What Stove?

[Greenmountainguy]

Here it is, as simply as I can state it: what stove would you recommend for a distance hiker that does not expect mail drops?
I once, decades ago used the first MSR white gas stove and it is still going strong, The fuel issue however advocates against it, I do not want to carry huge quantities of fuel and I doubt small amounts can be bought en route.
I have an MSR multi-fuel, but the issues above still obtain.
A canister stove, like an MSR Pocket Rocket. The light weight intrigues, but the fuel canisters are expensive and I would think, hard to find in small town stores. The weight savings would also seem dubious given the weight of the canisters and the need to pack extras and empties as well.
I have a Sierra ZZip stove I have played with but never taken long distance. I am put off by the mess and the inability to quickly make a beverage and get going in the morning.
Some version of the Solo stove (actually a Forfar Stove) that also allows an alcohol option. I could use the alcohol for a quick beverage and alcohol is easy to find everywhere.
I am leaning toward the last since I can use twigs at night, do not have to worry about a battery dying and can fall back on alcohol.
What do you think? For what it is worth, I do not ever want to carry more than 5 days food. That is pushing my 30 lbs. limit pretty good.
Thoughts?
Thanks

[Starchild]

Since this is the AT forum, I will assume the AT, both canisters and alcohol are heavily used on a thru hike. Esbit is coming on strong and should be considered also, but calling ahead to assure availability up trail is wise. White gas is, well a heavy novelty, wood stoves are basically alcohol or esbit stoves that can burn wood when the mood strikes you (ok a bit harsh, but wood requires a backup, but can save weight).

Short summary:

Canisters, they last a very long time, even the smallest one, if they don't you are using them wrong. This allows a degree of freedom, being able to bypass looking for fuel for weeks at a time. Hiker boxes will give you a resupply at times as well. No need to carry more than one at a time, no need to carry anything larger than the smallest canister, but if you find yourself carrying more than one small canister at a time consider another fuel source. Some can get used to the shake test to feel how much fuel is left, others never get the knack (they are the ones that leave 70% full canisters in the hiker boxes and travel with more than one). No problem getting canisters on the AT.

Alcohol, fuel inefficient, but can be lighter due to the stove and fuel container weight. Either way you will need to get a good stove setup, and do some measurements to see if you have a decent stove for your pot and also the wind. Fuel available along the AT, however it is often another step (going to another store) and you will need to refill often. Additionally, in practice, many AT thru hikers end up carrying extra alcohol fuel (weight) due to how it is sold (heet bottles), and it is not as big a weight saving if you do that.

Esbit, has a odor that some finds unpleasant and it does cause soot on your pot, needs a good ignition source as it is sometimes stubborn to ignite, fuel is not as available, but you can mail yourself extra esbit from the trail. Some have trouble boiling water with it (though it is their inefficient setup which causes that). Perhaps the lightest stove option.

[orthofingers]

"A distance hiker that does not expect mail drops"

"do not ever want to carry more than 5 days food"

Does that mean you will resupply at least every 5 days?

Canister stove= ok weight (BRS 3000 or something lightweight), loud, quick to boil, adjustable flame, gotta pack the empty canisters $-$$

jetboil or similar= heavy, loud, very quick and efficient, gotta pack the empty canisters $$$

alconol= fancee feest, trangia, or similar, light, quiet, longer to boil, windscreen mandatory, no shutoff valve, a bit of fiddle factor, $

It depends on when and where you hike . . . extreme cold = alcohol and canister not so good, white gas or multi fuel better, some areas require shutoff valve.

[ScareBear]

I've thought about going to an alcohol stove, as all I use a stove for on the AT is boiling water. There does seem to be some weight savings over a canister stove, but the trade-off is a longer time to boil, liquid fuel, more wind protection needed. There are a myriad of different stoves. Zelph, a poster here on WB is a manufacturer/retailer. The Trangia burner is a time-proven unit, but you will need a burner stand. Since there is a Lowe's not too far away, I am going to get some carbon felt and try a few cat food can designs. It seems the best of the units can boil two cups of water in around 5-6 minutes. Which, is perfectly acceptable for me, as 2.5 cups is the most I boil at any one time. YMMV.
http://www.woodgaz-stove.com/
https://www.amazon.com/Trangia-Spiri.../dp/B000AR7970

However, I do think I prefer my canister stove, for all-around usefulness and speed of boil. Options there vary greatly as well. I'm a fan of the Optimus CruxLite. My former TrailPartner(tm) swears by a 10 buck Chinese knock-off of the MSR Pocket Rocket you can find on amazon. If you do a lot of cold-weather(below 15F) camping, you may want to look into a remote inverted canister stove...almost everywhere near the AT that you can find alcohol, you can find canisters. And, vice versa...just sayin..

[nsherry61]

There are many threads in these forums looking at net weight carried for canister vs. alcohol. If you haven't read over some of them, they are worth a look.

