Newbie Backpackers 1st Setup, how'd I do?

[BlueRidgeBackpacking]

Hello all!

After moving to NC a year ago and doing regular day hikes I decided it was time to move into backpack hiking, something I've never done before. The majority of my hikes in the near future will be limited to 2/3 days, in NC. Here's a list of the gear I have accumulated:

1. Osprey Atmos AG 50L - Loved the comfort when I tried it on in store. On my day hikes my back was always soaked in sweat, I sweat ALOT, and the full mesh backing seemed very appealing. I've done a couple short test hikes and my back felt wonderfully cool.

2. Sierra Designs BackCountry Bed 2 season 600 fill - I am a finicky side/stomach sleeper and this unorthodox sleeping bag design seemed like it would match well with my sleeping style. I am 5'11" 205 pounds w/broad shoulders and had trouble deciding if I should go for the long (6'6") or regular (6") version. When I sleep on my stomach my feet add a few inches to my height and I was concerned I'd be pushing on the end of the bag. I also like to move around, and while I dont know for sure, I dont think I'd sleep well were I very constrained. In the end, I went with the long. I chose the 2 season over the 3 season to save money and because I thought the 3 season may be too warm in cooler months. The 2 season coupled with a sleeping bag liner seemed like it may the more versatile choice.

3. Big Agnes Double Z Insulated pad - My requirements for a pad were insulation, comfort, and lack of noise. While this pad is considered "3 season", I felt it may be necessary to have a beefier pad coupled with the backcountry bed that lacks insulation on the bottom. In my testing in 30 degreeish weather it seemed I was right, any cool spots I had seemed to be in the pad. I've even considered returning it for the new "double stuff" double z insulated pad.

4. Mountainsmith Morrison 2 person tent - This was my first purchase. I've found it to be quite bulky in the 50L pack. I do like the tent a lot, it's dimensions are longer than the typical 2 person tent which couples well with my long sleeping bag/pad. It seems very durable. But, for a backpacking tent, seems a bit bulky and heavy. Hopefully it will do as a decent starter tent. I also got the footprint.

5. MSR Windburner 1lt Stove - While there were plenty of cheaper options, I like how small and light this unit is, how it has everything contained. Probably overkill in a newbie starter kit but I figured it may be a worthy investment. Most of the reviews comparing the jetboil to this stove favored the windburner.

6. MSR miniworks ex microfilter - Same logic as the stove - figured I'd get a quality product built to last. The reviews I read on this were very positive in that regard, as long as you dont chip the filter.

7. Accessories - Platypus Big Zip 3ltr bladder, 2x Nalgene widemouth bottles, nite ize cord, various clothes (wicking underwear/socks, wicking base layers, etc)

In the end I went way over budget but hopefully did well and am adequately prepared. I've done a few test runs in my backyard. The first night was 29 with ice covering the tent, I had no beanie and was ill equipped. My head/face got cold and it seemed like, surprisingly, there were cool spots on the pad. My understanding was that with the R-rating of 4.5 I shouldn't have been getting cool spots from the pad. Does the R-Rating value expect the sleeping bag to provide insulation to some degree? (my sleeping bag is not insulated on the bottom). I still need to put together a first aid kit. Anything else I should be considering? How's my gear list look?

(PS I realize in the photo the tarp should not be extending out past the tent, afterward I folded it under, and in the end just purchased the matching footprint).

[Slo-go'en]

Replace the blue tarp with Tyvak (for weight reduction and less bulk). Then trim it so it does not extend beyond the edge of the tent floor. The way you have it now, any rain coming off the tent will collect on the trap and run under the tent floor.

Ops, I didn't read the last line where you corrected that problem.

[pauly_j]

That seems like quite a bit of gear for a 50ltr pack. Can you fit food in there with that?

[BlueRidgeBackpacking]

Yeah, I didn't intent to leave the tent setup when I snapped that photo. I just threw the tarp down to keep the mud from getting my shiny new tent all dirty . After 4 or so more setup/takedowns and folding the annoying cheap blue tarp to the perfect footprint I broke down and got the matching footprint. The mountainsmith morrison has a 5,000-millimeter-rated polyurethane coating on the floor, so I probably dont even need a footprint, but right now with all these funds spent on new equipment I'm motivated to keep everything in the best shape possible.

[BlueRidgeBackpacking]

That seems like quite a bit of gear for a 50ltr pack. Can you fit food in there with that?

I'm honestly not sure yet. I certainly could not fit a bear can but it seems like there's some room left on top in the main compartment, plus the top pack is completely empty. I haven't fully packed with food yet so it's still a bit of a question mark. My goal was to get the smallest pack possible, and seeing as the majority of my hikes with be 2/3 days I was hoping the 50L would be adequate (53L to be specific, large size torso). If it's not I may have to return it and grab the 65L version. If the 50L works out I'll likely, down the road, build a bigger setup (70L range) geared more towards winter backpacking, able to carry bear can, more food, etc.

