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    I'm wondering if the good folks of WB would go in search for someone in a similar situation near their localities the next chance they get. Almost nobody posting is from Maine or even close so you could not have helped us try to find Inchworm. Its unfortunate but undeniably true, no matter how you define the ME report, that she possibly could have been found alive. If not she could have been found much much sooner than she did resulting in those resources directed to other wilderness scenarios and persons in need. There were precious few people searching for her from the public sector and most of those hopelessly in the wrong areas. Grab a small team, the usual gear, and go search a chunk of land for someone if you can safely do so wherever you are from. I think Gerry would approve. Would anyone do that?

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    Quote Originally Posted by Starfly View Post
    I'm wondering if the good folks of WB would go in search for someone in a similar situation near their localities the next chance they get. Almost nobody posting is from Maine or even close so you could not have helped us try to find Inchworm. Its unfortunate but undeniably true, no matter how you define the ME report, that she possibly could have been found alive. If not she could have been found much much sooner than she did resulting in those resources directed to other wilderness scenarios and persons in need. There were precious few people searching for her from the public sector and most of those hopelessly in the wrong areas. Grab a small team, the usual gear, and go search a chunk of land for someone if you can safely do so wherever you are from. I think Gerry would approve. Would anyone do that?
    Ya know, the Patriots probably would have won the AFC title if they had kicked a field goal rather than going for it on 4th down.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Starfly View Post
    I'm wondering if the good folks of WB would go in search for someone in a similar situation near their localities the next chance they get. Almost nobody posting is from Maine or even close so you could not have helped us try to find Inchworm. Its unfortunate but undeniably true, no matter how you define the ME report, that she possibly could have been found alive. If not she could have been found much much sooner than she did resulting in those resources directed to other wilderness scenarios and persons in need. There were precious few people searching for her from the public sector and most of those hopelessly in the wrong areas. Grab a small team, the usual gear, and go search a chunk of land for someone if you can safely do so wherever you are from. I think Gerry would approve. Would anyone do that?
    Right or wrong, authorities tend to decline help from the untrained public. This is understandable.

    She was only a few minutes from the trail.

    Sirens and lights and bullhorns can be used to give lost persons in the backcountry something to orient themselves too. These are effective over long distances. Miles. Yosemite does this.

    However, the issue with the supposition that she followed an old trail, is that she also had to deviate from this trail, instead of backtracking. Which a normal person possessing their faculties wouldnt do.
    Last edited by MuddyWaters; 02-01-2016 at 08:22.

  4. #2184

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    The other issue that the ME report fails to address is what Starfly mentions: She could have been found alive. And certainly should've been found way sooner. As far as the weather goes, some people have it wrong. Monday was glorious, bright sun all day. The rain on Tuesday was heavy, but it was over by Wednesday morning, and the weather for the rest of the week was very warm. July warm. Remember, her tent was set up, she had 'constructed a platform of pine needles' , and the ME report refers numerous times to her location as a 'campsite' and a 'camp area.' The cause of death is also noted as 'Prolonged.' This all can be read as saying she was alive and at the location for at least a number of days. And there is the persistent rumour of a journal found with her-- said to have numerous entries in it. I've been up there twice. The 'platform' of pine needles was not some hastily thrown together cushion. It was well defined. Even after two years. IMO she spent considerable energy on it, implying she had her mental and physical faculties intact. yes I was there in the fall, but these woods are not thick. a 40 year old mixed hardwood stand is not thick by definition. neither was the canopy. The knoll where chose to camp was well situated to be spotted from the air. There are many unanswered questions-- chief among them is why she wasn't found sooner? Especially when she was finally found, she was pretty much in the most logical area, based on her hiking speed, routine of stopping for breakfast, and the cell phone tower ping? Add to that the tote road visible on the map that intersects with the AT. The description of the woods being 'rugged and thick' and 'dangerous' is a false narrative. Are there some 'thick' stands, sure. It's Maine. But the tote road that heads NW off the AT towards the location where she set up her tent is easy traveling. If i could post pictures on this thread i would. As a friend of mine said, there is some ass covering going on. Someone dropped the ball or lost the thread, and they're doing their best to get this thing swept under the rug ASAP.

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    Also a backpacking tent and sleeping would not prevent the dogs from catching the scent.