Here is one I started a while back . . .

[Venchka]

Number of thru hikers = Number of stove+fuel opinions.
Wayne


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[Engine]

Started out with the original remote fueled Coleman Peak 1 model in the 80's, then moved to an MSR Whisperlite for a few years. After that I briefly tried the MSR Dragonfly, but it woke people up in the next county in the morning...ridiculously loud. We went straight to a homeade alcohol stove after that and have never had an issue. I am currently using a Caldera Cone with a Zelph Starlyte stove, it's very fuel efficient and light.

I always felt like the disadvantages outweighed the advantages for wood fueled stoves. It rains a lot in the east and having to deal with soaked fuel, or carry some to keep it dry is a pain. In addition, the soot from cooking gets all over everything if you aren't extra careful.

The other day I read a post somewhere on WB where someone mentioned they only actually cooked about 600 calories a day and the rest were eaten cold. That really hit home because it mirrors our habits. We will heat up water for coffee and occasionally oatmeal in the morning, but otherwise it's cold food all day until dinner and then the stove run for about 6-7 minutes prior to the pot going into the cozy. That means I'm actually using the stove for 0.4% of the day...not worth stressing over.

[Hikingjim]

I find a pocket rocket is simple and does the trick quickly. Easy to find fuel
Your last option could also work

[KDogg]

My thru hiking partners and I all used canister stoves. They work great and are super easy to work with. I started with a snow peak and switched to a jetboil for the speed of boil and the minimal fuel use. Didn't really save a lot of real time but it fell in with my routine well and did extend canister use. I cooked every day, 3x a day. Maybe not the norm but it worked well for me. Canisters weren't a problem in 2016 except in PA. All the stores were out for about three resupplies. I completely ran out of fuel and even had a few days where I didn't cook. Walmart has cheap esbit stoves and I used one of those for a few days before getting a new canister. I never saw anybody else use esbit the entire time I was hiking. It worked but I wouldn't use it again unless I had to. The stove and leftover cakes of fuel went into the hiker box as soon as it could. For me a small canister would last about a week and a half.

[garlic08]

...The other day I read a post somewhere on WB where someone mentioned they only actually cooked about 600 calories a day and the rest were eaten cold. That really hit home because it mirrors our habits. We will heat up water for coffee and occasionally oatmeal in the morning, but otherwise it's cold food all day until dinner and then the stove run for about 6-7 minutes prior to the pot going into the cozy. That means I'm actually using the stove for 0.4% of the day...not worth stressing over.

I saw that post too and liked it. Another wise trekker once told me to always carry enough food that can be eaten without cooking on a stove, just in case of stove failure. Examples are instant mashed potatoes, Ramen noodles, rolled oats, couscous.

To the OP, read this. It covers the issues (including even post-9/11 air travel) very well, and is well-written.

[Don H]

I recommend the MSR Pocket Rocket or similar stove. I found I could get almost two weeks out of a small canister using it to heat 2 cups water for dinner each evening. A Snow Peake 600ml single wall mug, foil lid and a plastic spoon completes my cook kit.

Canisters can be found at various supply points along the trail. The AT Guide also shows who sells them.

[Turk6177]

I started with an MSR pocket rocket and then got into alcohol stoves, first my own fancy feast stove and then Zelph's super cat can stove. If you are going to be alone, the alcohol stove is fine (and I may one day use it on my attempted thru hike), however, if you are with anyone who has a canister stove, you are going to be jealous of their fast boil times and simple use. Honestly, for the minimal weight difference, I think the canister stove with a titanium pot may be the better way to go. I use a snow peak pot and my MSR pocket rocket. I am sure there are multiple other areas where you can cut the weight to make up for the difference. I can not answer to the question of how available they are on a thru hike, however I would assume that the market will deliver what is desired, so as canister stoves become more popular, so will theiavailability of the canisters.

[Greenmountainguy]