[DuneElliot]

I'm curious about what you mean by cold spots with the pad.

[egilbe]

The Sierra back country bed is big and bulky. A simple down quilt would have been better. If you feel cold spots underneath you, try doubling up sleeping mats/pads for cold weather. Foot prints are pure profit margin for the mfg. You don't need them. I use a floorless tarp and a piece of tyvek.

[BlueRidgeBackpacking]

I'm curious about what you mean by cold spots with the pad.

Laying in my stomach my belly and thighs were chilly. When I layed on my back my butt and back were chilly. I only lasted from 11 - 2 AM that night. Temps were between 25- 30. The bag is rated 37/27 (EN, Comfort/Lower limit), pad R-4.5. When I came inside I recall my back/butt being quite cold for a while. I also did not have the pad inflated a whole lot, it felt most comfortable to me like that. If I would sit up my butt would lightly touch the ground. Could that have been a factor? Do I need to keep more air in it for proper insulation?

[BlueRidgeBackpacking]

The Sierra back country bed is big and bulky. A simple down quilt would have been better. If you feel cold spots underneath you, try doubling up sleeping mats/pads for cold weather. Foot prints are pure profit margin for the mfg. You don't need them. I use a floorless tarp and a piece of tyvek.

I considered some down quilts but assumed it would be more difficult to stay insulated. The backcountry bed seemed like a reasonable compromise between a quilt and a standard mummy bag. Packed into its stuff sack it fits in the sleeping bag compartment of my pack.

[Hosh]

You're sure to get lots of feed back on cuben fiber this, 900 fill that, mine's the best, etc. Since you're just starting, with a budget (bummer), you'll make some choices that you will change with experience..

If you haven't seen already, https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XqoEJGSUyEM , these Only the Lightest videos provide some good input on gear selection and strategies.

Mike Clelland is another good source for knowledge, https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vX-erGPyejU

My advice is if you can't fit everything in a 50l pack, check out alternatives on your sleep system, tent, clothes carried, first to reduce volume.

[BlueRidgeBackpacking]

Regarding the footprint, isn't it desirable to keep dirt out when packing up the tent? Seems like wiping off the footprint would be easier than the tent bottom, especially out in the field. Do you typically not worry much about a little dirt getting packed up with the tent?

In addition to the puncture/moisture resistance, that was one of my primary motivators for the footprint.

[BlueRidgeBackpacking]

You're sure to get lots of feed back on cuben fiber this, 900 fill that, mine's the best, etc. Since you're just starting, with a budget (bummer), you'll make some choices that you will change with experience..

If you haven't seen already, https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XqoEJGSUyEM , these Only the Lightest videos provide some good input on gear selection and strategies.

Mike Clelland is another good source for knowledge, https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vX-erGPyejU

My advice is if you can't fit everything in a 50l pack, check out alternatives on your sleep system, tent, clothes carried, first to reduce volume.

By far, the bulkiest item taking up space is the tent (seems like takes up half the main compartment!). It's likely that'l be the chink in my armor should I run out of space. Thanks for those recommendations, I'll check the videos out!

[Slo-go'en]

Regarding the footprint, isn't it desirable to keep dirt out when packing up the tent? Seems like wiping off the footprint would be easier than the tent bottom, especially out in the field. Do you typically not worry much about a little dirt getting packed up with the tent?

In addition to the puncture/moisture resistance, that was one of my primary motivators for the footprint.

Yes, for all those reasons. If the floor of the tent is all wet and muddy, the rest of the tent gets all wet and muddy when you stuff it into a sack.

A 50L pack should be good enough for weekend trips in the summer when you don't need much in the way clothes.

Nalgene bottles are bulky and heavy. Replace with plastic soda bottles and if you get rid of the bladder you'll have more room inside the pack.

[BlueRidgeBackpacking]

Yes, for all those reasons. If the floor of the tent is all wet and muddy, the rest of the tent gets all wet and muddy when you stuff it into a sack.

A 50L pack should be good enough for weekend trips in the summer when you don't need much in the way clothes.

Nalgene bottles are bulky and heavy. Replace with plastic soda bottles and if you get rid of the bladder you'll have more room inside the pack.

I should clarify that, while I understand the benefit of less weight, I'm not necessarily prioritizing it for two reasons: My trips are likely to be short and I lift heavy weights 3x+ per week (30 pounds feels like nothing on my back after being used to squatting hundreds of pounds regularly).

The Nalgene bottles fit perfectly and snug in the bottle pockets of the Atmos (not really taking up extra room). They also screw directly onto the MSR Miniworks filter. Should I get serious later on about shaving ounces here and there I'll keep in mind how inefficient they are in terms of weight/bulk.

Thanks for the tips!

