Training and First Aid Kits.

[BuckeyeBill]

I know that the contents of a first aid kit has been kicked around a lot on here. The majority say some band-aides, some neosporin, some moleskin or second skin and duct tape is all you need. Other will toss in a few Tylenol or Ibuprofen and a couple of Imodium, all with keeping things light.

Now lets say someone else or yourself have had formal training, (i.e. EMT/Paramedic and/or Certified Wilderness First Aide) would you consider carrying just a few more items because you have training to do more both for yourself or for others? I am not suggesting anything like a full suture kit, but a couple clotting bandages, maybe an ACE bandage. Not to make light of someone seriously hurting themselves, but you can't look at them and say "Damn dude, duct tape ain't gonna fix that." I am sure there are or have been doctors, nurses, EMTs, Paramedics, or people trained in outdoor first aide that hike. I am not suggesting these people should be required to carry extra items. I am just thinking about coming up on someone who has taken a header on the rocks of Pennsylvania or somewhere else. Some band-aides and duct tape won't help much with a gash to head, as head wounds tend to bleed a lot, even if it is small. Situations like this can't be ignored, unless you are totally heartless.

Yes? No? Maybe?

[egilbe]

Duct tape fixes everything.

[Riocielo]

Duct tape fixes everything.

My husband, who adamantly refuses to seek medical attention for most things, came to show me the hole he had accidentally drilled in his palm. The first words out of his mouth were "I am not going to the ER."

A little super-glue and some duct tape and he was all back together. It healed well without even a scar.

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[Dogwood]

Good question Buckeye bill. Being certified in Wilderness First Aid(16 hr, 2 day class) and as a First Responder ABSOLUTELY YES I do sometimes carry more than the most UL most basic FKT. A BIG FAT NO to duct tape fixing everything!!!

[egilbe]

Good question Buckeye bill. Being certified in Wilderness First Aid(16 hr, 2 day class) and as a First Responder ABSOLUTELY YES I do sometimes carry more than the most UL most basic FKT. A BIG FAT NO to duct tape fixing everything!!!

Name something that requires first aid that you cant use duct tape. sucking chest wound? check. Splint a fracture? Check. tape over a guaze bandage? Check. Tourniquet? Check. Dorect pressure over a bleeding wound? Check.

[BuckeyeBill]

Name something that requires first aid that you cant use duct tape. sucking chest wound? check. Splint a fracture? Check. tape over a guaze bandage? Check. Tourniquet? Check. Dorect pressure over a bleeding wound? Check.

You have obviously never scene a skull that has been smashed on a rocks where there is a visible depression. You are not going to fix it with duct tape. I have also seen sliced arteries where someone was playing with their "Rambo" knife and s**t happened. Arteries need very hard direct pressure and/or pressure at a point where the artery is near a bone to stem the blood flow that you are not going to get from any type of tape. I have training as a paramedic and have taken the Wilderness First aid Course, Money well spent IMHO.

I have spoken to ER doctors about small suture kits and it was about a 50-50 split on carrying one. The doctors that said it is a good idea, because only you can judge the serious nature of the injury at the time. Even the ones that said no, did agree that there are areas that it might not be a bad idea if you are in areas that is far from rescue personnel. At this point in time I don't carry a suture kit, but I do have one in my reserve gear at home.

I can honestly say that I am not going to use just duct tape to fix a sucking chest wound. It requires a totally non-porous covering and while DT is strong, it is still somewhat porous. Now I may use it to tape the edges down. I have gotten into the habit of carrying climbers tape for blisters and other FA needs. It stays on you even in wet, sweaty and humid conditions. It is also thinner than duct tape.

[OCDave]

You have obviously never scene a skull that has been smashed on a rocks where there is a visible depression. You are not going to fix it with duct tape.....

Curious; what you are carrying in your pack that will "fix" this skull?

