night hikin on the PCT

[jefals]

Disclaimer: I just put -- "on the PCT" in there so the forum police don't get me. This is applicable to any trail, really. .

Is it just me, or do you more experienced folks notice these things. .
1) on wider trails, the left and right sides seem to kind of fade. If I'm on a wide trail that curves, it's difficult to see the curve, so I might walk straight -- into the bushes almost.
2) for the same reason, it's easy to miss forks in the trail.
3) depth perception seems a little off. Sometimes I'm expecting my foot to hit the ground before it actually does...
Do you guys experience these things?

[Dogwood]

No, not unless I previously visited a dispensary.


In some incidences especially in SoCal the trail does braid into mistakenly used paths. In places like the Mojave openings in brush can be easily mistaken for the PCT.

Night hiking is no time for anyone to assume they can turn off their mind.


Hike under a full moon. Depth perception decreases in low light... for everyone...so don't let anyone talk you into it automatically has to be age.

This is going to be met with skepticism but have you ever blindfolded yourself or closed your eyes and SAFELY tried doing something? This is what I was taught in Tae Kwon Do and hitting a tennis ball or shooting free throws. I try it occasionally backpacking turning off my headlamp or closing my eyes on safer terrain.

I have hiking headlamps that all have variable light outputs. Just changing from white to red light, resting my eyes from the most intense light setting to a lower setting, etc helps adjust my depth perception ALTHOUGH MOMEMTARILY when changing settings ABRUPTLY my perception may be interfered until it settles. Also, you might focus your eyes slightly askew of the headlamp light focus in the distance. And, if perception is lacking maybe you should get a light that focuses brighter further away.

In all seriousness if you're representing yourself correctly as a 70 yr old doing what you've been doing training ascents in triple digit heat, getting out, with your humor, seeking to be a life long learned never assuming you know it all, asking questions, etc I applaud you! DAMN GOOD FOR YOU!

[jefals]

thanks, DW, for the kind words. And I may be 70, but I'll play tennis with ya anytime! Loser buys the beer. Just as long as you're playing blindfolded!
So far, I'm not real crazy about this night-hiking. I guess you get used to it. It's better than trying to hike in this heat out here, tho. Maybe I'll try switching from white to red, to see if that helps.

[Venchka]

The whole premise behind the red light is to preserve night vision.
You need to put your eyeballs in night vision mode first. Like park the car. Get everything out of the car that you need for hiking. Close the car and go sit somewhere dark. Red goggles help. Anyway, 15-20 minutes in the dark you kinda get your night vision going. Then turn on your red led headlamp. You can also find flashlights with a red filter to aid in the whole night vision thing. I think I have 3 flashlights with the filters and 2 headlamps with red leds. For use on my boat mostly.
Good luck.
Wayne


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[Kaptain Kangaroo]

Much of the problem with poor depth perception at night is due to your light source being very close to your eyes (assuming you are using a headlamp). This means you do not see any shadows on the ground. Try using a second light source that is some distance from your eyes, say a second light clipped to the hip belt of your pack. This will provide some shadows on the ground and greatly improve your depth perception. Trail runners will often use a waist mounted light for exactly this reason.

[Venchka]

Much of the problem with poor depth perception at night is due to your light source being very close to your eyes (assuming you are using a headlamp). This means you do not see any shadows on the ground. Try using a second light source that is some distance from your eyes, say a second light clipped to the hip belt of your pack. This will provide some shadows on the ground and greatly improve your depth perception. Trail runners will often use a waist mounted light for exactly this reason.

I've been telling Jeff that. He's hard headed. Thanks for the confirmation.
Wayne


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[jefals]

The whole premise behind the red light is to preserve night vision.
You need to put your eyeballs in night vision mode first. Like park the car. Get everything out of the car that you need for hiking. Close the car and go sit somewhere dark. Red goggles help. Anyway, 15-20 minutes in the dark you kinda get your night vision going. Then turn on your red led headlamp. You can also find flashlights with a red filter to aid in the whole night vision thing. I think I have 3 flashlights with the filters and 2 headlamps with red leds. For use on my boat mostly.
Good luck.
Wayne


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Yeah, but when I first get to the th, it's not that dark. I'm already a ways into my hike by the time I need to start using the lamp.
This is the first I've heard about this use for the red. I always thought the red was just used when camping as a courtesy to other campers.

[jefals]

Much of the problem with poor depth perception at night is due to your light source being very close to your eyes (assuming you are using a headlamp). This means you do not see any shadows on the ground. Try using a second light source that is some distance from your eyes, say a second light clipped to the hip belt of your pack. This will provide some shadows on the ground and greatly improve your depth perception. Trail runners will often use a waist mounted light for exactly this reason.

Ok, maybe I'll give it a try. Thanks! Good grief! More gear! More batteries! OY!

[Venchka]

Yeah, but when I first get to the th, it's not that dark. I'm already a ways into my hike by the time I need to start using the lamp.
This is the first I've heard about this use for the red. I always thought the red was just used when camping as a courtesy to other campers.

The courtesy thing is several rungs down the list for red lighting at night.
Wayne


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[Venchka]

Ok, you can get some night vision going and then turn on the lights. That should work. Try not to look at the city lights.
Wayne


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[jefals]

[QUOTE=Venchka;2159763]

The courtesy thing is several rungs down the list for red lighting at night.
Wayne
What are,some of the other uses?

