has the day for satellite phones arrived

[George]

brought on by the inchworm findings (IMO this seems to be the simplest most fool proof tool she could have used), and I was in a situation that a sat phone would have made quick resolution

-sat phone/ service prices have come down - not much more now than a deluxe cell plan

- not much more weight if you already carry a cell

- cell coverage has leveled off, the areas not yet served apparently cannot make a profit for the carriers

so is the future now for those who do backcountry activities?

[Starchild]

A emergency locator beacon as part of a smartphone would seem to make more sense. Sat phones have problems upscaling to common usage.

[SWODaddy]

The Delorme InReach units are a great option if you are concerned about that. They have month-to-month plans for a little over $10 and you can email/text using the iridium network, or send an emergency/SOS signal. The key feature is confirmation that your message was sent.

Honestly though, for the specific situation you mentioned, any phone with GPS (or a compass and map) should have been sufficient for a person to see what direction they needed to go in for help.

[samton]

Great idea. A guy is on trail right now. He has a device called Delorme inReach Explorer satellite His web site is follow bigfoot.com you can see exactly where he is at. I plan on getting one

[Wise Old Owl]

I disagree. a Sat phone may not be a smart phone but offers verbal communication from any part of the globe. Some beacons offer the same Iridium or Hughes Service much like a pager vs a phone... Do not make the mistake that a Beacon or older 121 Epirb will make provide the same quality service.

The location of a transmitting 406 beacon can be determined within approximately three miles by the first satellite pass, and to within one mile after three satellite passes. A GPS enabled 406 EPIRB's accuracy is within 100 yards of the initial alert. For a homing EPIRB, position accuracy is only 12 miles. It’s the difference between a 144 sq. mile search area vs. a 100 square meter search.
The 406 EPIRB uses the COSPAS/SARSAT system of polar orbiting satellites which gives you worldwide coverage. In comparison to the the homing-type EPIRB transmitting on 121.5/243 MHz, the 406 MHz EPIRBs have a much greater power output. And noise interference is less, so the 406 can be more reliably detected over greater distances than most homing 121.5 EPIRBs.


What's not answered here is how long does it take for three satellites to pass over on the Epirb!

[Wise Old Owl]

I don't have edit and the above post was directed towards Starchild... and almost nobody really needs Satellite communication for the AT.

[saltysack]

Spot with pre set messages is sufficient for my extended solo trips....


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[Venchka]

ACR ResQLink+ GPS PLB arrived today.
I won't leave home without it.

Wayne


Sent from somewhere around here.

[George]

almost nobody really needs Satellite communication for the AT.

need, as in it would not be possible to hike without it - no, of course not - but my guess is that 75% of hikers are carrying a cell, why not upgrade to sat ability for the small price difference - there is no shortage of places on the AT with spotty cell reception and as I said in the first post the carriers are no longer expanding coverage area


-for the other replies: while a spot type device would fulfill most emergency functions it means carrying 2 devices for most people

[magneto]

When I hike solo, I do carry a Delorme InReach, but I am loathe to use it for a rescue. I'd have to be seriously injured in order to send an SOS. Getting lost does not qualify.


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[Sarcasm the elf]

No, Reading an account of a tragic but completely isolated incident that happened several years ago would not not convince me that it was necessary to buy or carry an expensive satellite device any more than reading about recent bear attack in the smokies convince me that I need to start hiking with a .44 magnum. This line of thinking falls under the logical fallacy of "Misleading Vividness" where the emotions involved in a story can run so high that it causes a person to forget how absolutely unlikely the situation is to happen in real life.

[JohnHuth]

My own experience with satellite phones: I took a trip to the Marshall Islands, where we crossed between two atolls that were 150 miles apart with an outrigger canoe (with sail). There was a chance that someone would go overboard. We had a chase vessel, and I had to work out a plan to conduct a search for someone who went overboard. The US Coast Guard would take 5 hours to get a C130 there, so the only option was to devise a plan to use the chase vessel to search. So, a satellite PLB (neither SPOT nor deLorme had satellite coverage in the Marshall Islands) on the people on the outrigger. I rented an Iridium Satellite phone for the chase vessel.

The concept was something like this - if a person went overboard on the outrigger, they would activate the PLB. My wife would get a phone call from the 'command center' of the PLB calls, then phone up the satellite phone on the chase vessel with the Lat/Long coordinates. I also had a flourescent dye for the day-time, and flares for the nighttime to aid in the search for the person overboard.

