Hiking (and life) without Electronic Giismos (Confessions of a Luddie)

[colorado_rob]

I wonder if back, say in the late 60's/early 70's when down started being used, what people said about this confounded new insulating material.... or what folks said about nylon back in the 50's.... "What's with this confounded nylon stuff! My father used a canvas tent and backpack, and his father before that, and darn it, I'm going to keep using canvas until the day I die! (or a broken back, no doubt) REAL outdoorsmen use canvas and wool and beaver pelts ONLY"
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I realize this is not a good analogy, but I'm making it anyway.
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I do agree ringing cells and talking loudly on them while others are around is bad form, but carrying a cell for camera / kindle reader / backup light / emergency GPS / emergency communication / non-emergency loved-one communication is a fantastic convenience on the trail. Stick it on "airplane mode" and the battery lasts a long time. Amazing devices. We live in a golden age of convenience. But maybe too convenient sometimes? Perhaps.
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Enjoy you own hike! I sure do, as much as anyone on here, and with my phone.

[adamkrz]

No phone for me either- nothing but bad news, I still bring along a paperback, Radio and candles. I also enjoy the element of surprise as far as the weather goes.

[jefals]

Folks who long distance hike and have to rely on a cell phone don,t know how much more they could enjoy the outdoors without relying on a cell phone. The whole idea of going out and hiking is to enjoy the outdoors and not have to always stay connected.

Last week on TRT I came to an unexpected T junction. Left or Right - that was the question. More tracks going left, so that seemed like the way to go. But a quick check of Guthook told me to go right. I Really enjoy hiking a lot more with my cell phone!

[greenpete]

I'm with you, Dan. And we're not "endangered" as long as we stay strong! I notice that many of those who choose "gadgets" can be very snarky and defensive (like some on this thread). They remind me of certain meat-eaters who confront vegans. It's almost as if they feel a trifle guilty having to rely on digital technology during their time in the wilderness. I use a cell, but only because my wife (whom I love) insists I use one. Don't even think about smartphones or GPS devices! In my opinion, it's heading down a bad road, and those luxuries soon become necessities. And I can (almost) guarantee: it won't be long before personal drones will be buzzing through the trees. Ugh.


"Wilderness is a place where things work like they're supposed to work" - Walkin' Jim Stoltz

[colorado_rob]

I'm with you, Dan. And we're not "endangered" as long as we stay strong! I notice that many of those who choose "gadgets" can be very snarky and defensive (like some on this thread).

Yeah, like your response (snarky, as is my response, admittedly), and in fact, the OP sounds basically like a self-defense/justification of ancient-school anti-tech.

"Hey, I'm stuck in the 90's and feeling lonely... lets see if anyone else is as well". Of course, lots of folks are (stuck in the 90's). HYOH!

Yeah, I'm snarky. I love that word.

[Tipi Walter]

I'm with you, Dan. And we're not "endangered" as long as we stay strong! I notice that many of those who choose "gadgets" can be very snarky and defensive (like some on this thread). They remind me of certain meat-eaters who confront vegans. It's almost as if they feel a trifle guilty having to rely on digital technology during their time in the wilderness. I use a cell, but only because my wife (whom I love) insists I use one. Don't even think about smartphones or GPS devices! In my opinion, it's heading down a bad road, and those luxuries soon become necessities. And I can (almost) guarantee: it won't be long before personal drones will be buzzing through the trees. Ugh.


"Wilderness is a place where things work like they're supposed to work" - Walkin' Jim Stoltz

To me it's all about "temptation". No outdoorsman or backpacker should EVER get on the internet while they are out and about. Control yourself. Isn't home use and work use enough? Do we still have to be interwad-connected even on a hiking trip? I get my giggles on the 'Wad here at home with this forum and such and Facebook but it's temporary and once I hit the trailhead I desperately need the discipline of NO MO' INTERWAD!!!

The worst are guys who post their daily trip reports live-action from out in the field on their fartphones. Give it a rest. And god help the guys who have their movements tracked on an hourly basis at home. When you head out, let us wonder what you're up to and let us imagine, and then when you get home after a week or a month then file your trip report.