[Don H]

I'm a retired Fire Department Paramedic who still holds an EMT license. During my thru my FAK weighed about 3 ounces. Bandaids, Neosporin, a safety pin, Tylenol, aspirin (for heart attack), Imodium AD, 3' of Leukotape was about all I carried.

I actually had two situations that I came upon that were, or could have been true health emergencies. First was an asthma attack where the person needed help with their inhaler. the second was a diabetic with low blood sugar, fixed that with a Snickers Bar.

Broken bones can be temporarily splinted with sticks and a torn up T shirt. Direct pressure using a bandana or shirt can be used for controlling bleeding. Suturing wounds is not realistic. Anything that serious needs debridement first which you can't effectively do in the field.

Carrying an Ace bandage might be a good idea, it's good for sprains and controlling bleeding.

The most important thing to carry is knowledge of basic first aid. Take a Wilderness FirstAid or First Responder course.

[ScareBear]

I'm a retired Fire Department Paramedic who still holds an EMT license. During my thru my FAK weighed about 3 ounces. Bandaids, Neosporin, a safety pin, Tylenol, aspirin (for heart attack), Imodium AD, 3' of Leukotape was about all I carried.

I actually had two situations that I came upon that were, or could have been true health emergencies. First was an asthma attack where the person needed help with their inhaler. the second was a diabetic with low blood sugar, fixed that with a Snickers Bar.

Broken bones can be temporarily splinted with sticks and a torn up T shirt. Direct pressure using a bandana or shirt can be used for controlling bleeding. Suturing wounds is not realistic. Anything that serious needs debridement first which you can't effectively do in the field.

Carrying an Ace bandage might be a good idea, it's good for sprains and controlling bleeding.

The most important thing to carry is knowledge of basic first aid. Take a Wilderness FirstAid or First Responder course.

I understand this post is in the AT section and that some of the following applies to more remote/rugged/dangerous settings.

Suturing being realistic is often dependent on the injury and the ETA to a facility than can have a physician suture you. Going on a 3 week Grand Canyon permit expedition? You'll likely find a couple of skin staplers, along with suture kits, scalpels, SAM splints and other emergency field gear. I've usually got a suture kit, with me on all my AT hikes. Weighs nothing. Same with super glue and steri-strips. I'm not going to activate my SPOT when I am 24 hours or more from a viable road crossing when I or my partner have an injury that can be dealt with immediately and then more professionally, if needed. Same with safety-pins. It sucks to have to use them on a wound, but sometimes, there isn't any good alternative, even if you are staying put until help arrives. Which, depending on where your are, can be quite a good while...

I think the hemostats weigh the most in my little kit...

All of the above requires sufficient prior training and isn't field-craft to be learned on the fly. But, with sufficient prior training can be put to use when necessary or desired. I would not dismiss sutures, staplers, super-glue or the like as overkill or not needed.

YMMV

[OCDave]

It is all about what you carry in your head, very little about what you carry in your pack.

[TexasBob]

Good question Buckeye bill. Being certified in Wilderness First Aid(16 hr, 2 day class) and as a First Responder ABSOLUTELY YES I do sometimes carry more than the most UL most basic FKT..............

I'm a retired Fire Department Paramedic who still holds an EMT license. During my thru my FAK weighed about 3 ounces. Bandaids, Neosporin, a safety pin, Tylenol, aspirin (for heart attack), Imodium AD, 3' of Leukotape was about all I carried.............

Question I have is do you guys carry exam gloves to limit expose to blood in case you need to help someone who is bleeding? I did for awhile but then I quit. I am curious as to your thoughts on this.

[BuckeyeBill]

Question I have is do you guys carry exam gloves to limit expose to blood in case you need to help someone who is bleeding? I did for awhile but then I quit. I am curious as to your thoughts on this.

I usually have a pair or two stuffed in a Ziploc.

[Dogwood]

And, definitely include gloves when with others.

[Riocielo]

Question I have is do you guys carry exam gloves to limit expose to blood in case you need to help someone who is bleeding? I did for awhile but then I quit. I am curious as to your thoughts on this.