Many thanks to all. Most of you echo thoughts of my own (BTW I looked for other threads on the subject and failed to find them). Many, many thanks.
Alcohol: I have made maybe 18 or so of the creatures, some higher tech than others, but the light weight is offset by fuel which is half as efficient as white gas. It therefore cancels out the weight advantage pretty rapidly.
Wood: I love the idea and think that I can get past the wet fuel issue, but the fiddle factor is extreme. With dry fuel, it would by like 12 minutes before I was heating tea or cocoa water. I think I would basically be down to one hot meal a day. Unless I use alcohol with it in the morning, a hot drink would pretty much delay leaving by more than half an hour. Maybe more. I think I would have to forego lunchtime soup.
White gas: I had one before I shaved regularly and have accumulated a pile of them over the years, many from tag sales, which is telling in itself. I think the stove and fuel bottle can hardly be carried much less than a pound. My reading tells me that I would need two ounces for each meal. That means I would need maybe a pint for that ten days and still maybe run out before I am done.
Canister stoves: win out on most counts and I think I am leaning in this direction. They can now be had in absurdly light weight models (like 2 ounces!) and if a canister can last me a week, than, that may decide it. After all, I could go to cold food for a few days if necessary. I am contemplating a ten day journey this summer which will be mighty heavy if I have to carry 20+ lbs. of food, plus stove, plus fuel. Resupply might be possible mid way, but I know the area and I doubt the availability of canisters without miles of walking off route. Food would be available if I am not picky on menu or closeness to the trail, but knowing the area, it might be a 10 mile walk in each direction before I could be confident of a canister.
I guess I just decided to pack a canister stove, maybe with a wind screen that in push I could burn twigs in. I have the wind screen.
While I love the idea of a wood stove, I have used them enough to know about the soot and the fiddle factor. When exhausted, I can imagine how bad the fiddle will be. I think I will pick one up, $21 on Amazon and try it in my front yard before a final decision is made, but the logic of the thing seems persuasive.
Thank you all abundantly. If you have more thoughts, keep them coming.

[Traillium]

I'm using a Caldera Cone (TiTri, w 900mL SnowPeak pot) that allows me to use wood when suitable, carry a few Esbit for emergencies, and rely on alcohol for those times when I won't/can't use wood.
Lightweight, small, highly adaptable. And because I use mainly wood, remarkably light over the longest haul.
(Soot? Manageable for me, especially the more care I take with wood choice.)

[Greenmountainguy]

I just did a rapid calculation. If you count a very lightweight alcohol stove as weighing zero, the less efficient fuel pretty much means at least four ounces per day if you do a hot beverage and hot cereal for breakfast and a one-pot meal with beverage for dinner. That means 28 oz. a week unless you want to do less cooking. A wood/alcohol stove weights 12 oz. and petroleum + cotton balls less than 1 oz. So, you are a pound to the good in one week.
Obviously these figures are open to interpretation and indeed contradiction, but the reasoning is sound never less.
Canister stove: 2 to 3.5 oz. with up to an 8 oz. canister for one week and a bit more. Some people get as much as a week + out of a 4 oz. canister, which makes it better yet.
White/liquid gas: 16 oz. for the stove and bottle (maybe up to 4 oz. more than this with the bottle) plus 14 oz. for fuel for a simple diet. So, like 30 oz. for the same period.
Esbit: forget it for multiple reasons. You know them.
The winner is canister with the runner up the alcohol/wood stove. Canister wins for lack of fiddle and mess. Wood wins for cheapness of operation.
I think I will go with canister.

[Traillium]

With a Trangia, I took 50mL/2oz per day. Caldera Cone TiTri uses half that.
That doesn't account for the wood-burning possibilities with the TiTri.
Just saying …

[Last Call]

pocket rocket......done....

[trailmercury]

I will be attempting a Thru in 2017
Cone and Ti-Tri for me...I will try to burn wood when time and feasibility permit, alcohol mainly, esbit probably some but way less than the other two
maybe a silly question, are the canisters recyclable everywhere?
Just thinking along the lines of carbon footprint and LNT...
burnt up ashes spead around inconspicuously are probably good for the soil micro-ecosystem, correct?
I have to admit, there is a "cool" factor in rocking the Tri-Ti and that hum of canisters is a deterrant for me...
HYOH

[Venchka]

Started out with the original remote fueled Coleman Peak 1 model in the 80's, then moved to an MSR Whisperlite for a few years. After that I briefly tried the MSR Dragonfly, but it woke people up in the next county in the morning...ridiculously loud. We went straight to a homeade alcohol stove after that and have never had an issue. I am currently using a Caldera Cone with a Zelph Starlyte stove, it's very fuel efficient and light.

I always felt like the disadvantages outweighed the advantages for wood fueled stoves. It rains a lot in the east and having to deal with soaked fuel, or carry some to keep it dry is a pain. In addition, the soot from cooking gets all over everything if you aren't extra careful.

The other day I read a post somewhere on WB where someone mentioned they only actually cooked about 600 calories a day and the rest were eaten cold. That really hit home because it mirrors our habits. We will heat up water for coffee and occasionally oatmeal in the morning, but otherwise it's cold food all day until dinner and then the stove run for about 6-7 minutes prior to the pot going into the cozy. That means I'm actually using the stove for 0.4% of the day...not worth stressing over.

Do you still have the Coleman Peak 1? Does it work? Would you care to sell it?
Thanks.
Wayne


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[Engine]

Do you still have the Coleman Peak 1? Does it work? Would you care to sell it?
Thanks.
Wayne


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Unfortunately no, as much as I loved that old stove, it got temperamental and nearly incinerated itself along with the old dry picnic table it was sitting on in the smokies back in the late 90's.