And please PLEASE do not post your gps waypoints of a trip!!!!!!!!!!!!!! I don't want to know. Let me look at Mt Zeb from the trail below it or on my map, don't reduce it to a number.

And never fly your personal idiot-drones over the forest and into wilderness areas. Thank you for the rant.

[Dan Roper]

I didn't intend for this to devolve into a criticism of either way of hiking, but there are indeed alot of snarky comments here. I've noticed that pretty frequently in the WB forums. That seems to be an artifact of the digital age. I think pefectly nice people (a description which undoubtedly applies to nearly everybody here) just get snarky in a forum environment. They don't realize how they come across. It also seems that people become grumpier as they age. Not everybody, of course, but the trend is pretty clear here on WB.

Like everybody else, I like the way I hike. I'm not criticizing anybody's method. I'm just interested in hearing from others who have intentionally minimized or sworn off technology. From the early samples in this thread, we are a minority.

[colorado_rob]

I didn't intend for this to devolve into a criticism of either way of hiking, but there are indeed alot of snarky comments here. I've noticed that pretty frequently in the WB forums. That seems to be an artifact of the digital age. I think pefectly nice people (a description which undoubtedly applies to nearly everybody here) just get snarky in a forum environment. They don't realize how they come across. It also seems that people become grumpier as they age. Not everybody, of course, but the trend is pretty clear here on WB.

Like everybody else, I like the way I hike. I'm not criticizing anybody's method. I'm just interested in hearing from others who have intentionally minimized or sworn off technology. From the early samples in this thread, we are a minority.

Well said, points taken and I, for one, will attempt to be less snarky.

[Tipi Walter]

It's hard to have a snark-free rant but I'll try.

[Odd Man Out]

I like the term "cell-ibacy". Thanks for that. While not completely cell-ibate, I don't rely on many electronics. I carry a camera because I like to take pictures and cell phone cameras suck. I have a Photon Freedom light. Otherwise, the cell phone stays put away and is used for what they do best - phone home at night if I have service.

[greenpete]

I didn't intend for this to devolve into a criticism of either way of hiking, but there are indeed alot of snarky comments here. I've noticed that pretty frequently in the WB forums. That seems to be an artifact of the digital age. I think pefectly nice people (a description which undoubtedly applies to nearly everybody here) just get snarky in a forum environment. They don't realize how they come across. It also seems that people become grumpier as they age. Not everybody, of course, but the trend is pretty clear here on WB.

Like everybody else, I like the way I hike. I'm not criticizing anybody's method. I'm just interested in hearing from others who have intentionally minimized or sworn off technology. From the early samples in this thread, we are a minority.

I agree, confrontations are everywhere on the internet, and some can get quite nasty. Now that we can communicate without having to physically face each other, it's given many folks license to be jerks (and I'm often guilty, as well). For me, one of the attractions about the trail, and eliminating as much technology as possible, is a return to a more humanistic state. I'm not opposed to all technology (Lord knows how it's helped advance medicine), just leisure technology that's becoming a necessity and a crutch for many people. It's pulling us away from each other, as well as the natural world. The trail is good for rejuvenating the body, mind, and soul. And I apologize for using the word "snarky." Where the heck did that goofy word originate??

[Dan Roper]

A Vow of Cellibacy.pdf This is a PDF of "Vow of Cell-ibacy," an article on the topic of the AT and technology that appeared in the Spring 2010 issue of Georgia Backroads magazine.

[DuneElliot]

Phone off while hiking and only turned on to write my daily journal entry, or if I'm really bored (hiking ATV roads for long periods of time) and I want to listen to a little bit of music (also good for alerting bears to your presence).
I'll only be turning my InReach on to either send my daily "I'm stopping here for the night" message so the parents don't worry, or for the SOS, otherwise it stays off. If I wasn't hiking solo so much I wouldn't have even worried about a GPS locator.

Camera...I'm an avid photographer, so nuff said there!

