Kaiha Bertollini- Real FKT??

[MuddyWaters]

Oriole reported she missed some miles as well, and justified it to him.

And unless Im mistaken, no one reports seeing her in whites, where she would encounter hut crews, caretakers, and many sobo and nobo hikers, as well as tons of other people in Aug.

The shenandoah thing could have been a mistake, and it closed the case for sure, but theres still a lot questionable other issues . too many to dismiss without evidence to contrary.

I also think its a shame, because simply yoyoing , even with some yellowblazing, could have been be inspirational to the hurt peopke she wants to reach. Not a bad accomplishment. Possibly the modern thru hike crowd that yellowblazes made her think that was normal trail hiking, and that every mile didnt count.

[TrailRunnerGuy]

I think going down the 1/2 mile path argument is a bad one. If that's all that can be proven, the general public would say that you're taking away her record on a technicality. Better to stick with Billie's story of the ride from Swift Run Gap, and the proven 45 mile hole, that was no doubt the start of many more. The defense of that is that she could not have done the mileage to Rockfish Gap in that time frame. Also, Billie has no motivation or gain to lie about this. She does.

But yeah, if you want to believe her story about those 2 days, she still has a 1/4-1/2 mile gap that her story admits to.

[tdoczi]

I think going down the 1/2 mile path argument is a bad one. If that's all that can be proven, the general public would say that you're taking away her record on a technicality. Better to stick with Billie's story of the ride from Swift Run Gap, and the proven 45 mile hole, that was no doubt the start of many more. The defense of that is that she could not have done the mileage to Rockfish Gap in that time frame. Also, Billie has no motivation or gain to lie about this. She does.

But yeah, if you want to believe her story about those 2 days, she still has a 1/4-1/2 mile gap that her story admits to.

agreed. this creates a window for her to tell herself (and anyone else who believes her) that she doesnt officially have the record on a technicality but in actuality knows that she really does.

that said, theres no "winning." she'll never acknowledge the 50 mile skip. she was either never aware of it, or convinced herself she didnt actually skip... whatever.

risky side note- i'm sure shes told way worse lies that have harmed people in way worse ways than whatever "harm" some of us thinks this casts on legit FKTs. thats an almost comical concern to raise.

and again, i dont especially blame her for any of it, she clearly cant help herself.

[Just Bill]

Will's story is solid. I could have stopped there. In my opinion 45.5 miles were skipped.

I presented the other scenarios, no matter how outlandish just to demonstrate that no matter which direction the story spins- there is no happy ending.
Coupled with the alternative timeline if you discount Will's ride completely- leaves her obliterating Matt Kirk's 99 mile record through the park.

I hope I didn't further confuse the issue here- but the post was also written for someone confused elsewhere in hopes it will be read and accepted.

[tdoczi]

Coupled with the alternative timeline if you discount Will's ride completely- leaves her obliterating Matt Kirk's 99 mile record through the park.

her response to the timeline, if she chooses to make one, will no doubt be that she didnt actually slep even though she posted she had planned to. very simple out. that gives her 6 more hours and moves it a few more percentage points away from nearly impossible.

I hope I didn't further confuse the issue here- but the post was also written for someone confused elsewhere in hopes it will be read and accepted.

not going to happen. to the degree she "accepts" anything it will be that because some overly specific people are caught on minor technicalities that dont matter she has been robbed of her rightful recognition. expect a long winded, incoherent right up about the injustice of it all any day now.

[Anon090909]

Will's story is solid. I could have stopped there. In my opinion 45.5 miles were skipped.

I presented the other scenarios, no matter how outlandish just to demonstrate that no matter which direction the story spins- there is no happy ending.
Coupled with the alternative timeline if you discount Will's ride completely- leaves her obliterating Matt Kirk's 99 mile record through the park.

I hope I didn't further confuse the issue here- but the post was also written for someone confused elsewhere in hopes it will be read and accepted.

The even earlier timeframe (than the 11:05AM stamp on the video/noon arrival at Stainimals) just makes it even more likely that the 9 mile hike vs 45 mile hike happened to Swift Run morning of the 4th.

