail. Bailing is good sound strategy really. But there are no excuses. Excuses are for those who stay home and cite all these reasons to avoid taking the ultimate responsibility for your life and your actions. Who haven't come up with good sound answers to all the what if's of doubt that might keep you at home or in the state park. Even the gulf between those who backpack in a group versus those who go solo is vast. We discuss the problems with making that transition often enough here.

    Like many here I don't follow running or general FKT's. I respect them as athletic achievements.
    For me- A solo FKT is nothing more and nothing less than a very fast backpacker.
    I feel that all the limitations, responsibilities, and consequences of backpacking are only magnified in an effort to also explore the physical limits of your body.
    I don't care how fast you go, many backpackers intimately understand exactly what these people are doing, and what's special about it.

    If you want to race, get a crew, get support, go race. There is great reward there too.
    If you want to go solo then take sole responsibility for everything.
    Including the fact that the guidelines were put there to help you- not hold you back. To prevent you from cheating yourself.

    If somehow, despite all the thousands of reasons you should have failed you show up with no excuses and succeed... the reward is all yours.
    And it's got nothing to do with the clock, or a website, or anyone else. The community won't discuss it, no one will review it, nobody can judge it.
    If you get that lucky, odds are good you'll do your best to help someone else do the same.

  2. #62

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    Quote Originally Posted by Chair-man View Post
    There's always a risk on the trail or anywhere. I would think some guy attempting a FKT would be for more concerned with ticks, rattlers & bears . . .
    Agreed - for some guy or gal.

  3. #63

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    Progressing as expected with more complexities and concerns including honesty and verification with some saying this is how it is to be done...perhaps rightly so but meh.

  4. #64

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    I see it like a test in school.

    Make a 99 on majority of questions, but get caught cheating on a single one, and you dont get a grade of 99, you get a 0. Even though that one was inconsequential.

    The rules....is part of the test. Set by the current record holder.
    It must be your own work. All of it.
    Last edited by MuddyWaters; 08-30-2017 at 16:36.

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