I never worry about cell signals while hiking...couldn't care less. I'm going out into the wilderness to get away from all that

[Mags]

How communication technology is used in the hills is up to the individual of course. There are no rights or wrongs. I see no reason not to check emails and social media or even make phone calls if you find it satisfying any more than I can see a reason not to read in the hills (and I have been told at times that it’s ‘wrong’ to carry a book). The key is for you to control it and not the other way round. If it becomes intrusive and you think it’s spoiling your enjoyment the answer is simple. Switch the damn thing off!

Of course, the slippery slope is when people expect 24/7 connectivity FROM you in the backcountry because it can be used in a such a way. Getting calls on vacation is an expectation now for most folks. Will it be an expectation in the backcountry, too?

That's another ball of wax, however.

[Another Kevin]

And please PLEASE do not post your gps waypoints of a trip!!!!!!!!!!!!!! I don't want to know. Let me look at Mt Zeb from the trail below it or on my map, don't reduce it to a number.

Yes and no. I don't post track logs of off-trail trips in wilderness areas. You can find your own way, thank you very much. (Moreover, NYSDEC asks hikers to refrain from doing so.) I did post a couple a few years ago because I didn't know better. Now I do. In any case, you'd be crazy to follow the tracks that I posted, with all the crazy wandering and backtracking. I didn't have good luck with route finding on those trips!

I do post track logs of on-trail trips - because I'm one of the people that supply the track logs to the guys that make the trail maps. I see my tracks on paper trail maps fairly often. Nowadays, trail alignments on the maps all come from citizen-mappers. A smartphone is a heck of a lot more convenient than an alidade, plane table, sighting rod and measuring tape or wheel, which is what I'd be lugging on some trips if I didn't have GPS. That's how I did it in the '70s. I'm glad that I can do the same job with a few ounces of smartphone instead. (And I'm still navigating with map and compass, because if the trail map on my smartphone had the information I need, I would be mapping somewhere else!)

I tried carrying a (rented) SPOT on one trip. My wife came around to my point of view and decided she didn't need all that badly to know where I was, so I haven't carried one since.

I do carry a PLB, at least when solo, or off trail, or in winter. I think I carry it responsibly. I was tempted to light it once, but walked out 15 miles on a sprained knee instead. I said to myself, "if I call, what are the rangers going to do? Put an Ace bandage on it and walk me out, probably. I can do that." I needed a cane for six weeks after I got home.

I've also been in the situation where I'd have a customer who'd pitch a tantrum if I didn't call him back in about 15 minutes, even when I was not the guy on call. I briefly turned into one of those people who's chained to the cell phone (this was back when they were all dumb phones). The boss eventually decided that we didn't need that bastard's money that badly, and fired the customer. Then I was once again able to go to places without cell coverage. (I'll tell you the rest of that story in front of a fire sometime, whether in a fireplace in a nice pub or out in the field somewhere. It was a cool job in some ways, but soul-crushing in the end. I'm glad that everyone moved on.)

The noisiest flying objects that belong in a wilderness area are the grouse. A wilderness should stay wilderness usque ad coelam et ad inferos.

A smart-ass phone is a tool, like any other. You can use a hammer to drive a nail or go on a rampage breaking skulls with it.

And this is the perspective of a grumpy old man.

[Tipi Walter]

It was a cool job in some ways, but soul-crushing in the end.

The noisiest flying objects that belong in a wilderness area are the grouse. A wilderness should stay wilderness usque ad coelam et ad inferos.

A smart-ass phone is a tool, like any other. You can use a hammer to drive a nail or go on a rampage breaking skulls with it.

And this is the perspective of a grumpy old man.

No one grumpier than me.

It was a cool job in some ways, but soul-crushing in the end.

Now this made me laugh hard for a few seconds. Sort of like "It was the best of times, it was the worst of times" etc. Cool job . . . .but soul crushing.

I like your Latin quote---what does it mean? "Unless your colon becomes an inferno"?????

