Homemade backpack material opinions

[litetrek]

I am making a lightweight backpack and need to choose a material or materials. I've been thinking about using super k-kote ripstop nylon for most of the pack and 300 x 400 denier diamond ripstop for the back, bottom and at least the bottom portion of the sides and maybe for the pockets. I don't want to spend a lot on the fabric to save an ounce or two. These seem like reasonable choices, maybe overkill. I also have the old jansport scout bag for use as a donor. It's made of pu coated polyester and it's pretty tough stuff, but at bit heavy at 6 oz per sq yd.

I'd appreciate some thoughts on my fabric choices or better options if you care to comment.
Dyneema strikes me as too expensive and uneccesary on a pack which will get some protection on the bottom and sides from the frame.

So you have some context, I've described what I have in mind below.

Ive been drawing sketches and the pack I'm coming up with is a cross between a G4, the miraposa and the ula catalyst since it has elements of each. It will have a roll top instead of a lid. Probably fabric pockets on the sides; one long one for my hammock stuff and a shorter one on the other side for water bottles, etc. it will have a big mesh pocket in the back.

I plan to mount it on a lightweight jansport scout frame (which I may modify if I have to to cut the weight. Most pack frames are grossly over designed. I'm shooting for very light, but not ultralight. I think less than 16 oz for the pack bag is a reasonable goal. I expect that I can actually do much better than that.

This is post is related to my post about shoulder strap length that then wandered into waist belt territory and then into other day pack/frame subjects, but material was never discussed so I feel it worthy of its own thread.

[4eyedbuzzard]

I'd stay away from using the recycled PU coated polyester. PU coatings break down slowly with age, ultimately delaminating from the base fabric. This typically occurs anywhere from 10 to 20 years after manufacture. It is inevitable and irreversible. The first sign is a bit of a skunky mildew smell. They can be recoated, but stripping it all off and recoating is a PIA, and there are better, newer technical fabrics available.

[Walkintom]

Depending on how much weight you're going to carry, you may want to consider an airframe sheet instead of a hard frame scavenged from another pack. If it gets the job done for you, it's light, comfy and multiuse.

[litetrek]

I'd stay away from using the recycled PU coated polyester. PU coatings break down slowly with age, ultimately delaminating from the base fabric. This typically occurs anywhere from 10 to 20 years after manufacture. It is inevitable and irreversible. The first sign is a bit of a skunky mildew smell. They can be recoated, but stripping it all off and recoating is a PIA, and there are better, newer technical fabrics available.

I didn't mention that the jansport scout is brand spanking new. PU delamination is what killed my beloved Camp Trails backpack years ago. I bought the jansport on clearance for the frame. The jansport has a nice lightweight frame. It occurred to me last night that I could use the pack bag material for heavy wear areas like the bottom. It's a bit heavy but overall it wouldn't affect the total weight much.

[litetrek]

Depending on how much weight you're going to carry, you may want to consider an airframe sheet instead of a hard frame scavenged from another pack. If it gets the job done for you, it's light, comfy and multiuse.

Thanks for the idea. I'm doing this as a learning project to see what I can do with an old school hard frame and newer pack bag design and materials. I picked the lightest cheapest easiest to get old school frame to start. If it looks promising and I like it, I'll redesign the frame in carbon fiber or something similar probably more like a stiffened sheet than tubular to drop some more weight.

I've been backpacking for 40 + years and I happen to like external frame packs better. They are a little clumsy but unless you're bushwacking or scrambling they are more comfortable in my opinion. Wearing an internal frame pack in the southeast past May means having your back soaked in sweat most of the time.

I dont know know anything about airframes. What are they?

[Walkintom]

The pack I'm most familiar with that uses an air frame is the Klymit Motion. The Air frame is essentially just an inflatable cushion that provides support without being overly stiff. Think about a small thin airpad in a chamber where your internal frame would normally be located. Attahed to the airpad is a hand pump bulb for inflating and deflating.

The 35L version of the pack is entirely supported with an air frame sheet. The 60L version of the pack has a lightweight aluminum stay in addition to the air frame sheet.

When I first saw one I thought it wouldn't provide enough support but I took the 60L pack to Isle Royale for a 12 day trip last year and it performed very well for me. Never a rub or sore spot anywhere. It's really had me reevaluating what pack comfort means to me.

I found the product on their website - here's the link. http://www.klymit.com/index.php/prod...ack-frame.html

[Sandy of PA]

With careful planning and reusing the frame, straps and hipbelt, one yard of material will make a nice packbag. Why not use Dyneema or Cuben Hybrid and save weight at the same time? I have used both and found them durable for long distance hiking.

[Just Bill]

I have the fabric, but haven't sewn one up yet... HyperD 300
http://ripstopbytheroll.com/collections/hyperd-300

Kyle also sells a 420d that would work great for reinforcements if needed.

Thru-Hiker sells Dynema X in 210 and 120, but it's big bucks.