[Just Bill]

I dont think she is that astute.
And her personality in the video doesnt really seem to match up to planner of complicated fraud. I couldnt even figure out what she was babbling about...so Im pretty sure shes a bit confused too.
She doesnt come off as narcissistic either, her self photos are usually unflattering. Doesnt try to act something she not.

Which all makes me feel a stronger personality is the real driving force behind this.
Like someone talked her into the charity funding her hiking
And someone clearly set up the website and helps
And someone encouraged her to cheat, probably helping
And someone takes topless photos of her

Just a gut feeling

At first I was angry that someone was so outlandishly fraudulent to deceive us, not to mention discredit Karl and the others

But now I think she is genuinely disturbed and probably believes herself. Not to mention there is probably someone else filling her head with all sorts of nonsense

I believe she probably hiked some monster distances without sleep. I also believe she (mostly) did a yo-yo of sorts. Hey, that's more than I've done. Her cause would have been better served by letting these accomplishments stand on their own.

On Paper:
2200 miles over 46 days is 47.83 MPD call it 48.
48/20= 2.4 MPH Go bigger and say 42 hours of hiking in a 48 hour period and you have 2.3 mph.
Or assume a strong hiker and say 3 MPH- and you have the magical 48 Miles per day in 16 hours.
JPD averaged 2.83 per hiking hour and nearly 16 hours a day. If it were to happen, she's been the closest.

While her argument was presented poorly; there are many medical professionals and driven people who regularly work double shifts or even 36 hour shifts then crash for 6-8 hours and repeat. My brother in law is a forklift driver, works nights, and regularly picks up a shift in either direction and stays up for 36 hours so he can enjoy one weekend "DAY". I have done similar things, I'm sure many here have.

The human body is an amazing machine and sometimes ignorance of limits leads to the greatest breakthroughs.
It's the kind of story a lying spreadsheet hiker like me could entertain. But also a story I attempted to implement and was kindly shown the truth of by the trail.

Back in the real world:
Kaiha's story is mildly plausible. Six months of dirtbag hiking, followed by days and days of strung out sleepless zombie shuffling or even some bursts of running as she claimed. It is mainly Ward's story as well. Long days spent on the trail, gradually building strength and stamina fighting inner demons. Going to the depths of ultralight. Sleeping on the trail, skipping showers or even basic human needs. Going feral. As many here say, there is no way to train for a hike except to hike. The Tarahumara smoke cigarettes and chug corn based booze. Karl knocked back a beer and mainly ate junk. Hundreds of long distance hikers report living on gummy bears and honey buns. You don't need to be a vegan angel. And Ward sure as hell was not reported as a nice person to be around.

To a lesser degree Anish described chucking the clock and simply racing herself- a successful experiment in willful ignorance by an experienced athlete pushing the limits.

The AT is one of the few trails well marked enough, especially for one who just went through it, where one could conceive of performing well enough mentally in that state that you could move forward.
But experiencing the limits of sleep myself; I develop a severe migraine, and mentally perform my work as if I were drunk. I learned to do paperwork and math when fresh, and reserve long practiced physical tasks for later that I could perform mainly on autopilot. Recent studies have shown that sleep apnea and/or long periods of sleep loss can impact the brain in the same way as a concussion can. It can alter your memory. Or that sleep driving is a bigger problem than perhaps drunk driving in America.

The most plausible scenario in my opinion is a failed experiment by an inexperienced hiker. She did not know the trail well enough to operate on limited faculties. She did not have an aggressive plan laid out to re-read when thing got fuzzy. She did not have good folks advising and mentoring her along the way. She did not have the ethics of a FKT drummed into her core that would have overridden any instinct to cut the course. As others from Karl on down have said- it is the mental battle that is key. Karl at 48 has shown what a truly great mind can do AFTER mastering the physical aspect of the hike. After three attempts for all the physical and mental pieces to fall into place. With legends like Horton and Jurek by his side to guide him.