Speaking of tools, well, sure a smartass phone is a tool. So is a chainsaw and a pneumatic hammer and a roaring short-pipe Harley. Most tools don't belong in wilderness. Monkey bipedal humans with opposable thumbs can on occasion get out into nature without all their favorite tools.

[Another Kevin]

I like your Latin quote---what does it mean? "Unless your colon becomes an inferno"?????.

Pretty close, at least with the "inferno" part. "All the way up to Heaven and down to Hell."

Speaking of tools, well, sure a smartass phone is a tool. So is a chainsaw and a pneumatic hammer and a roaring short-pipe Harley. Most tools don't belong in wilderness. Monkey bipedal humans with opposable thumbs can on occasion get out into nature without all their favorite tools.

And my smartass phone, sitting there quietly in a pocket recording a GPS log, on airplane mode (so it isn't going to bleat at me all of a sudden), isn't disturbing you any. Comparing it to an air hammer, a chainsaw, or a Hog is just a little over the top. The worst you'll find is me pecking at the screen, and if I know you're around I'll scribble in a notebook instead. If just knowing that it's there is going to bother you that much, I'm not sure that should be my problem.

For that matter, I've served as chainsaw mule on a trail maintenance trip. (A sawyer generally needs at least a mule and two swampers in his support team for maximal effectiveness. That way he can carry the saw, and focus on cutting, while the rest of the team carries his fuel and oil and wedges and slings and come-along and all that stuff, and clears the debris.) We use the power gear only with permission of the managing agency, which is usually granted only for one or two weeks out of the year. None of the crew has enough time on their hands to go in with bucksaw and wedges to clear the bigger blowdowns. We clear the trail so that we don't get social paths all over the landscape, but steer hikers onto a durable route.

I'm not sure there's ever an excuse for a short-pipe Harley, anywhere. But I've had a Harley driver call me a "f***ing cager," so obviously there's something I don't get.

[Greenlight]

This falls squarely in the category of HYOH.

If you fall down and snap your tibia, I'm sure there will be dozens of fellow hikers who will be happy to phone the rescue team for you with their techie devices. Unless you stand on principle and insist on hopping unassisted to the next road crossing to thumb a ride to the emergency room.

I do all my hiking and backpacking without a cellphone or any other type of electronic device. This is natural since I've never owned a cellphone or any other type of portable electronic device. Years ago I made the decision to this effect - a vow of "cell-ibacy."

This comes up pretty often - it's amazing how many times hikers ask about signals or mention using a phone in such a way that it's natural for me to mention that I don't have one. The near universal reply is, "I wish I could do without a cellphone." People seem to love them and hate them at the same time.

Are there any other Luddites out there, either in terms of refraining on the trail or refraining totally? I'm sure there are, but I'd like to hear from others. We are probably an endangered species.

[colorado_rob]

No one grumpier than me...

Speaking of tools, well, sure a smartass phone is a tool. So is a chainsaw and a pneumatic hammer and a roaring short-pipe Harley. Most tools don't belong in wilderness. Monkey bipedal humans with opposable thumbs can on occasion get out into nature without all their favorite tools.

I thought we were trying to be nicer?

Anyway, this thread has taught me a few things, or reinforced a few things:

1) I now know what a "luddite" is! Never had heard the word.
2) It really is easy to be mean and rude online, as greenpete implies, in real life, like sitting around a campfire together tipping a brew, we'd probably all be good pals. We do share a common interest! We just have different styles.
3) In the immortal words of Robert A. Heinlein “Never attempt to teach a pig to sing; it wastes your time and annoys the pig.” I've tried to live by these wise words, but occasionally falter....
4) I really do have to try to use my cell less; I do find myself (in "real" life) using it too much. I think most devices add just a little bit of tension to our lives.
5) I think I will finally buy and learn to shoot a gun; call it training for when I see my first drone in the wilderness.... Probably a sawed-off shotgun in the weapon of choice. Carbon fiber, of course, to stay UL.

[rafe]

If you don't like cell phones don't take one into the woods. All the same to me. Why would you need to advertise that fact?