Food bags. zpacks food sack vs ursack

[lilbear]

Hey all,

I've got my base weight to about 12lb 4oz (including rain gear that I don't always bring all of and smartwool top/bottom that I usually wear part of).

I'm wondering what people's opinions, thoughts, and experiences have been re: zpacks style food sack and the ursack minor.

Obviously the tradeoffs are weight, security from critters, and actually having to hang a bearbag.

I do most of my backpacking in the midwest (~80%) and have done a couple sections of the AT, RMNP (where we rented a canister), and GCNP (where we previously rented an outsack). Critters are way more of a concern in my backpacking world than bears. Right now, I'm just using a stuff sack with drawstring filled with ziplock bags (no loose food), and a paracord to hang; luckily haven't had any issues but am considering moving to something that's a little more "intentional" in its purpose (for lack of a better phrase).

That being said. I don't love hanging bear/critter bags, but I'm not awful at it.

Like I said, ultimately, it's gonna come down to weight vs convenience.

What did you decide for your kit and why? Did you pick one and switch over to the other?

Forgive me if this is the wrong forum for this particular question..

[jj dont play]

I got the zpacks kit for my thru hike. It worked fine. I did have a squirrel chew a hole in Vermont. Was a good hang but still got a quarter sized hole that I patched with tenacious tape. So it is definitely not critter proof, but if you used a opsack inside of it to cut down on smells that would likely help.



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[Engine]

I bought the bear bag kit from Mountain Laurel designs. It's very similar to the ZPacks version with the addition of an OP Sack in case you were trying to decrease odor (I don't use the OP sack, but it's there so I mentioned it).

http://www.mountainlaureldesigns.com...products_id=79

[fastfoxengineering]

Hanging your food is probably one of the most neglected aspects in back country camping rules and regulations. And in fact, it's not required in a lot of places.

I pretty much always hang my food. It is not difficult. Can it be inconvenient? Sure. After high mileage/long hiking days, people are typically worn out and lazy. They want to setup their tent as fast as possible, cook food as fast as possible, and then go to bed as fast as possible.

For the longest time I used a 20L Sea to Summit Ultra-Sil dry bag with a #2 plastic s-biner from nite ize and about 50' of 2.2mm slickline. I'm actually kind surprised as to how durable these stuff sacks are. Thing took a beating over the past two years and developed a few holes and punctures from critters (while my food bag was on the ground and I was making a fire or something) and from falling to the ground from a few feet up onto a sharp branch or something.

The bag held up admirably. I just finally laid that food bag to rest after my last long hike. It was beat up, smelled horrible, pretty dirty, and well I just felt like I got my money's worth. I also thought it was too large (a minor knack because the extra volume could just be rolled up) and I didn't like the long, cylindrical shape. I really, really disliked the cylindrical shape. It typically doesn't stand up on it's own, it doesn't fit into a pack well, and if full it's really hard to get stuff at the bottom without dumping it out.

It functioned just fine, I just was ready for a new piece of equipment. Like I said, I had gotten my money's worth out of it. The waterproofing was still excellent as well.

I'm looking forward to using my new Zpacks food bag. I got the rectangle shape, which should fit better in my packs. I have used some cuben gear, and the bag certainly feels WAY more durable than my sea to summit ultra-sil dry bag. I except I'll get my money's worth. The best thing about cuben. It's so easy to repair. And the repairs are solid. Just tape any holes and be on your way.

I also got the rock sack with it. I was tired of sacrificing some other stuff sack in my kit for a rock sack. Rocks are typically dirty, and get your stuff sacks gross, so I'm looking forward to using the rock sack. Also, I would use something in my pack as a weight, however everything in my pack is too light or too much risk losing it if my rope gets caught in a tree.

So far I've been 100% satisfied with my cuben fiber purchases and a lot of people have good things to say about the Zpacks food sack. Is it odorproof or critter proof? No. But I've never found that necessary. Outside of places that require a canister, I don't see the need for anything more.

I'm not exactly worried about anything coming into camp besides brown bears. And if brown bears coming into camp is a possibility, I'll be using a bear canister.

Pests, critters, etc.. I'll hang it properly and sleep without worry.

[lilbear]

Hanging your food is probably one of the most neglected aspects in back country camping rules and regulations. And in fact, it's not required in a lot of places.