There is a fundamental reason that Ultra runners are intimately familiar with the need for a pacer when the limits are pushed and mental acuity breaks down. This is a fundamental reason that both groups respect the challenge of going it alone in the form of a self-supported hike, why they can see that it would be laughably easy to delude yourself or fail in the face of this massive mental challenge when tackled alone.

I do believe that Kaiha did a southbound hike. Though likely she may have fallen in with a crowd who shaped her vision of thru-hiking. What some crusty fellows here defame as the party crowd. Hikers out on the trail for the general adventure of walking from Maine to Georgia, content in that journey and not bound by dictates of "purists". Open to moving where the wind blows them and using the AT as the backdrop on this adventure. Folks who don't like other folks telling them how to hike their hike, or who look to impose any rules on their society or tramily as they have found their place and hike and simply wish to hike it with out a BUT.

Those hikers would cheer her hike, part of me does as well. They would believe cutting trail at a shelter, blue blazing during a bad storm or for a better section, slackpacking, or taking a smart hitch is normal. Yellow blazing is cool... we all get tired and need a break. Much like Jurek getting a boost from fans, a small party at the hostel rejuvenates these hikers. Angels will help, the trail provides, just show up man and it'll all be good.

Behind all that; is the message of sexual assault, retaliation by the military for whistle blowers, gaslighting the victim, PTSD, body shaming, reclaiming your sexuality, exhilarating in your physical beauty without fear of attack, and a host of other issues for good measure.

A very powerful message with a very humanly flawed messenger.

I hope that Kaiha steps back and realizes that she has already done something amazing. I believe she completed a very long and arduous journey. An FKT does nothing for her really. Though it may do something for those around her or those who shelter under the blanket of extreme sisterhood/solidarity against an honestly repressive system.

We can all clearly see she was on the trail, probably did do some big miles with a big heart.
Probably hiked her own hike as best she knew how and was able.
And unlike Cheryl Strayed, clearly appears to have mainly walked the walk.
But unlike Cheryl Strayed, has not completed her journey of healing with this one hike.

She believes her story, and her story is not completely untrue. An FKT is a very definitive thing, with definitive rules, and hard to prove. Unfortunately, in the court of law, so is sexual assault.

It is unfair to take the unfortunate truth of a societal issue and apply them to an FKT. It seems impossible for those two items to be separated in this case; hence the deep emotional investment, trauma, confusion and anger. Any doubt expressed is simply a reflection of the doubt expressed during the sexual assault. A trauma relived once more in this FKT. It would be hard to blame a victim of sexual assault for feeling as if this FKT claim was a replay of that trauma.

A body or an FKT; neither can be taken without the right to them.

It's not a sexist or personal attack. Most of us have already conceded that women will likely overrun longer distance FKT's within a generation and we men welcome them, but honor them by holding them equal.

So all I would say is;
Pick any reason you would like, pure fraud, PTSD, pain, mental illness, confusion, or simply naïve innocence.
You never know; much like Joey Camps maybe she will learn from this and come back fired up and ready to rock. Maybe her name will appear on the FKT boards, maybe it will dominate them.

But there is a person in there someplace, a hiker, a veteran. A proud woman doing her best.

I hope that Kaiha sees that hikers and ultra-runners are two communities filled with former addicts, mental patients, broken people, and incomplete humans. As well as filled with people who have gone on these journeys and seek to help others do so. But also communities that have our hero's too, some with tales as big and bold as hers. People these communities are emotionally invested in as well. If you were looking for a home, you found the right place. Just please pick up your things, be a good roommate, and pay your bills when you're able. If there is a place that honors journeys of healing and redemption, if there is a place to find peace, it is the trail.

As for the rest of us- time to leave a fellow hiker to hike their own hike.

If they persist in their claim, it is fair to further disprove it if needed- just please be civil and fair.
I'm done with it and thanks for letting me say my peace so that I could be.

[Mags]

Thanks Bill. That pretty much sums it up.

Lets all move on unless there is some real news rather than speculation. As others said, only adds more fuel.