X-pac fabric won't delaminate, but again, around 20+ per yard and more flavors than is worth discussing here.

Personally I think the HyperD is a good blend of cost, function, durability (especially as you work out the design)
You may consider some cheap 1.9 oz ripstop too just to practice with.

After you make the frame connections (which you can do with Grosgrain reinforcements too) the rest of the pack body doesn't have to be super burly just because it's an external frame pack. The back panel, frame connections, and maybe the bottom will take the brunt of it... the rest of the pack could be relatively light fabric and do fine. If you're not bushwhacking or strapping on lots of stuff anything 3oz/yd or better is pretty tough in my opinion.

[litetrek]

thanks walkintom. I love gear so I'll have to check that out. I've never seen or heard of one of those so that's good info for me.

Does anyone have any comments on my original post about fabric choices and my tentative picks or suggested alternatives?

[litetrek]

Thanks Sandy. I've done an estimate of the fabric required for what I want to do and its more like 1.5 sq yds with no allowance for waste. I don't think cuben has the abrasion or puncture resistance I want. Dyneema is a nice choice but it is a little pricey.

[litetrek]

I have the fabric, but haven't sewn one up yet... HyperD 300
http://ripstopbytheroll.com/collections/hyperd-300

Kyle also sells a 420d that would work great for reinforcements if needed.

Thru-Hiker sells Dynema X in 210 and 120, but it's big bucks.

X-pac fabric won't delaminate, but again, around 20+ per yard and more flavors than is worth discussing here.

Personally I think the HyperD is a good blend of cost, function, durability (especially as you work out the design)
You may consider some cheap 1.9 oz ripstop too just to practice with.

After you make the frame connections (which you can do with Grosgrain reinforcements too) the rest of the pack body doesn't have to be super burly just because it's an external frame pack. The back panel, frame connections, and maybe the bottom will take the brunt of it... the rest of the pack could be relatively light fabric and do fine. If you're not bushwhacking or strapping on lots of stuff anything 3oz/yd or better is pretty tough in my opinion.

Thanks. That hyper D 300 looks like a better choice than the diamond ripstop I found. Color choices are disappointing though. I definitely don't want black or anything dark or drab. I like the Orange, but orange gear sometimes attracts a lot of negative attention from people who believe it's better to blend into the environment. I know this from experience. I once had a group of older ladies give me grief for 5 minutes about ruining their day in the woods because I was wearing a blaze orange vest. It happened to be the first day of hunting season and we were hiking on state game lands. I don't hunt but I know that the first day is like a shooting carnival with even the worst hunters out there. I got shot at once on the AT in Pennsylvania during hunting season. I had a brown jacket and green pack and was blending in but making noise ...like a deer.

[litetrek]

I've read that the rei flash is made with the super k-kote I mentioned. If I had fabric swatches I could easily chose without asking. I may narrow it to a few choices and then order some sample

[litetrek]

I have the fabric, but haven't sewn one up yet... HyperD 300
http://ripstopbytheroll.com/collections/hyperd-300

Kyle also sells a 420d that would work great for reinforcements if needed.

Thru-Hiker sells Dynema X in 210 and 120, but it's big bucks.

X-pac fabric won't delaminate, but again, around 20+ per yard and more flavors than is worth discussing here.

Personally I think the HyperD is a good blend of cost, function, durability (especially as you work out the design)
You may consider some cheap 1.9 oz ripstop too just to practice with.

After you make the frame connections (which you can do with Grosgrain reinforcements too) the rest of the pack body doesn't have to be super burly just because it's an external frame pack. The back panel, frame connections, and maybe the bottom will take the brunt of it... the rest of the pack could be relatively light fabric and do fine. If you're not bushwhacking or strapping on lots of stuff anything 3oz/yd or better is pretty tough in my opinion.

Any idea where to get xpac in colors? I've spent the morning looking and only find it in black and gray. It comes in a lot of colors but I'm not finding them anywhere. I like the hyper D (probably in Orange) you suggested and may just go with that. But I thought I'd also consider the xpac. Xpac even in black and gray seems to be out of stock most places.

[litetrek]

I have the fabric, but haven't sewn one up yet... HyperD 300
http://ripstopbytheroll.com/collections/hyperd-300

Kyle also sells a 420d that would work great for reinforcements if needed.

Thru-Hiker sells Dynema X in 210 and 120, but it's big bucks.

X-pac fabric won't delaminate, but again, around 20+ per yard and more flavors than is worth discussing here.

Personally I think the HyperD is a good blend of cost, function, durability (especially as you work out the design)
You may consider some cheap 1.9 oz ripstop too just to practice with.

After you make the frame connections (which you can do with Grosgrain reinforcements too) the rest of the pack body doesn't have to be super burly just because it's an external frame pack. The back panel, frame connections, and maybe the bottom will take the brunt of it... the rest of the pack could be relatively light fabric and do fine. If you're not bushwhacking or strapping on lots of stuff anything 3oz/yd or better is pretty tough in my opinion.

