White Mountains
Do you need a permit to hike the whites? Are there any other considerations I should take?
I can answer both questions!
> Do you need a permit to hike the whites?
No.
> Are there any other considerations I should take?
Yes -- a LOT.
More specifically about the former: you need not inform any agency before you set out to hike or camp in the White Mountains.
HOWEVER, you better inform YOURSELF about the rules to obey, the dangers to watch out for, and the necessity to plan your days VERY carefully. Every year people DIE in the Whites because they either didn't (1) take the dangers seriously enough, (2) check the weather, or (3) properly estimate their ability to travel from one place to another.
If you plan to stay at an AMC lodge, you must make your reservations WAY in advance. Do NOT arrive at a lodge and expect to get a place to stay that night!
Last edited by GoldenBear; 01-27-2017 at 14:24.
No permit required.
Many other considerations, too many to cover in one post. The stretch between Glencliff NH and Grafton Notch ME is probably the most challenging part of the AT. Camping is limited or nonexistent, and much of the trail is either insanely steep or above treeline and highly exposed, with treacherous weather. It can be awesomely beautiful or quite dangerous, depending on the weather.
No permits need, just lots of money.
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You do need to do your research and your potential exposure is higher than much of the AT. That being said there are thousands of folks who successfully hike the AT through the whites every year. If you are willing to write a large check, the AMC has a hut system that covers the vast majority of the whites which make it a lot easier but its not a guarantee sometimes the conditions between the huts are just plain dangerous. Conditioning also plays into equation. The trails are quite steep and even below treeline due to soil conditions, the trails end up effectively being paved with rocks. The combination of the rocky footing and steep elevation changes means a slower than expected hiking pace.
Do note the AMC huts are very popular and they fill out months before, I wouldn't be surprised is some huts are already booked for popular weekends this summer. (Hint they aren't cheap!)
Go to the following websites for more info
WMNF General rules and restrictions https://www.fs.usda.gov/Internet/FSE...rdb5363715.pdf
AMC Huts https://www.outdoors.org/lodging-camping/huts/
WMNF general info with a list of campgrounds and huts on pg 4 http://www.hbbostonamc.org/docs/WMNF...deShelters.pdf
If you are planning more than one stay at a hut you can generally save a few dollars by becoming an AMC member to get the member discount.
For planning purposes, assume you will only hike 1/2 to 2/3 of your normal daily hiking distance due to the difficulty of the terrain.
Bring suitable warm clothing even in summer including windstop clothing, especially jacket, and including hat. Because 40-50°F temps (normal on the exposed ridges) with 30 to 50 mph winds (also normal) will really put a hurting on your ears if exposed. Windstop fleece beanies work well as do hoods.
Raingear of some sort is a must, as if you get soaked above treeline you are in danger of becoming hypothermic very quickly.
"That's the thing about possum innards - they's just as good the second day." - Jed Clampett
There may be some confusion as the original poster posted the question in the thru hiker specific forum. A SOBO thru hiker will have had Maine under their belt which is darn fine introduction to the whites. NOBO thru hikers have more trail miles but are still pretty clueless about the terrain once they leave Glencliff. Various skills acquired along the way make them a bit more resilient than someone off the street but more than few have gotten their butt kicked on Moosilaukee and ending up having to reconfigure their plans after the stretch from Kinsman Notch to Franconia Notch finishes them off.
The far bigger concern are section hikers who are trying to cherry pick the trail, their approach frequently is they aren't going to do the whole trail so why not do the "best" sections. They frequently are at best in weekend warrior condition and are trying to do the whites as a vacation and that adds in time pressure. Therefore the usual approach is make an overly optimistic plan. They may make the first couple of days out of shear cussedness but at some point they will hit a wall and hopefully don't get hurt doing it. Ideally for someone who wants to "do the whites" it is far nicer to spend a week dayhiking or maybe mix in some overnights after the first few days. The area is well suited for this especially car campers. There are even "free" forest service drive in primitive campsites not very well publicized hidden away in spots. Using this approach you can pick your days to miss bad weather. Hiking above treeline in a rainstorms with lightning bolts crashing below you is not only deadly, its not fun. There are numerous loop day hikes that will get you into places that thru hikers never get to see. One of two nights at an AMC hut would offset the costs of an entire week of car camping.
Do some research on the Great Gulf, Tuckerman's Ravine, Kings Ravine, Evans Notch, the Pemi wilderness, The Bonds, these are all places the thruhikers miss or skirt by. Sure they may have walked through the whites but they sure haven't seen all of it.
