What happens when gear gets damaged on opening?

[Lear]

I'm not asking for a whole new sleeping bag and I'm damn happy that didn't get damaged on opening too, just the stuff sac. Less than 10% of the total order.

And yes, I would have definitely posted they had done a good turn if they had. REI did a GREAT turn letting me return those slippery Salomons.

[TNhiker]

I love having people's input.

you did ask for it...............after all, this is a discussion board....

Plenty of "friend," i ask about this will all side with me.

hmmmmmmmmmm...................i better leave this one alone......

I don't think their customer service is top notch.

they probably are for legitimate reasons, unlike yours......

[Offshore]

I will most likely use the tape they send to keep landfills clear and am happy everyone had a topic to rant on. Thanks all.

There seem to be a lot of Zpacks fanboys here in whose eyes Zpacks can do no wrong. Overstuffing an easily-damaged item in an undersized box when it could reasonably be assumed that a customer would use a sharp object to open the box (you know, the whole boxcutter idea...) is pretty lame. REI or LL Bean would handle this as a packing error and make good on it (knowing how to pack a shipment and offering good customer service probably contributed to them getting so big). This topic has been beaten to death, but I do wonder if your offending knife would be able to cut through all the self-righteousness in the finger wagging replies in this thread.

[SouthMark]

I have been a Zpacks customer ever since thay started up. I have one of her original sil packs, the Z-1. Joe and crew have never been anything but supper to me over the years. I for one would never have had the gall to contact them and expect them to replace an item that I damaged. I would have been upset but at myself, not them but of course I did not grow up in a time when everybody got a trophy.

[MuddyWaters]

OP, Im getting the sense that hiking may not be for you. Imagine the dissapointment you ate going to feel when that bear, raccoon, squirrel or mice eats or defecates in your food bag. How terrible its going to be when it rains for days on end, or when you've hiked for 10, 15 or 20 miles and find the tent sites and shelters all taken up already. What are you going to do when its sunny and hot and all the water sources are dry? When the mountains wont bow down to you so your climb isn't so strenuous?

Like the thruhiker that purchased a weeks food from mountain crossings.

When a bear got it the first night, he went back to mountain crossings expecting them to replace it. True story. Went away mad that they wouldnt.

[egilbe]

There seem to be a lot of Zpacks fanboys here in whose eyes Zpacks can do no wrong. Overstuffing an easily-damaged item in an undersized box when it could reasonably be assumed that a customer would use a sharp object to open the box (you know, the whole boxcutter idea...) is pretty lame. REI or LL Bean would handle this as a packing error and make good on it (knowing how to pack a shipment and offering good customer service probably contributed to them getting so big). This topic has been beaten to death, but I do wonder if your offending knife would be able to cut through all the self-righteousness in the finger wagging replies in this thread.

No finger-wagging self righteousness. Just amused amazement that he never thought of the repercussions of stabbing a box with a knife that contained a fragile bit of expensive gear. Its akin to smashing some fine crystal on the floor and blaming the manufacturer for the crystal smashing. What did the OP expect was going to happen? That the packaging was going to be idiot proof?

[clusterone]

I was not going to post as surely by now you have heard/read it many times by now... However, we are many pages of posts in and amazingly you still seem to think the problem is with ZPacks... SO HERE IT COMES AGAIN -- At some point you need to take responsibility for your action(s). Being "satisfied" and you cutting a hole in the gear are two separate things. Per my experience- Zpacks support has been amazing, and so has the ArcHaul pack. The fact that they are sending you a patch should be more than enough for you to boast about the support received. Thread title should be --- I F****D up, but ZPacks to the rescue. THANKS ZPACKS!

[Hosh]

There seem to be a lot of Zpacks fanboys here in whose eyes Zpacks can do no wrong. Overstuffing an easily-damaged item in an undersized box when it could reasonably be assumed that a customer would use a sharp object to open the box (you know, the whole boxcutter idea...) is pretty lame. REI or LL Bean would handle this as a packing error and make good on it (knowing how to pack a shipment and offering good customer service probably contributed to them getting so big). This topic has been beaten to death, but I do wonder if your offending knife would be able to cut through all the self-righteousness in the finger wagging replies in this thread.

Pretty sure other tent stakes, REI and LL Bean don't sell anything close to the performance/weight standards of Zpacks.

BTW, REI changed their Customer Sat policies a couple years ago. It was/is one of the most abused guarantees in the industry, maybe on the planet. I saw people with grocery carts full of what looked homeless people's gear in line to be returned, outrageous. They trimmed a life time guarantee to 1 year since it was so abused.

[TNhiker]

It was/is one of the most abused guarantees in the industry, maybe on the planet.

LL bean would surpass that i think..

i heard an NPR story on This American Life about LL bean a few weeks ago where the story was on their return policy and how liberal it is...

one guy returned a shirt he had been wearing for 45 years and it wore out.............yup, he got a new one....

but Z packs as a company in whole cannot be compared to LL Bean...

[Casey & Gina]

None of the posters were able to make serious unbiased comment about the implied guarantee that ZPacks makes on their website promising COMPLETE SATISFACTION.

I think plenty did - guaranteeing "complete satisfaction" has nothing to do with your level of satisfaction with the effect of your own damage to the product. It's your fault, period. It's a sucky mistake to have made, but it is what it is, accept, repair, and move on.