Just Bill, your comments on hyperD 300 made me chose that material. Its 2 years later and I'm just now getting around to making the pack. I put together a shopping list today.

I've picked hyperD 300 in blaze orange with dark grey pockets and accents. Black and orange is too halloweeny for me. Anyhow, any recommendation you might make for the bottom material would be helpful. I'd like it to be PU coated and dark grey but I'm fairly flexible on the color. I'll be using the hyperD 300 for everything else. I could probably lighten up on the collar but the weight difference would be minimal.

I'm making something like the seek outside divide 4500 pack. I thought up a design for a internal/external hybrid almost exactly like what they're selling years before they came out with it. Mine uses a jansport scout frame with a diver's mesh back panel pulled tight with 3mm cord and line locks.

I have the frame straps and hipbelt pretty much worked out now and I need to order the packbag materials so I can get started on it.

[rmitchell]

Please post some pictures when it's done. I have considered a similar project with my Trailwise frame.

[litetrek]

Please post some pictures when it's done. I have considered a similar project with my Trailwise frame.

It may take a while but eventually I'll post pics. I plan to add an internal "night pouch" pocket that you can just unhook and take to the tent or in my case the hammock. That's my innovation on the divide. Otherwise its pretty much the same as the divide with dimensions tweaked to fit my frame. The Xpac cost too much for me for what you get. Its true that PU coating will wear out but with the use I give my packs it will likely last 10 years - if I ever get it done.
I have to somehow add load lifters to my shoulder straps

[litetrek]

I have the fabric, but haven't sewn one up yet... HyperD 300
http://ripstopbytheroll.com/collections/hyperd-300

Kyle also sells a 420d that would work great for reinforcements if needed.

Thru-Hiker sells Dynema X in 210 and 120, but it's big bucks.

X-pac fabric won't delaminate, but again, around 20+ per yard and more flavors than is worth discussing here.

Personally I think the HyperD is a good blend of cost, function, durability (especially as you work out the design)
You may consider some cheap 1.9 oz ripstop too just to practice with.

After you make the frame connections (which you can do with Grosgrain reinforcements too) the rest of the pack body doesn't have to be super burly just because it's an external frame pack. The back panel, frame connections, and maybe the bottom will take the brunt of it... the rest of the pack could be relatively light fabric and do fine. If you're not bushwhacking or strapping on lots of stuff anything 3oz/yd or better is pretty tough in my opinion.

I ordered some hyperD 300 samples for the color and was surprised about how light and flimsy it is. That said its probably adequate but it doesnt inspire a lot of confidence. I don't bushwack but I do a lot of hiking on ungroomed trails. I did a test of dragging a broken of stick over the fabric and it seemed to damage the PU coating on the opposite side. So, I'm thinking something a little more burly might be a good idea. I also ordered a sample of 420 robic (bottom and back) for comparison and I think it's too much - to stiff, too burly What can I get that's in between? Gridstop seems good choice but its crazy expensive and color choices are really limited. I would like something waterproof. Vx21 looks good but I'm not an expert at sewing and its pretty unforgiving if you have rip a seam. I'm a little afraid to use VX21 for that reason.

So (sew), can anyone suggest some options? I like the diamond robic my six moons fusion 50L is made of but I can't find the material anywhere.

[Venchka]

Mix and match VX07 with VX21. Those two fabrics are used in virtually all of the cottage industry bikepacking bags. A relatively new branch of the outdoor industry.
The gear holds up for 2,600+ mile rides in the annual Tour Divide.
Google is your friend.
Wayne


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[Just Bill]

"While many higher-denier coated fabrics are very stiff, HyperD 300™ is specifically made to have a softer hand and increased packability. A premium choice textile for backpacks, heavy-duty tarps, gear bags, and tent floors."

To quote Kyle. But the soft hand was intentional.
As you mentioned, 420 Robic, (cordura) and others get pretty stiff and leathery. HyperD is pretty unique in that regard, and for a decent pack fabric it's remarkably cheap.
The 210 Gridstop is still pretty heavy.... he does have four colors now at least. But that type of fabric gets tough to find.

I never got into the X-pac stuff...

Otherwise my advise is still about the same as two years ago... I still think overall these are pretty heavy materials for an on trail pack.
My next attempts will be in the Hybrid 1.7 fabrics... but too much time sewing hammocks to mess with packs these days.

Honestly... if I can do crap like this with this fabric... I think you'll be fine with the 300d.

Besides... the odds of a MYOG person using a pack long enough to wear out before you come up with a new design or color to try are pretty much zero

<span style="color: rgb(51, 51, 51); font-family: Roboto; font-size: 17px; white-space: normal;">

[rocketsocks]

When the internet first started (floppy in the C drive) one of my first searches was for some cordura pack clothe for a pack I was building...it returned a lesbian site. I don’t remember if I ever found cordura that night many moons ago. That is all...carry on!