    Wardens have said that two dog teams passed nearby during the first month of her disappearance. I wonder what type of dog they were, Live Scent or Cadaver (or both) and what date they were in the area.
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    Quote Originally Posted by timeless_man View Post
    The other issue that the ME report fails to address is what Starfly mentions: She could have been found alive. And certainly should've been found way sooner. As far as the weather goes, some people have it wrong. Monday was glorious, bright sun all day. The rain on Tuesday was heavy, but it was over by Wednesday morning, and the weather for the rest of the week was very warm. July warm. Remember, her tent was set up, she had 'constructed a platform of pine needles' , and the ME report refers numerous times to her location as a 'campsite' and a 'camp area.' The cause of death is also noted as 'Prolonged.' This all can be read as saying she was alive and at the location for at least a number of days. And there is the persistent rumour of a journal found with her-- said to have numerous entries in it. I've been up there twice. The 'platform' of pine needles was not some hastily thrown together cushion. It was well defined. Even after two years. IMO she spent considerable energy on it, implying she had her mental and physical faculties intact. yes I was there in the fall, but these woods are not thick. a 40 year old mixed hardwood stand is not thick by definition. neither was the canopy. The knoll where chose to camp was well situated to be spotted from the air. There are many unanswered questions-- chief among them is why she wasn't found sooner? Especially when she was finally found, she was pretty much in the most logical area, based on her hiking speed, routine of stopping for breakfast, and the cell phone tower ping? Add to that the tote road visible on the map that intersects with the AT. The description of the woods being 'rugged and thick' and 'dangerous' is a false narrative. Are there some 'thick' stands, sure. It's Maine. But the tote road that heads NW off the AT towards the location where she set up her tent is easy traveling. If i could post pictures on this thread i would. As a friend of mine said, there is some ass covering going on. Someone dropped the ball or lost the thread, and they're doing their best to get this thing swept under the rug ASAP.
    so the day she went missing she left poplar ridge lean-to but never made it to spaulding mtn. lean-to 8 miles north. i've walked that section 5 times and recall the tote road down around oberton stream. the FIRST place i would have searched would be that tote road. no brainer. the whole thing is fishy

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    Quote Originally Posted by timeless_man View Post
    The other issue that the ME report fails to address is what Starfly mentions: She could have been found alive. And certainly should've been found way sooner. As far as the weather goes, some people have it wrong. Monday was glorious, bright sun all day. The rain on Tuesday was heavy, but it was over by Wednesday morning, and the weather for the rest of the week was very warm. July warm. Remember, her tent was set up, she had 'constructed a platform of pine needles' , and the ME report refers numerous times to her location as a 'campsite' and a 'camp area.' The cause of death is also noted as 'Prolonged.' This all can be read as saying she was alive and at the location for at least a number of days. And there is the persistent rumour of a journal found with her-- said to have numerous entries in it. I've been up there twice. The 'platform' of pine needles was not some hastily thrown together cushion. It was well defined. Even after two years. IMO she spent considerable energy on it, implying she had her mental and physical faculties intact. yes I was there in the fall, but these woods are not thick. a 40 year old mixed hardwood stand is not thick by definition. neither was the canopy. The knoll where chose to camp was well situated to be spotted from the air. There are many unanswered questions-- chief among them is why she wasn't found sooner? Especially when she was finally found, she was pretty much in the most logical area, based on her hiking speed, routine of stopping for breakfast, and the cell phone tower ping? Add to that the tote road visible on the map that intersects with the AT. The description of the woods being 'rugged and thick' and 'dangerous' is a false narrative. Are there some 'thick' stands, sure. It's Maine. But the tote road that heads NW off the AT towards the location where she set up her tent is easy traveling. If i could post pictures on this thread i would. As a friend of mine said, there is some ass covering going on. Someone dropped the ball or lost the thread, and they're doing their best to get this thing swept under the rug ASAP.
    so she wandered a short way down what you and a few others are saying is pretty clear, easy to follow path (i dont recall seeing it when i was there, but maybe it is), stopped for reasons unknown, made a very nice camp (i think some people are reading into the platform of pine needles thing. it might be that she just set up on an existing bed) and sat there for days starving to death.

    i still think, if we go with the idea that starvation was the real cause of death and arent playing "oh thats just what theyre saying," that she was wandering around for days and just happened to stop there on her last day.

