Toaks Siphon Alcohol Stove

[Casey & Gina]

I will use pieces of my Toaks wood stove as a pot stand and wind screen. This will require use of a rock, stick, or other object within to raise the burner up to 1" from the pot bottom.

image.jpg

[donthaveoneyet]

Why don't you just make a stand?

[Casey & Gina]

Why don't you just make a stand?

Don't want to carry something else when something I already have will work well.

[squeezebox]

You've convinced me to keep my canister stove. This has way too much fiddle factor. IMHO


May the lightness find you!!

[Mittagsfrost]

Is it possible to simmer with these types of burner? It looks like the burn comes exclusively from the rim, which I imagine would be hard to create a device to simmer with.

Yes, it is. If you use cross bars you can bend some aluminium foil the way shown below and slide it over the cross bars. You may reduce the gap between the two pieces and reduce the heat.

A.jpg
B.jpg
C.jpg

If you use the wire frame as a pot stand it's even more simple. Just lay a piece of metal (or a flat stone) atop the burner and leave a small gap.

D.jpg

[scope]

I don't think I'd ever try to simmer with this stove, but I can vouch for it being a very effective alcohol stove. I also love that it nests with my 4oz bottle, making a very compact pkg.

[Casey & Gina]

You can use a heat spreader, which doesn't weigh much and is flat so packs easily.

[zelph]

There are small alcohol stoves out there that have integrated pot supports. One less item to fiddle with.

I purchased a Siphon(for the fun of it) and found mine to be under powered. Seems it might have a bad seal on the inner section. The jets work but doesn't look like what we see in the above videos.

[Starchild]

The Toaks stove is a capillary hoop stove style and is completely different than a cat food can stove. It has a double wall. Alcohol is drawn up between the walls by capillary action (the walls are very close together). At the top, there is wider area between the walls near the rim (the hoop) were the alcohol accumulates and vaporizes. Tiny holes in the hoop allow the fuel vapors to escape and burn to form the flame jets. Unlike most stoves, the fuel in the reservoir at the bottom does not vaporize. Only a small amount of fuel in hoop vaporizes. This is why they come to full power (bloom) very quickly with little priming time. Also, the pot does not set on the stove (like a cat can stove) so you need a pot stand, but the cold pot does not dampen the fuel vaporization either, and since you only need thermal feedback to vaporize the small amount of fuel in the hoop at the top of the stove, they work well in all temperatures (mine ran normally at 4 deg F last winter, although it took a bit longer to get going at that temp). There is a thread just started for those of us who build these out of aluminum cans. This is the only commercial CHS I know of. I would like to know how they compare to the DIY ones.

This is not entirely correct and it is really not a 'capillary hoop' stove by strict definition.

What is correct is that this is a double walled stove where the inner and outer wall are at a very close distance from each other. Fuel can flow freely from the center to the space between the walls, so it will fill to the same level as the center. Once lit the inner walls quickly heat up and that causes the fuel inbetween the space to heat far faster then fuel in the center. That fuel between the walls boils and bubbles and vaporizes. The bubbling due to boiling causes the higher fluid fuel level in the space between the walls (not capillary action), the term hoop was a throwback to earlier alchy stoves that used a looped (hooped) tube to achieve this (which this one does not have). This does produce more vaporization in that double walled section, and slightly pressurizes the vapor coming out of the ports. Now the rest (main pool) does vaporize, but it is small compared to what is going on between the walls. What is vaporized is just fuel added to what is burnt along side the 'ports' and is ignited there in the fire ring and again is minor.

[Odd Man Out]

I use a DIY eCHS with an Olicamp XTS pot. I make a pot stand out of aluminum flashing that doubles as a wind screen, so one less thing to deal with. The pot heat excanger sets on the stand with no air vents on the top so the vortex flame is focused on the center of the pot and then all heat exits through the heat exchangers. This gives a good combination of both efficiency (boil 2 cups room temp water with less than 15 mL) and power (4.5 min to boil. I don't like stoves where the pot sets on the stove. I need the stability of a wider stand.

[Mittagsfrost]

That's fine, but this thread is about the Toaks Siphon Alcohol Stove, isn't it?

[gravitino]

There are small alcohol stoves out there that have integrated pot supports. One less item to fiddle with.
I purchased a Siphon(for the fun of it) and found mine to be under powered. Seems it might have a bad seal on the inner section. The jets work but doesn't look like what we see in the above videos.

I had a similar experience, talked to Toaks, and received a replacement that worked just fine. After trying 6-7 different stoves, I've kept the Siphon as the one that most closely meets my needs. The sturdy titanium construction gives me peace of mind, and am happy with the fuel consumption, boil time, compactness, and light weight. To me, it is part of a "set and forget" kit that I don't have to worry about. I made the pot stand out of hardware cloth, 2.5 inches high, which along with the rest of the cook kit, rides happily inside a Toaks 650 ml pot.

