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  1. #41
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    Quote Originally Posted by capehiker View Post
    Slack packing caters to all ages. Just because you didn't see it, doesn't mean it didn't happen.
    Yes, people of all ages do it, never said otherwise. But the young kids are abusing the service. You completely missed the point of my rant.

  2. #42
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    Quote Originally Posted by FreeGoldRush View Post
    Aren't we all slack packing compared to how people thru hiked the trail 50 years ago? Technology is lightening our loads. Some people hike without carrying a shelter or cook set. Is that "sorta slack packing"? More frequent road crossings allow us to carry less food and resupply more often, or eat in town more often.

    Everyone leverages the available technology and always has. It is technology that is frustrating you.
    I don't disagree except the part where you said technology is frustrating me. I am in my 30's, doesn't frustrate me.

    I wasn't out there to try to reenact a hike 50 years ago (much respect to them). Technology improvements are inevitable, so I look at that as an even playing field for all thru hikers on the current year.

    And from my experience, those who enter a thru hike without being in good shape with a light pack, don't do well in the long run. Their legs never get a chance to get stronger like those who carry heavier loads. 2nd half of the thru hike, many of the light weights were getting dropped to the back of the pack.

  3. #43
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    We seem to now be living in a culture where changing definitions of terms and even entire words to fit an agenda are commonplace and accepted.
    IMO there is nothing wrong with slack packing. HYOH and be proud of how you do it, but hiking is hiking and skipping sections by riding in a vehicle is not really hiking the whole trail. Thru-hiking has always meant long distance hiking the whole trail, as far as I know, or at least attempting to hike the whole trail. Heck, you might even have a valid use of the term thru-hiking if you are thru-hiking a section, but it would be inaccurate to claim you thru-hiked the AT if you do not stipulate you thru-hiked a section or sections of the trail.

  4. #44
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    Quote Originally Posted by Praha4 View Post
    brother I agree 110% with you

    slackpacking has become the 'thing'

    I just returned from a section hike in MA and VT

    met a lot of young SoBo thrus who talked like slacking was the accepted and normal way to hike the AT

    the emphasis today seems to be more on doing mega daily miles, and finishing the trail as soon as possible

    yellow blazing & slackpacking are becoming more accepted

    think about it.... a lot of that goes on in normal life these days

    short-cuts & slackpacking
    I am glad someone agrees with me. You hit the nail on the head about the emphasis today being about mega daily miles. The yellow blazing and excessive slack packing but the young kids is being more accepted because people are turning a blind eye because they have been brain washed by the HYOH.

  5. #45
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    Quote Originally Posted by cspan View Post
    Not exactly. As I understand it, the ATC recognizes thru-hikers, and that accomplishment has some social currency. If the sense of accomplishment were purely internal, there would be no point in ever claiming to have thru-hiked the AT.

    Those who falsely claim it (including those who add their own exceptions to the ATC definition) devalue the currency. It is human nature to be bothered by such things. Nothing wrong with trying to uphold a defined standard. OTOH, perhaps the ATC should get out of the business of recognizing people who self-certify the accomplishment. Imagine if colleges/universities did the same.

    I wrote more, but lost it due to automatic logout. I wish I had time to re-create it, but I need to get back to my dissertation for my third Ph.D.
    You get it! I couldn't have explained it any better.

  6. #46

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    Quote Originally Posted by TheWhiteWalker View Post
    Yes, people of all ages do it, never said otherwise. But the young kids are abusing the service. You completely missed the point of my rant.
    Your use of the word abuse implies there is a standard expectation of how much slack packing can used. BTW, Warren Doyle has hiked the entire AT 17 times, all by using a day pack and having resources at the end of the night. He also runs a service for people wanting to slack pack the entire AT. Hint: average age of customer is NOT a millennial.
    Last edited by capehiker; 09-04-2016 at 12:42.

  7. #47
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    Some of you are clearly missing my point and some of you will never understand my point unless you completed a thru hike. I am not trying to be mean but it is the truth. Thru hikers are a different breed with a far greater goal. So when you try to compare your thoughts/experience from your section hike to anything I am talking about, it is irrelevant. There was a reason why I posted this topic in the Thru Hiking Forum Section and not elsewhere.

    The point of my rant is to let former, current, and future thru hikers know about the excessive slack packing and section skipping that I witnessed (especially from young thru hikers) in the class of 2016. And how many of them would justify their actions by misusing the Hike Your Own Hike (HYOH) saying.