  8. #2188

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    Quote Originally Posted by George View Post
    ...............the second guessing is BS - in town or in the bush any emergency service can not be blamed if they performed a reasonable effort (and that was done here)..............
    Well put, they did their best. Watch the North Woods Law episode that follows the search for Inchworm and you will see how hard they tried, the false leads they had to deal with and how bad they felt when they did not find her.
    Last edited by TexasBob; 02-01-2016 at 14:12.
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  9. #2189

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    Quote Originally Posted by tdoczi View Post
    ..........i still think, if we go with the idea that starvation was the real cause of death and arent playing "oh thats just what theyre saying," ...........
    If you are referring to my posts, go back and read my posts carefully. I was trying to explain to you how they could decide she had died of inanition and you are one who was doubting it was true. You are the one who came up with "Oh, that's just what they are saying" not me. I have no problem with what the ME said and I don't think they are making anything up.
    Last edited by TexasBob; 02-01-2016 at 14:25.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lone Wolf View Post
    so the day she went missing she left poplar ridge lean-to but never made it to spaulding mtn. lean-to 8 miles north. i've walked that section 5 times and recall the tote road down around oberton stream. the FIRST place i would have searched would be that tote road. no brainer. the whole thing is fishy
    I believe that when they refer to the "Tote Road" they mean the path that leaves the AT about 1/4 mile north of Orbeton Stream and then comes back to rejoin the AT further north forming sort of a boot pattern. The road at Oberton Stream is known as Railroad Rd and is an obvious road (actual an old railroad track).
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lone Wolf View Post
    so the day she went missing she left poplar ridge lean-to but never made it to spaulding mtn. lean-to 8 miles north. i've walked that section 5 times and recall the tote road down around oberton stream. the FIRST place i would have searched would be that tote road. no brainer. the whole thing is fishy
    i could be wrong, i think the tote road in question is, allegedly, near sluice brook, bit further north. i remember no such trail when i passed by there in july but that doesnt mean much.

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    Quote Originally Posted by TexasBob View Post
    If you are referring to my posts, go back and read my posts carefully. I was trying to explain to you how they could decide she had died of inanition and you are one who was doubting it was true. You are the one who came up with "Oh, that's just what they are saying" not me. I have no problem with what the ME said and I don't think they are making anything up.
    i'm referring to everyone who is trying to infer (or explain) how they came up with "starvation" so that it fits their preferred narrative rather than just take it at face value.

  13. #2193

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    Quote Originally Posted by tdoczi View Post
    all well and good except the official cause of death is starvation. how do they know that? beats me, but if we're going to second guess the ME then basically anything and everything remains on the table.
    Quote Originally Posted by TexasBob View Post
    The official cause of death is "Inanition due to prolonged environmental exposure". Inanition is a state of exhaustion due to lack of nutrition.
    I think that there are two possibilities:
    1. It may be that inanition is a "diagnosis by exclusion" meaning that if no other cause is found then a person whose remains are found like Inchworm was is assumed to have died of inanition
    2. They found her cellphone and the State Police recovered information on the phone that she lost the trail after heading north from Oberton Stream. They may have also recovered other information on the phone that Inchworm left behind but have not revealed that information at the families request.
    Quote Originally Posted by tdoczi View Post
    i'm willing to believe almost anything, but, i would LIKE to think the ME isnt just making things up or making probable guesses. sounds like, by whatever magic, he knows the cause of death. and as i said, if we're going to go with "hes just saying that" then all manner of things are possible. maybe she was camped there for one night when a crazed lunatic happened upon her and slit her wrists and throat and she bled to death and her remains did not reveal this. (please no one explain to me why this cant be so, youre missing my point if you do).

    or we can hope the ME knows what he/she is talking about and she did in fact starve to death. if we assume that to be true, i have a hard time buying the notion she got in her tent the first day she was missing and sat there until enough time had passed for that to happen.

    i'm glad the report elaborates on what is meant by "exposure" in this case because the notion of someone dying in summer of hypothermia or similar while zipped up in their bag AND tent is kind of kooky.
    Quote Originally Posted by tdoczi View Post
    i'm not doubting anything, the ME says starvation, she died of starvation. end of story. it is others (i believe you among them, though i might be mistaken) who are playing "yeah thats what the ME says but..." and all i am saying is we're going to play that game then lest really play it.

    personally, she starved to death works for me. so in the spirit of that, we can all stop talking about how she might have had a heart attack or died of hypothermia or whatever else, and if we want to have a productive discussion lets make it about how she ended up starving to death.
    Quote Originally Posted by tdoczi View Post
    i'm referring to everyone who is trying to infer (or explain) how they came up with "starvation" so that it fits their preferred narrative rather than just take it at face value.
    Then stop deliberately mis-characterizing what I said and putting words in my mouth.


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    Quote Originally Posted by tdoczi View Post
    i'm referring to everyone who is trying to infer (or explain) how they came up with "starvation" so that it fits their preferred narrative rather than just take it at face value.
    Lacking any physical evidence from the bones, there are only two likely causes, Hypothermia or starvation. Apparently she was able able to set up her tent and get into her sleeping bag so that would seem to rule out hypothermia, but that possibility can't be completely ruled out.