I pretty much always hang my food. It is not difficult. Can it be inconvenient? Sure. After high mileage/long hiking days, people are typically worn out and lazy. They want to setup their tent as fast as possible, cook food as fast as possible, and then go to bed as fast as possible.

For the longest time I used a 20L Sea to Summit Ultra-Sil dry bag with a #2 plastic s-biner from nite ize and about 50' of 2.2mm slickline. I'm actually kind surprised as to how durable these stuff sacks are. Thing took a beating over the past two years and developed a few holes and punctures from critters (while my food bag was on the ground and I was making a fire or something) and from falling to the ground from a few feet up onto a sharp branch or something.

The bag held up admirably. I just finally laid that food bag to rest after my last long hike. It was beat up, smelled horrible, pretty dirty, and well I just felt like I got my money's worth. I also thought it was too large (a minor knack because the extra volume could just be rolled up) and I didn't like the long, cylindrical shape. I really, really disliked the cylindrical shape. It typically doesn't stand up on it's own, it doesn't fit into a pack well, and if full it's really hard to get stuff at the bottom without dumping it out.

It functioned just fine, I just was ready for a new piece of equipment. Like I said, I had gotten my money's worth out of it. The waterproofing was still excellent as well.

I'm looking forward to using my new Zpacks food bag. I got the rectangle shape, which should fit better in my packs. I have used some cuben gear, and the bag certainly feels WAY more durable than my sea to summit ultra-sil dry bag. I except I'll get my money's worth. The best thing about cuben. It's so easy to repair. And the repairs are solid. Just tape any holes and be on your way.

I also got the rock sack with it. I was tired of sacrificing some other stuff sack in my kit for a rock sack. Rocks are typically dirty, and get your stuff sacks gross, so I'm looking forward to using the rock sack. Also, I would use something in my pack as a weight, however everything in my pack is too light or too much risk losing it if my rope gets caught in a tree.

So far I've been 100% satisfied with my cuben fiber purchases and a lot of people have good things to say about the Zpacks food sack. Is it odorproof or critter proof? No. But I've never found that necessary. Outside of places that require a canister, I don't see the need for anything more.

I'm not exactly worried about anything coming into camp besides brown bears. And if brown bears coming into camp is a possibility, I'll be using a bear canister.

Pests, critters, etc.. I'll hang it properly and sleep without worry.

Thanks for the thoughtful response. I find the same with my good ol' REI stuff sack. It just sort of schlumps around in my pack unless I get it positioned just so. In the midwest, the critters don't seem to be quite as aggressive as they were on the AT, generally less conditioned that people = food (but that was just my experience; I also hiked pretty populated sections due to logistics). There's part of my that thinks it wouldn't be awful to sleep with food in the tent, especially since I usually have my dog who would presumably cause any critters to scatter. But then my wallet shrieks about the money I've sunk into nice gear and the risk of ruining that from clawing either from the dog trying to get the critters or the critters getting to the food. Which is why I find myself back at hanging a bag like the zpacks one or the ursack.

[bigcranky]

I have both bags. We carried the Ursacks for years, until switching to the Zpacks.

Ursack: totally resistant to small critters. After regularly losing food to mice and other critters, we never lost any food when we started using these. I watched a raccoon spend ten minutes trying to get inside my bag while it was hanging from a bear pole in Shenandoah, with no success, before he moved on to easier bags (and I chased him away). Not having to hang is definitely easier. They aren't large, and can be somewhat difficult to pack properly with a full load of food coming out of a resupply. Need to be able to tie a figure eight knot.

Zpacks Cuben bag: Much lighter than the Ursack, more capacity. Bought two of these for a long hike (one for me, one for my partner). I'm pretty good at the PCT Method for bear bag hanging, and I don't mind doing it. These are NOT critter resistant -- we had a mouse chew inside on our first night on the Long Trail and grab my favorite snack. It was the only night I've ever left food outside of the "odor proof" bag, and coincidentally it was the only night we've ever had a mouse get inside the bag. So I am a religious user of OP Sacks inside my Zpacks food bags.

Overall, when I include the 40 feet of flat Spectra cord, a rock bag, small carabiner, etc., the Zpacks bag is still lighter than the Ursack, but not by much. It does have more capacity and it's easier to load/unload/use, except for the hanging part.

We do sleep with our food in some places, but mostly I hang.

[Ktaadn]

I have used an Ursack Minor for years and have no complaints. I hang it most of the time.