It is now Autumn. The favorite time for many outdoors people to get out there. Myself included.

Find the secluded camp, go on a favorite backpack or get in a trail run.

Enjoy.

[Anon090909]

Great statements made, particularly "A very powerful message with a very humanly flawed messenger." I hope she continues to hike and carry forward her message.

[Engine]

...It is now Autumn....Enjoy.

If only that were true here in central Florida. Sigh, another month and it'll start to cool off enough to hike.

Thanks to JB to "moderating" this thread in such a professional manner, you have kept a difficult subject from getting completely out of hand by keeping the facts at the forefront of the discussion.

Now it's back to planning the 2017 NOBO...

[One Half]

this whole thing is getting sad
ive known people like this before.
mostly kids who damaged their brains with drugs and now live on tour.
its pretty easy to become a habitual liar when reality isn't really a thing

i assume she entered this with good intentions and now it has spun out of her control.

if she's taking money illegitimately, then karma will decide her fate.
the FKT is clearly debunked, but I think the only people who care are the ones trying to disprove it.

she has accomplished a great deal of trail miles this year, and for that I commend her.
she is clearly tough as nails.

you are assuming she hiked a lot. I assume she has a friend who picks her up and shuttles her about OR she hitches A LOT. She does not look to have hiked even half the miles she says she has

[dudeijuststarted]

Well this was fun. I hope somebody is diligently seeking out the next maniac on the trail cause I'm stuck in Florida and need my fix.

[cmoulder]

You can always re-read the Bismarck saga, lol.

[One Half]

I don't believe she did a 50 or 70 mile day. I don't believe she beat Karl, Scott, and Anish's records. There's no GPS data and the her claims border on absurdity. There's so much data contradicting this claim, and she clearly has no proof AT ALL that she's legit.

She's got issues that go far deeper than being a liar. I feel bad for her and her child, but hopefully she's home doing the most noble job she has, taking care of her child. This whole "hike the trail for a cause" mentality is overrated. It seems like the Appalachian Trail has become a commodity where every wannabe can use it as a podium to push their bull****. The only one I respect are the soldiers walking off the war.

and who was taking care of this "supposed child" while she was off hiking for months on end, partying and "recovering from an injury for 5 weeks"

[tour-kid]

you are assuming she hiked a lot. I assume she has a friend who picks her up and shuttles her about OR she hitches A LOT. She does not look to have hiked even half the miles she says she has

Sorry, but I'm a "glass half full" guy

[JEBjr]

Great advice, Mags.... GET ON A TRAIL!

I am leading a ATC Family Day Hike in Adkins if anyone wants to meet at the Barn on Sunday at 10am. 2.7 miles with a tour of the Settlers Museum. Bring your lunch... I will provide dessert and drinks

[Hokiehikergirl]

I hope that Kaiha sees that hikers and ultra-runners are two communities filled with former addicts, mental patients, broken people, and incomplete humans. As well as filled with people who have gone on these journeys and seek to help others do so. But also communities that have our hero's too, some with tales as big and bold as hers. People these communities are emotionally invested in as well. If you were looking for a home, you found the right place. Just please pick up your things, be a good roommate, and pay your bills when you're able. If there is a place that honors journeys of healing and redemption, if there is a place to find peace, it is the trail.

As for the rest of us- time to leave a fellow hiker to hike their own hike.

If they persist in their claim, it is fair to further disprove it if needed- just please be civil and fair.
I'm done with it and thanks for letting me say my peace so that I could be.

Beautifully worded

[Scrum]

You can always re-read the Bismarck saga, lol.

Don't forget Nature Boy!

http://www.whiteblaze.net/forum/show...king-Assaulted

http://www.whiteblaze.net/forum/show...ure-Boy/page10

[10SEns]

Just Bill - You are a true Gentleman.

[Maydog]

I doubt she will back off the FKT claim. She perceives herself as a victim (and she may well be); many people are unwilling to let go of victim status and I think she feels wronged in general and feels that she "deserves" to hold the FKT crown.