    But to stay in the tent long enough to starve would seem to indicate she was somehow physically injured or incapacitated so that she couldn't leave the spot. You can go for quite a few days without eating, but lack of water is a different story and that is something she could have run out of pretty quickly.

    Given the weather conditions at the time, I still lean towards the hypothermia hypothesis. It could be possible the sleeping bag was soaking wet so it didn't help any by the time she got into it.

    Sadly, we can speculate all we want, but will never know for sure how she got where she was or exactly how she ended up dead.
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    Quote Originally Posted by TexasBob View Post
    it may be that inanition is a "diagnosis by exclusion" meaning that if no other cause is found then a person whose remains are found like Inchworm was is assumed to have died of inanition
    unless you have personal experience as an ME it is this statement that i am calling BS on. in essence, my take is if they say she died of starvation she died of starvation. what youre saying in the above is "oh they might just saying that cause they have no evidence of anything else, it might have been something else" i ain't miscategorizing a darn thing.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Slo-go'en View Post

    But to stay in the tent long enough to starve would seem to indicate she was somehow physically injured or incapacitated so that she couldn't leave the spot. You can go for quite a few days without eating, but lack of water is a different story and that is something she could have run out of pretty quickly.
    or that she got in the tent near the end after she was already worn down and unable to go on because she had already been lost for a day or two.

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    "Inanition" doesn't always mean "starvation" in the traditional sense -- it also could also include dehydration, or Gerry could've been ill and unable to process nutrients sufficiently, even if she had food available.

    I find it interesting that she built a "sleeping platform" out of leaves & dirt, which could indicate that she either planned on staying in that location for a prolonged period of time or needed the extra insulation (which fits in with the hypothermia suggestion).
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    Quote Originally Posted by Slo-go'en View Post
    Lacking any physical evidence from the bones, there are only two likely causes, Hypothermia or starvation.
    Gerry was 66 years old. People suddenly die of many causes, and that increases with age. Those of us who are at or approaching our 60's and beyond know far too well the reality. Our lifelong friends, classmates, and co-workers are starting to die of the many diseases and afflictions associated with aging. While we no longer think of mid 60's as incredibly old, it wasn't as though a 20 or 30 year old unexplainably died. Having no soft tissue remains to examine, there is no way of knowing if she suffered a heart attack, stroke, or other medical event that rendered her either incapacitated or killed her outright.

    News reports cite the ME's report as to cause as probably inanition. But I've seen no detailed reports as to what lab analyses were done. Skeletal remains can be analyzed for the levels of certain elements (predominantly Carbon and Nitrogen) that can point to dietary causes. We should note that most thru-hikers not only put tremendous stress on their bodies, but also tend to be undernourished and losing weight thoughout their hikes. If these analyses were performed (and I have no idea if they were or not) they could shade a diagnosis toward inanition. Add poor nourishment, electrolyte levels, and other such possibilities to a 66 year old who might be hypothermic, suffering a medical event, etc., and the cause could have been a combination that led to a rapid and ultimately fatal downward spiral. Don't overlook the obvious.
    Last edited by 4eyedbuzzard; 02-01-2016 at 18:32.
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    Quote Originally Posted by tdoczi View Post
    unless you have personal experience as an ME it is this statement that i am calling BS on. in essence, my take is if they say she died of starvation she died of starvation. what youre saying in the above is "oh they might just saying that cause they have no evidence of anything else, it might have been something else" i ain't miscategorizing a darn thing.
    It is amazing that you think you know what I said better than I do. You are just trying to provoke an argument and I am not going to play so congratulations you win the honor of being the first person I put on ignore. Feel free to continue raving now.
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    Quote Originally Posted by QHShowoman View Post
    "Inanition" doesn't always mean "starvation" in the traditional sense -- it also could also include dehydration, or Gerry could've been ill and unable to process nutrients sufficiently, even if she had food available.

    I find it interesting that she built a "sleeping platform" out of leaves & dirt, which could indicate that she either planned on staying in that location for a prolonged period of time or needed the extra insulation (which fits in with the hypothermia suggestion).


    The sleeping platform is the most interesting fact I've heard. She must have been feeling fairly strong if she was capable of collecting the materials and fashioning the platform. Did Geri hike with a sleeping pad (mattress) as protection from the cold ground? If so, she must have built the sleeping platform because she knew she might be there for awhile. Did she have a whistle with her? I wonder if she heard the searchers.

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