[poolskaterx]

Still kinda leaning towards the minor; hang it to keep bears out and the urs minor should keep little critters out. Difference is about 2oz saving, $25 bucks, and no rope knots to worry about freezing my food into my bag! This would be a first to save money AND go lighter!!! lol.

[poolskaterx]

Still kinda leaning towards the minor; hang it to keep bears out and the urs minor should keep little critters out. Difference is about 2oz saving, $25 bucks, and no rope knots to worry about freezing my food into my bag! This would be a first to save money AND go lighter!!! lol.

p.s.that is 2oz savings over the standard Ursack. Love my zpacks stuff (and I get more and more) but I have lost food before and I think a couple ounces of extra protection over the cuben is worth it for a sound nights sleep.

[lilbear]

Thanks, all. I'm leaning towards the ursack minor. It's rare that I camp someplace in the midwest that really requires a hang. While I'm happy to do so, and still would in places like the UP where it's necessary, I think the convenience of not needing to and still knowing that my food was safe from critters would be worth the couple ounces trade off. Was just trying to get on-board with carrying a heavier food sack while still carrying the paracord for emergencies (in my mind, why not use a system that was going to incorporate the cord if I was always going to have it with me?).

[QiWiz]

Have used the Ursak Minor for many years as my usual food bag and it's worked very well for me. When I worry about bears, I hang it; when not, I keep it pretty close by but not in my shelter, usually tied to a tree. No food ever gotten to by any critters in >2,000 trail miles. On the JMT or in Yellowstone or in Adirondacks High Peaks (where bears are smarter than average and target food bags that are hung) I use a canister.

[Flounder940]

I had the Ursak Minor and for about a month. I hung it from the bear cables all through Georgia. By Hiawassee, something had chewed a quarter sized hole in the bottom. I have used a Zpacks bad ever since and have had no problems.

[JC13]

Anyone aware of the weight capacity of the ZPacks bear bag? MLD says no limit for their's, AntiGravity says 10 lbs for the one they sell.

[cmoulder]

Anyone aware of the weight capacity of the ZPacks bear bag? MLD says no limit for their's, AntiGravity says 10 lbs for the one they sell.

More than anyone would want to carry! It is a large bag and the material is quite heavy duty as Cuben goes. The specific limiting factor, however, is going to be the plastic buckle that secures it after the top is rolled, and I pulled it with a fairly large amount of force (maybe 40 lbs?) and it didn't seem fazed by this. So it should handle 25 lbs with no problem and typical 12-15 lbs food loads should be a breeze.

PS. You're going to want some slick Dyneema cord of 1.8-2mm diameter for hanging, and 50 ft of it... especially for a PCT-type hang. 550 Paracord is much heavier and bulkier, and friction over branches makes it difficult to hoist a food bag, especially a full one, and especially with a PCT hang where you pull it all the way to the top when setting it up.

[JC13]

Awesome, was trying to decide if I needed 1 or 2. My food load is 6 lbs for the next start, not sure on the wife's yet. But looking ahead, a found a section or two where we may be hauling 5 days a piece.

[cmoulder]

Awesome, was trying to decide if I needed 1 or 2. My food load is 6 lbs for the next start, not sure on the wife's yet. But looking ahead, a found a section or two where we may be hauling 5 days a piece.

No need to bag the first day's food (incl dinner) so it should be fine.

[bigcranky]

Awesome, was trying to decide if I needed 1 or 2. My food load is 6 lbs for the next start, not sure on the wife's yet. But looking ahead, a found a section or two where we may be hauling 5 days a piece.

We have two so we can share the food load -- which is always the heaviest thing leaving town. I wouldn't want to carry six days for two people by myself.

[JC13]

We have two so we can share the food load -- which is always the heaviest thing leaving town. I wouldn't want to carry six days for two people by myself.

Understandable, I was planning on one of us using a stuff sack we already have to store that person's food while hiking then transfer it all to the ZPacks at night. I made the mistake of carrying 10 days worth last year... mail drops this year for sure!

[Ethesis]

I got the zpacks kit for my thru hike. It worked fine. I did have a squirrel chew a hole in Vermont. Was a good hang but still got a quarter sized hole that I patched with tenacious tape. So it is definitely not critter proof, but if you used a opsack inside of it to cut down on smells that would likely help.



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i picked up a rat sack.

Much to my surprise the woven metal weighs less than the heavy duty fabrics.

[Ethesis]

https://www.rei.com/product/846495/a...od-storage-bag