The sat phone was expensive and weighed about 10 ounces. I wouldn't even contemplate having one for a hike on the AT. A SPOT would be adequate, also some sense of how to help searchers find you - e.g. camp in a clearing, build a smudge fire, blow a whistle periodically, make sure someone has a substantial amount of info on you and regular check-in times. The best defense is to always be cognizant of where you are - if you go off the trail, think about how to regain the trail, always look back so you recognize the return route, even break branches of leave markings on the ground to backtrack - etc. Common woods practices.

[rocketsocks]

I disagree. a Sat phone may not be a smart phone but offers verbal communication from any part of the globe. Some beacons offer the same Iridium or Hughes Service much like a pager vs a phone... Do not make the mistake that a Beacon or older 121 Epirb will make provide the same quality service.

The location of a transmitting 406 beacon can be determined within approximately three miles by the first satellite pass, and to within one mile after three satellite passes. A GPS enabled 406 EPIRB's accuracy is within 100 yards of the initial alert. For a homing EPIRB, position accuracy is only 12 miles. It’s the difference between a 144 sq. mile search area vs. a 100 square meter search.
The 406 EPIRB uses the COSPAS/SARSAT system of polar orbiting satellites which gives you worldwide coverage. In comparison to the the homing-type EPIRB transmitting on 121.5/243 MHz, the 406 MHz EPIRBs have a much greater power output. And noise interference is less, so the 406 can be more reliably detected over greater distances than most homing 121.5 EPIRBs.


What's not answered here is how long does it take for three satellites to pass over on the Epirb!

270 minutes at the most.

[rocketsocks]

No, Reading an account of a tragic but completely isolated incident that happened several years ago would not not convince me that it was necessary to buy or carry an expensive satellite device any more than reading about recent bear attack in the smokies convince me that I need to start hiking with a .44 magnum. This line of thinking falls under the logical fallacy of "Misleading Vividness" where the emotions involved in a story can run so high that it causes a person to forget how absolutely unlikely the situation is to happen in real life.

Yes, and by that same logic and the assumption "the Russians are coming"...I should start packin' a howitzer, whuda they weigh?

[Offshore]

brought on by the inchworm findings (IMO this seems to be the simplest most fool proof tool she could have used), and I was in a situation that a sat phone would have made quick resolution

-sat phone/ service prices have come down - not much more now than a deluxe cell plan

- not much more weight if you already carry a cell

- cell coverage has leveled off, the areas not yet served apparently cannot make a profit for the carriers

so is the future now for those who do backcountry activities?

One of the articles I read (NY Times, I think) mentioned that she had a SPOT device but decided to leave it at the motel with her husband - just one of a chain of apparent errors in judgement. Tech shouldn't be used as a substitute for common sense and self-rescue skills. Its also important to understand the limitations of a technology, along with its many potential points of failure. (And to bring it if you have it.) The issue with sat phones is the network doesn't scale as rapidly and relatively inexpensively as cellular. The current sat phone lifecycle is not even at the point of where cellular was when execs had the 3 watt analogs hardwired into their cars and you could buy a fake cellular antenna for your car as a status symbol. Changing out equipment on a tower to increase bandwidth is a lot cheaper than replacing satellites - and the carriers in the US have shown little interest in building out a decent cellular network as compared to Europe and Asia. (USA! USA!)

[Connie]

In mountaineering, we carried a brightly colored lightweight "avalanche cord".

It was about 50' long. I am thinking some hikers should tether a brightly colored cord, for when they leave the trail.

[MuddyWaters]

Doyble post

[MuddyWaters]

I just carried a sat phone for 3 months in middle east, required by my employer so could always contact security people. I hated it. I had 3 phones to carry, a US corporate smartphone , a local cell phone, and the sat phone. It wasnt that big, maybe 8 oz. Fit in shirt pocket. Battery lasted 3 wks or so without being on just fine before Id recharge it.

Id rather just have plb for emergency personally.

No matter what you tell yourself, you are wrong if you think a frequently used device requiring charging and maintaining has the same reliability level as plb. Its overall failure frequency will typically be an order of magnitude higher due to this. Advantages...yes. But not same reliability. If you use something, theres a good chance it can be left on and go dead.

[George]

so it looks like most opinions are that the available technology is not being used to make a practical device that would "do it all" for backcountry activity

[George]

No, Reading an account of a tragic but completely isolated incident that happened several years ago would not not convince me that it was necessary to buy or carry an expensive satellite device any more than reading about recent bear attack in the smokies convince me that I need to start hiking with a .44 magnum. This line of thinking falls under the logical fallacy of "Misleading Vividness" where the emotions involved in a story can run so high that it causes a person to forget how absolutely unlikely the situation is to happen in real life.

wow, you certainly are able to read a lot into something to thinly veil trolling