[DuneElliot]

Laying in my stomach my belly and thighs were chilly. When I layed on my back my butt and back were chilly. I only lasted from 11 - 2 AM that night. Temps were between 25- 30. The bag is rated 37/27 (EN, Comfort/Lower limit), pad R-4.5. When I came inside I recall my back/butt being quite cold for a while. I also did not have the pad inflated a whole lot, it felt most comfortable to me like that. If I would sit up my butt would lightly touch the ground. Could that have been a factor? Do I need to keep more air in it for proper insulation?

You're asking a lot for a bag that is rated Comfort 37 when the temps are below 30. Lower limit is not a comfort rating but where it will prevent you from getting hypothermia/dying. Someone else may have to weigh in on this one, but it seems like you're expecting too much out of your combo. And no, R ratings don't take the bottom insulation of a bag into account...that insulation underneath you is useless anyway since you crush it.

[egilbe]

My trips are likely to be short and I lift heavy weights 3x+ per week (30 pounds feels like nothing on my back after being used to squatting hundreds of pounds regularly).

The Nalgene bottles fit perfectly and snug in the bottle pockets of the Atmos (not really taking up extra room). They also screw directly onto the MSR Miniworks filter. Should I get serious later on about shaving ounces here and there I'll keep in mind how inefficient they are in terms of weight/bulk.

Thanks for the tips!

how many times are you squatting hundreds of pounds? 25? 30? 40? Let's say you squat 300 pounds 5x5. That equals 7500 pounds. Now, figure a day's hike is 10,000 steps. With a 40 pound pack weight, that's 400,000 pounds you are lifting through a short hike. After a week of hiking with a 40 pound pack, that's 2.8 million pounds. A week of squatting is 22,500. Do you see a difference there? A through hike is 5 million steps. Think about the toll that weight is having on your bones and ligaments and the amount of energy required.

[lonehiker]

how many times are you squatting hundreds of pounds? 25? 30? 40? Let's say you squat 300 pounds 5x5. That equals 7500 pounds. Now, figure a day's hike is 10,000 steps. With a 40 pound pack weight, that's 400,000 pounds you are lifting through a short hike. After a week of hiking with a 40 pound pack, that's 2.8 million pounds. A week of squatting is 22,500. Do you see a difference there? A through hike is 5 million steps. Think about the toll that weight is having on your bones and ligaments and the amount of energy required.

OP, don't you realize that it is impossible to have a successful hiking experience (of any length) with a 40 pound pack...

[BlueRidgeBackpacking]

You're asking a lot for a bag that is rated Comfort 37 when the temps are below 30. Lower limit is not a comfort rating but where it will prevent you from getting hypothermia/dying. Someone else may have to weigh in on this one, but it seems like you're expecting too much out of your combo. And no, R ratings don't take the bottom insulation of a bag into account...that insulation underneath you is useless anyway since you crush it.

You're asking a lot for a bag that is rated Comfort 37 when the temps are below 30. Lower limit is not a comfort rating but where it will prevent you from getting hypothermia/dying. Someone else may have to weigh in on this one, but it seems like you're expecting too much out of your combo. And no, R ratings don't take the bottom insulation of a bag into account...that insulation underneath you is useless anyway since you crush it.

My understanding of the EN bag rating system (as explained here https://www.rei.com/learn/expert-adv...ckpacking.html) is that the "Comfort limit" applies more for women while the "Lower Limit" applies more for men, obviously results may vary. I do generally sleep hot. I was hoping that the 27 lower limit rating, coupled with a R 4.5 pad and appropriate clothing, would mean I could likely withstand temps around 30. I think I'll be okay next time by adding a hat and lightweight fleece. It's just surprising to me that the "weak link" seemed to be the pad.

[DuneElliot]

I don't know much about the particular pad you have sorry, but if it doesn't work for you then something else might be in order...either a different sleeping bag or pad.

[BlueRidgeBackpacking]

how many times are you squatting hundreds of pounds? 25? 30? 40? Let's say you squat 300 pounds 5x5. That equals 7500 pounds. Now, figure a day's hike is 10,000 steps. With a 40 pound pack weight, that's 400,000 pounds you are lifting through a short hike. After a week of hiking with a 40 pound pack, that's 2.8 million pounds. A week of squatting is 22,500. Do you see a difference there? A through hike is 5 million steps. Think about the toll that weight is having on your bones and ligaments and the amount of energy required.

While the focus with heavy weight strength training is certainly not cardio based I do believe all bones/ligaments/stabilizer muscles/etc are stronger for all aspects of fitness and mobility. I also day hike 5-7 days a week, we have a family border collie that makes sure of that . In other words, I believe I am fairly universally fit. To me, it seems like the "ounce counting" mentality should apply more for those that are A. Hiking for many days and/or B. Unfit. Since I'm neither it's not at the top of my priority list. Maybe that will change as I get out and gain more experience backpacking, that seems to be the trend.