    If you cheated on your thru hike attempt and still called yourself a thru hiker, I look at you the same way a military person views stolen valor. You are a liar, cheater, and a fraud. HYOH does not apply! If you cheaters want to tag along with real thru hikers, like hundreds of you did, don’t claim to be a thru hiker to locals in town, day hikers, section hikers, your family, yourself, or to real thru hikers.

    Issue 1: Slack Packing – Yes, according to ATC, you are still considered thru hikers if you completed all the miles without skipping like I mention in my original post. Yes, some of you slack whackers did hike sections in the opposite direction to intentionally avoid large climbs up, you are pathetic for doing that. I highly doubt the ATC envisioned young able-bodied hikers abusing the slack packing when they wrote the requirements for thru hiking. Excessive slack packing by young able-bodied hikers is annoying for thru hikers to witness, not to mention you are lazy which I would bet this also mirrors your off trail life and work ethic. Maybe it is your parents fault, regardless I feel sorry for you. Did you ever wonder why the hostel owners/employees that push the slack packing option are often fat??

    Issue 2: Section Skipping – You are those lazy hikers that will justify your section skipping by your blue blazing and HYOH... you know who you are! You are NOT a thru hiker according to the ATC. Don’t even try to twist the ATC words or pull out the HYOH, you are NOT a thru hiker… so quit claiming to be one on the trail. If you want to call yourself a thru hiker, then hike the entire trail! Yes, all you lazy hikers that skipped the 10-mile hike into Baxter State Park and opted for the shuttle to Millinocket, which then shuttles you to the base of Katahdin, you are not thru hikers…. 1 of many examples of your cheating.

    Issue 3: HYOH – Hike Your Own Hike was intended for people who hike slow, fast, excessive zero days, no zero days, takes breaks every 30 minutes, never takes breaks, stops at every view, bypasses every view, doesn’t wear deodorant, always wears deodorant, etc. So please quit saying HYOH as a way to justify being a thru hiker.

    I could easily be a sheep and brainwash myself into believing the HYOH BS but my thru hike was such an awesome experience that I will not keep my mouth shut. Attempting and completing a thru hike of the AT is something very special that words cannot describe. It is not an easy feat for anyone, even for the best. When you have fellow hikers taking are shortcuts and also calling themselves thru hikers, it is insulting not only to current thru hikers but also to former thru hikers who have completed the trail. Saying nothing and buying into their HYOH is just enabling the lazy hiking culture. As these lazy thru hiker impostors would say… if you disagree with me, then please don’t comment and go HYOH!!

  8. #48
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    Quote Originally Posted by capehiker View Post
    Your use of the word abuse implies there is a standard expectation of how much slack packing can used. BTW, Warren Doyle has hiked the entire AT 17 times, all by using a day pack and having resources at the end of the night. He also runs a service for people wanting to slack pack the entire AT. Hint: average age of customer is NOT a millennial.
    You just don't seem to understand! These slackpackers and yellow blazers are enjoying their vacation the wrong way! We need do something about it!

    Fun fact, the earliest A.T. hiker known to have been accused of yellowblazing was Grandma Gatewood. Earl Schaffer was the accuser.
    Colorless green ideas sleep furiously.

  9. #49

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    Quote Originally Posted by TheWhiteWalker View Post
    Some of you are clearly missing my point and some of you will never understand my point unless you completed a thru hike.!
    I think I missed your point because you are combining skipping sections and slackpacking as one thing. They are two separate things.

  10. #50
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    Quote Originally Posted by BonBon View Post
    I think I missed your point because you are combining skipping sections and slackpacking as one thing. They are two separate things.
    True. But I think he is suggesting they often occur together.

  11. #51
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    TWW,

    If you really want to get worked up, read The Cheating Culture by David Callahan. It goes beyond observing such examples but explains a bit about what gives rise to them, and the societal consequences of it. In any case, I'm largely with you, but since I'm not a thru-hiker, I don't (can't) feel the sting of counterfeit social currency quite like you. But I probably would.

    There's one point you brought up which I would like to challenge you on. If someone (like me) found going uphill easier than going downhill, and I section hiked with more uphills, would you consider that cheating? To me they've met the ATC definition, and I'm fine with it. It would be easier for me to go uphill, as it turns out.

    I'm really with you on what HYOH really should mean. It doesn't mean hike your own length, sections, etc., if you want to be called a thru-hiker by ATC definition.

    PS I'd also recommend the movie, The Emperor's Club.

  12. #52
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    There is no such thing as a thru hiker. If you come off the trail and spend even one night in a motel, hostel, etc. then you are just a section hiker.
    I am not young enough to know everything.