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[jefals]

Ok, you can get some night vision going and then turn on the lights. That should work. Try not to look at the city lights.
Wayne


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No problem with city lights out there

[George]

hold the light low, parallel with the ground - having a light on your head is great for reading, cooking and camp activities - but a poor solution for trail walking

[jefals]

hold the light low, parallel with the ground - having a light on your head is great for reading, cooking and camp activities - but a poor solution for trail walking

Sorry, having trouble visualizing this. I need to be hiking while holding the light low and parallel to the ground? Sounds a little impractical. ...

[Venchka]

Walk around your neighborhood. You should see the difference in about 30 seconds.
As I see it, the problem is attaching the light at waist level. Nobody makes a buckle or waist light.
Wayne


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[Kaptain Kangaroo]

There are waist lights designed for runners.

http://www.runnersworld.com/newswire...n-litebelt-100

Petzl used to make a clip-on light, but I think it was discontinued. I'm sure with a little ingenuity you could figure out a way to mount a headlamp on your pack waist belt

[Leo L.]

At times I did some night MTB-ing.
After several tries, I ended up with two lights: One on the handlebar, and one on the helmet.
Both were regular Petzl headlamps (which I have still in use, now for hiking), not really bright, but both lamps together did it for me.

[Miner]

Sorry, having trouble visualizing this. I need to be hiking while holding the light low and parallel to the ground? Sounds a little impractical. ...

Carry it like you would an old school flashlight instead of using it as a headlamp. For night hiking, I stopped using headlamps years ago. Using a headlamp washes out all contrast. The ground just looks like a single grey mass and you often miss the uneven ground, roots and rocks. The only advantage to a headlamp is both your hands are free to hold trekking poles to catch you when you trip over the invisible root, rock or hole in the ground.

I carry a small flashlight for night hiking and normally use the lowest setting unless I'm trying to search for a campsite off trail. Though you can hold a headlamp like a flashlight if you prefer. As I hold it in my hand and walk normally, its naturally stays below my waist and I redirect it at the ground as my arm swings. That's not awkward, its a natural motion you don't even think about. You are old enough to remember hiking with a flashlight as headlamps didn't really come around til the 1980's in their first heavy form so I don't see why you can't imagine it. Having the light down low means you don't need as bright of a light since its closer to the ground. It also will cast a shadow of very root, rock and uneven ground giving you much better contrast then a headlamp on your head. When you can see better, you don't trip as often and thus don't need the trekking poles as much, so I find using just 1 at night (because my other hand has the flashlight) more than sufficient as I rarely trip on anything. I've been night hiking like this for years, including on the PCT.

An experiment I did years ago to convince myself that this was the way to go was: I was hiking in Joshua Tree National Park up a sandy canyon at night. With my headlamp, the sandy ground I was hiking on just looked like a solid flat mass. When I moved the light to below my waist, suddenly I could see every footprint and any unevenness that was invisible to me before. I have not gone back since.

When you get above treeline and there is a bright moon, you often don't even need a light. Its especially easy to hike without a light when you are hiking on light color ground like you find in the Sierra Nevada along the JMT. That white granite really reflects moon and starlight well.

[jefals]

Sorry, having trouble visualizing this. I need to be hiking while holding the light low and parallel to the ground? Sounds a little impractical. ...

Carry it like you would an old school flashlight instead of using it as a headlamp. For night hiking, I stopped using headlamps years ago. Using a headlamp washes out all contrast. The ground just looks like a single grey mass and you often miss the uneven ground, roots and rocks. The only advantage to a headlamp is both your hands are free to hold trekking poles to catch you when you trip over the invisible root, rock or hole in the ground.

I carry a small flashlight for night hiking and normally use the lowest setting unless I'm trying to search for a campsite off trail. Though you can hold a headlamp like a flashlight if you prefer. As I hold it in my hand and walk normally, its naturally stays below my waist and I redirect it at the ground as my arm swings. That's not awkward, its a natural motion you don't even think about. You are old enough to remember hiking with a flashlight as headlamps didn't really come around til the 1980's in their first heavy form so I don't see why you can't imagine it. Having the light down low means you don't need as bright of a light since its closer to the ground. It also will cast a shadow of very root, rock and uneven ground giving you much better contrast then a headlamp on your head. When you can see better, you don't trip as often and thus don't need the trekking poles as much, so I find using just 1 at night (because my other hand has the flashlight) more than sufficient as I rarely trip on anything. I've been night hiking like this for years, including on the PCT.

An experiment I did years ago to convince myself that this was the way to go was: I was hiking in Joshua Tree National Park up a sandy canyon at night. With my headlamp, the sandy ground I was hiking on just looked like a solid flat mass. When I moved the light to below my waist, suddenly I could see every footprint and any unevenness that was invisible to me before. I have not gone back since.

When you get above treeline and there is a bright moon, you often don't even need a light. Its especially easy to hike without a light when you are hiking on light color ground like you find in the Sierra Nevada along the JMT. That white granite really reflects moon and starlight well.

Thanks for all this detail, Miner.
I may be old enough to remember hiking with a flashlight - but, since I never hiked with a flashlight , my age is kinda a moot point. What I was having trouble visualizing was the suggestion someone mentioned to carry the light low, parallel to the ground. This conjures up a rediculous image of trying to walk, stooped over, holding the light low and parallel.
Anyway, I really like two poles, even in daylight, so I may try to figure a way to clip a light on a hip belt. Not ready to trade in the trekking g pole for a flashlight yet, but if some of the other ideas nentioned here don't help, I may have to .