I don't think their customer service is top notch.

Then perhaps you won't buy their products any more, and will seek out companies happy to take a loss when you make a mistake (some will, like REI as you mentioned - most won't). Hope you like their selection cause specialty stuff like ZPacks won't be found there, even on their website.

I didn't use a crowbar to open the box, I doubt anyone would use a spoon, and I wasn't reckless. I have opened boxes that had been mailed to me for most of my life without any previous incidents. If ZPacks was concerned about their reputation they would have sent a new stuff sac.

I have never opened a box with a knife or sharp edge unless the tape has been exceedingly difficult to simply remove. When doing so, I am very careful to only allow the edge of the knife to barely penetrate the tape, not down through the thickness of cardboard under it. Usually I just peel the tape off. Seems pretty elementary to me.

I don't personally see any damage to ZPacks' reputation being done here. I don't own any of their gear, but this thread makes me kind of want to order something.

I bought some Salomon trail runners for the AT last fall. Wore them five times and hiked about 100 miles. Then on wet blue stone I almost fell twice. How well would they work then on wet stone going downhill with a pack on my back. REI told me when I bought them I could return them anytime for any reason. So I took them back and they gave me a full refund because that is their stated policy. When I returned them they insisted that the expensive Salomon trail runners were The Best Shoes for the AT. The posters here remind me of those knowledgeable clerks but ZPacks doesn't have as generous a return policy as REI.

Nor does most of the world. REI is able to afford to do this due to their profit margins and volume of sales, plus making up for some of the loss by reselling the returned items at garage sale events (much to my liking as that's where lots of my gear is from). ZPacks makes a low-volume, specialized product. REI can afford to take losses that aren't their fault and benefits from the reputation of doing so - that's not something ZPacks can, or cares to, do. Something being expensive does not automatically entitle the consumer to being able to damage their gear free of responsibility for doing so.

[AfterParty]

Badlands hunting packs has the kinda warranty you need! But like +30 on this one.

[saltysack]

the stuff sac is made for the sleeping bag

It's better off not compressed that small if not totally necessary anyway most folks don't even use the stuff sacks for their quilts/bags anyway...wouldn't sweat it...live and learn


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[SkeeterPee]

Do you have a picture of the box it came in that shows how you cut it open? That might convince people they you took appropriate caution and it was faulty packing that was the cause. On the other hand if you took sharp edge and cut the top inch off the box then I think we all would agree you did it wrong.

[Dogwood]

What happens when gear gets damaged on opening?

You learn to open things more carefully next time?

[Dogwood]

You order cuben fiber repair tape from ZP?

[Alligator]

I worked two summers in a stuffed animal warehouse. They were well made and expensive so we knew to be careful with our utility knives. Most shipping boxes are of the standard variety with four flaps on the top and four on the bottom. Pick a sealed side. Make a small point with your utility knife. Look at the seam of tape holding the top flaps together. Don't cut that, that's usually where people cut the contents because they've got their utility knife set to broadsword. Instead, cut the tape on the edge, this is the tape perpendicular to the top seam. There are flaps above and below that seam. Now with your knife set to surgeon, you won't go through the flaps. The top flaps are loose, just nick the end of the seam. Most tape will split along the seam if you just pull the top flaps apart starting at the nick.

I distinctly remember as a child getting a sealed Christmas card which I tore while opening the envelope. After that, I learned the proper way to open an envelope.

I could understand if it was in that clam shell plastic and held down with twisty ties and the battery compartment screw needed a ten power magnifier and you had to put 50 stickers on the darn thing. But I think you said it came in a box. Your being totally not satisfied because your stuff sack failed to stop a knife which you applied might be warranted if the product was made out of kevlar. Cuben isn't that tough though.

[OwenM]

All ZPacks did was send you a package that you were too thoughtless to open properly. They ARE giving you good service by sending you repair tape that you'd normally have to buy to fix YOUR screwup, so you're wasting your time casting aspersions on their reputation.
Katabatic shipped my $490 quilt to me in the exact same manner, recently, after I sent it in to have a broken clip replaced. Good luck finding complaints about their company, service or products.

You might as well get used to the idea that thin cuben fiber is fragile, regardless. You're probably going to need repair tape on that stuff sack anyway after it sees some use, because that's reality. Nothing wrong with the construction quality of my few ZPacks items, but the cuben itself has very little resistance to puncture or wear in the weight they use for most stuff sacks, so is easily damaged.
C'est la vie...you want the lightest material, there's a price to pay, and not just in $$.

[daddytwosticks]

I can't see how an entrepreneurial person could start a small cottage business these days. Between excessive government regulations and the customers' unrealistic expectations, a new business owner is doomed from the start.

[T.Bates]

For the OP, like everyone else, this was not Zpacks fault but no need to rehash that as theirs 5 pages. Anyhow I found a good site the demonstrates the safe way to open packages so you don't cut yourself or the contents in the box. http://theinkkitchen.com/2014/08/how...-a-box-really/ This should benefit you for future packages so you can safely retrieve your new goodies without incident!!! I hope this helps and sorry to hear about your incident but some lessons you have to learn the hard way(I learn about 60% of my lessons this way but that way you'll never make the same mistake twice!!)

[T.Bates]

there's**
I'm not illiterate