  13. #53
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    Quote Originally Posted by cspan View Post
    Not exactly. As I understand it, the ATC recognizes thru-hikers, and that accomplishment has some social currency. If the sense of accomplishment were purely internal, there would be no point in ever claiming to have thru-hiked the AT.
    You may understand it that way, but it is factually incorrect to say the ATC recognizes thu-hikers.

    They do not.

  14. #54

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    This thread reminds me of an anti Howard Roark, for any Ayn Rand fans out there. The exact opposite of the scene a where we Elsworth Toohey asks Howard, " so Howard, what DO you think about me?"

    Howard replies, in his perfect self confidence, "well, actually I don't think about you at all".

    Long way of saying, I hope you enjoy eventually get some self esteem, because only a lack thereof would cause anyone to care about others' hike standards.

  15. #55
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    Quote Originally Posted by TheWhiteWalker View Post
    Some of you are clearly missing my point and some of you will never understand my point unless you completed a thru hike. I am not trying to be mean but it is the truth. Thru hikers are a different breed with a far greater goal. So when you try to compare your thoughts/experience from your section hike to anything I am talking about, it is irrelevant. There was a reason why I posted this topic in the Thru Hiking Forum Section and not elsewhere.

    The point of my rant is to let former, current, and future thru hikers know about the excessive slack packing and section skipping that I witnessed (especially from young thru hikers) in the class of 2016. And how many of them would justify their actions by misusing the Hike Your Own Hike (HYOH) saying.

    Most people DO know. The thing is....they dont particularly care the way you passionately seem to.

    "Thru hikers are a different breed " ??

    Sorry, but no. Youve drunk the koolaid by the gallon you rockstar you.
    Last edited by MuddyWaters; 09-04-2016 at 21:02.
    "Inevitably, a long distance hiker must choose between travelling light, and not travelling at all." - Earl V. Shaffer

  16. #56
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    Quote Originally Posted by colorado_rob View Post
    This thread reminds me of an anti Howard Roark, for any Ayn Rand fans out there. The exact opposite of the scene a where we Elsworth Toohey asks Howard, " so Howard, what DO you think about me?"

    Howard replies, in his perfect self confidence, "well, actually I don't think about you at all".

    Long way of saying, I hope you enjoy eventually get some self esteem, because only a lack thereof would cause anyone to care about others' hike standards.
    Agreed.

    A far more clever way to communicate these very same feelings would be to wax poetic about the transcendent beauty of hiking as a purist.

    This could be done in the same manner as a fly fisherman might compare his art with a that of a person who wraps his hook in Velveeta.

  17. #57
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    [QUOTE=rickb;2090188]

    A far more clever way to communicate these very same feelings would be to wax poetic about the transcendent beauty of hiking as a purist.

    /QUOTE]

    I'd love to read such a thread!


    Bruce Traillium, brucetraillium.wordpress.com

  18. #58

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    I slack packed three or four times on my thru. If I were to hike the trail again I would slack pack way more often than that.
    "No Worries" 2015 GA-ME; 2016 LT End-to-End

  19. #59

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    Bottom line is, people can lie all they want, cheat all they want, but it's still not going to impact my enjoyment or my accomplishment. It's a personal thing.

    Technically there was one yellow/blue blazer who negatively impacted my hike, but only because I didn't like the guy, and he kept catching up to me despite my best efforts to leave him behind. I might have disliked him less if he had just admitted that he was yellow blazing around every single mountain, but then again, maybe not.

    I'm only a lowly section hiker, and based on how my plantar fasciitis is going, I doubt I'll ever finish a through hike. It's pretty silly to think that only thru hiker's opinions matter on this topic. I've accomplished a great deal of difficult things in my life that I'm proud of, and I consider more difficult than thru hiking. Failure to finish a thru hike doesn't invalidate anyone's opinions on this topic. We all have analogous life experiences.

  20. #60
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    Quote Originally Posted by bigcranky View Post
    Yeah, kids these days, amirite? Of course nobody complained at all about the fine young men and women back in the 60s who all worked hard and lived clean lives, no hippies or drugs or music back then, no sir. It's the kids nowadays who are the problem.



    Actually, the young people I work with are uniformly bright, engaged, and work their butts off.

    As for slackpacking, more power to them.
    The guy you quoted obviously has some deep down disdain for the millenials. Seems like half his posts are complaints about how horrible the young bucks are. Get off your high horse (not BigCranky who after years of reading his posts seem far from "Cranky").

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