Nitrile gloves are light as a feather and are good under your regular gloves to keep your hands warm, too. Having said that, I only carry a pair if I suspect cold days.


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[One Half]

I'm a retired Fire Department Paramedic who still holds an EMT license. During my thru my FAK weighed about 3 ounces. Bandaids, Neosporin, a safety pin, Tylenol, aspirin (for heart attack), Imodium AD, 3' of Leukotape was about all I carried.

I actually had two situations that I came upon that were, or could have been true health emergencies. First was an asthma attack where the person needed help with their inhaler. the second was a diabetic with low blood sugar, fixed that with a Snickers Bar.

Broken bones can be temporarily splinted with sticks and a torn up T shirt. Direct pressure using a bandana or shirt can be used for controlling bleeding. Suturing wounds is not realistic. Anything that serious needs debridement first which you can't effectively do in the field.

Carrying an Ace bandage might be a good idea, it's good for sprains and controlling bleeding.

The most important thing to carry is knowledge of basic first aid. Take a Wilderness FirstAid or First Responder course.

This.

If you've had the training you know what you will and won't be able to do in the woods and how to improvise the things you can help with. Anything more serious than a bandaid, moleskin or ibuprofen means you need to get the person off the trail and then your best bet is to have a cell phone to call help.

[DLP]

I was an EMT outside of SEKI in my 20's.

Bandaids, Neosporin, 3 safety pins (mostly for hanging laundry off my backpack or in trees), needle, ibuprofen, aspirin, 1' of Leukotape, I'm also fond of Nexa Absolutely waterproof tape. It isn't absolutely water proof for multiple stream crossing or large mile days. It doesn't stick like Leukotape - which sometimes is a plus. But it is stretchy and sticks pretty well and doesn't take some of your skin off when you remove it. And I bought a lot of it on Amazon, so I have it. I also take a 2" chunk of foam emery-board to work on calluses.

I've never actually used the bandaids but I occasionally give one away to a day hiking toddler with a scraped knee.

I also carry a SPOT, but that is more of a 1/2 pound sleeping pill so that my family can sleep better when I'm out alone. If your family can sleep at night, I don't recommend that you carry one if you are on popular trails.

I've tried using duct tape for blisters and it didn't work for me.

I also practice injury prevention:

Falling is probably the biggest cause of death and injury in the backcountry. I move with care and intention after taking a couple of bad falls. I don't multitask while walking (taking photos, eating, blowing nose, taking in views, etc. ). My worst fall was in Yosemite and I was looking at the views and a tree root reached up and grabbed my foot. (We all have different abilities and others are able to video, and eat, etc, while walking. It would appear that I'm unable to walk and chew gum at the same time.)

I stop and rest and eat when needed. I know my own limits and try and stick to them.

I keep my feet super clean so that I don't get blisters.

I wear long sleeves and pants so that I don't get sunburned, poison oak and to deter mosquitos and ticks.

I wash my hands often.

And I'm careful driving to and from trailheads. Statistically, driving is the most dangerous part of a hike for most of us.

[TTT]

A common injury seems to be rocks swinging back from bear hangs and making contact with faces. Haven't heard of any other medical dilemmas apart from hypothermia and blisters.

[Dogwood]

Egilbe, what I carry depends on where and whom I'm going... or if I'm going with others. Let me clarify. Duct tape in itself absolutely does not "fix" everything. I do carry a set of gloves solo backpacking.

[BuckeyeBill]

One other thing I wanted to mention. The use of tourniquets is a topic that most medical people try to shy away from. Unless you are fully trained in its use and know how and when to release pressure, you will probably do more damage than you will good. You can easily crush an artery destroy muscle tissue.

[One Half]

One other thing I wanted to mention. The use of tourniquets is a topic that most medical people try to shy away from. Unless you are fully trained in its use and know how and when to release pressure, you will probably do more damage than you will good. You can easily crush an artery destroy muscle tissue.

Update your training. Tourniquets do not get "released" until the person is in a hospital these days.