[cmoulder]

That's fine, but this thread is about the Toaks Siphon Alcohol Stove, isn't it?

There is an unwritten 'rule' that after a 3-year necro-bump thread drift is permissible.

I have a friend who uses the Toaks Siphon Stove and likes it. My current alcohol fave is the Groove Stove used with a Sterno Inferno pot and Ti pot stand that I made for it.

Groove_Stove.jpg

[zelph]

The Siphon would work well with the Sterno Inferno pot and Ti windscreen/pot support. I had excellent results with the Starlyte XL3 and the Inferno Pot and it's aluminum pot support. That set-up taught us a lot. [don't need no cone all the way up the sides of a pot ]

[Odd Man Out]

The Siphon would work well with the Sterno Inferno pot and Ti windscreen/pot support. I had excellent results with the Starlyte XL3 and the Inferno Pot and it's aluminum pot support. That set-up taught us a lot. [don't need no cone all the way up the sides of a pot ]

That's essentially what I described above, except the Olicamp pot is 4 cups and my pot stand is Aluminum and nests inside the pot for storage.

[reppans]

The Toaks is my favorite stove - stopped shopping/trying others since.

Primes instantly; runs properly on tiny amounts of fuel (unlike wick-based stoves); easy to fill, light, snuff out, and recover unused fuel; works fine at 0 F; good for narrow nesting pots; and being hollow, it can be stuffed or nest for near zero incremental volume.

6 min pint boils with 15mls. Flip my cross stand upside down with the binder clip (reduces gap to 1/2" starving air) and it simmers 1min per ml at a slow boil. Use a piece of tinfoil or tin can lid with a wick and it makes a great Alcohol candle for a luxury/survival heater combined with a poncho (Palmer Furnace) - 5min per ml burn time.

I use Everclear for fuel which itself is the ultimate liquid multi-tool, but that's for another thread. Together, they cover many bases and are well worthy EDC for me.

[scope]

Nice pic showing how it works with the Evernew cross stand. Its not the ideal height with that stand (doesn't boil as fast and isn't as efficient), but it does make for a nice compact setup as your pic shows, and works just fine for most trips.

[Odd Man Out]

The Toaks is my favorite stove - stopped shopping/trying others since.

Primes instantly; runs properly on tiny amounts of fuel (unlike wick-based stoves); easy to fill, light, snuff out, and recover unused fuel; works fine at 0 F; good for narrow nesting pots; and being hollow, it can be stuffed or nest for near zero incremental volume.

6 min pint boils with 15mls. Flip my cross stand upside down with the binder clip (reduces gap to 1/2" starving air) and it simmers 1min per ml at a slow boil. Use a piece of tinfoil or tin can lid with a wick and it makes a great Alcohol candle for a luxury/survival heater combined with a poncho (Palmer Furnace) - 5min per ml burn time.

I use Everclear for fuel which itself is the ultimate liquid multi-tool, but that's for another thread. Together, they cover many bases and are well worthy EDC for me.

Agree. That's a nice system. The ability to snuff the flame and recover fuel is a big plus with these types of stoves. It doesn't matter if you have an efficient system that can boil 2 cups with 15 mL of fuel. If in the field your water boils before the flame burns out and you can't snuff it out and/or recover the excess fuel, then your actual fuel use will be greater. That was one reason I switched to using a Starlyte stove for a while. But then I switched to an eCHS stove because it has a lot more power without sacrificing efficiency.

[reppans]

What would you guys consider the ideal burn height and efficiency? I find all my Alky stoves to be pretty consistent at ~15mls per pint at room temp. If anything the Toaks is the fastest boiler of a half dozen stoves (better than Trangia) and it wastes some heat with flames lapping up the sides - my issue are the narrow diameter nesting pots I like for compactness.

If I use simmer mode to boil, I can do a pint in ~12min w/12mls of fuel.

Another thing I really like with the Toaks, is if you slightly under filled it (eg, had more wind then expected) a small splash of alcohol will prime and burn with a proper flame to get the boil I want. Everything other alky stove wastes too much fuel priming or getting soaking a wick (as opposed to burning).

[zelph]

"Fiddle Factors" multiple pieces to make a "stove" Yes, I know......you've made the purchase and will "make" it work for you. The Siphon is not cheap by no means.....but! it's made of "Titanium" the "gotta have" material

Below a certain fuel level the jets cease to work and the fuel remaining in the bottom continues to burn. The fuel level goes below the ridges on the inner section. The ridges in the material is what produces the "siphon" ability of the stove. Fuel level drops below the ridge....no more siphon/capillary action going on.