By the way NH fish and game has a hike safe website http://hikesafe.com/index.php?page=things-to-consider that has equipment recommendations.
Don't walk into this cold. As a newbie hiking the Whites, think rough, and dangerous. Do your homework. Watch lots of youtube videos. Read trail journals.
As others have said, no permits required. If parking at a trailhead, you may need to fill out a form on an envelope, put in your money ($3/day) and hang a piece of paper pulled off of the form on your car rear view mirror.
Warnings about limited camping locations are correct. The hiking is challenging in many spots because the trails were built without switchbacks, and are heavily used. On long hikes finding water can sometimes be a bit of a challenge as well. Just be flexible with your schedule because you will probably not go as many miles in a day as anticipated, use common sense about safety and weather (especially on the wonderful above tree line sections), and expect to see a lot of other hikers on most sections - especially on the weekends.
Most of all, take your time and enjoy. The Whites are a wonderful place to hike.
+1Originally Posted by peakbagger
I am a big fan of the Evans Notch area - the quite side of the Whites. Not only are there some very fun hikes, but there are also some outstanding swimming holes (Emerald Pool, Rattlesnake Pool).
Some beautuful, above treeline hikes and ridge walks, too.
Quit telling everyone my hiking spots!
No worry, the extra 2 hour drive from mass and southern NH usually keeps the crowds away from Evans Notch, same thing for Grafton Notch.
Evans Notch area had some nice hiking when I first hiked there 25+ years ago. Last time I was up there, maybe ten years ago, I found the trails mostly abandoned and overgrown, very difficult to navigate. In fact one one of those hikes -- off to the east side of 113 -- the trail just petered out completely. It led me to an open summit and the footings of some fire tower, but beyond that I could not find where the trail continued, even after following several possible paths.
That path to the top of East Royce was fine, though.
Another fine trail is the Grafton Loop, with excellent views in several places. Not exactly the White Mountains, a bit more sheltered, but more and better opportunities for camping that you'll find on the AT in that region.
I personally have never had issues with finding water in the Whites, along the AT or other trails. I've hiked all of the 4000s, most on multi-peak and overnight trips. Probably the longest stretch I can think of along the AT without a reliable water source would be the ~8 miles between Mizpah Spring Hut and Lakes of the Clouds Hut (all above treeline). 2 liters should easily get most hikers through that stretch, carry 3 just in case.
Worst case scenario, take a side trail off a ridge and you'll find water usually within .5 miles.
Righeous
AT SOBO '13
Montani Semper Liberi- Mountaineers are always free
There's no water between Lakes hut and Madison, IIRC. Or between Lafayette and Haystack.
Often far too much water on Ethan Pond trail. It's usually underwater after any kind of rain.
I agree with the idea of approaching the White Mtns. as a series of day hikes. You can go up and over Moosilauke in a day, catch a shuttle ride from the hostel in Glencliff. Do the Franconia Ridge as a loop from Lafayette Place campground. Up Falling Waters and down Bridle Path, or vice versa. With a bit of hitchiking, you could do an overnighter on Kinsman, stay in or camp next to Kinsman shelter.
If you truly want to camp in that area, best to stay off the AT. There are trailheads every few miles along the Kancamagus highway with trails heading uphill either to the north (Pemi wilderness) or south (numerous peaks along the Passaconaway range.)
special considerations for hiking the White Mountains portion of the AT:
1) It is the most strenuous portion of the entire trail. Have good food ware.. sneakers don't cut it.
2) the mountains are high and there are long stretches above tree line. Bring fleece, hat, gloves, full rain gear even if you go in July and August.
3) there is no camping anywhere above tree line. You can stay at Lakes or Madison AMC huts but if you pay it is very expensive and reservations must be done months in advance. If you are a thru hiker you can do work for stay. that means you show up late afternoon (not mid day--then they send you away) and you can sleep on floor free and get meals with crew in exchange for a half hour +- of chores either than night or next day. You WILL be woken up by crew around 5 am and you may be delayed in starting next day.
4) Even below tree line you can't camp just anywhere. you have to camp at designated sites many of which involve an 8-10 $ per night care taker fee.
5) weekenders, not thru hikers, are kings up here.
Actually, you only have to camp at designated sites if you are within 1/4 mile of those designated sites. If you are not near one of the huts or the designated sites, you just have to be below treeline and 200 feet from water or the trail.
Camping is hard to find at times because you are often walking along a ridge and 200 ft off the trail is also 200 ft off a cliff through impenetrable spruce brush. But, there are places to be found if you have a mile of two of flexibility on where you stop. I often think a hammock would be a good idea in the Whites, although, I haven't actually done it because I'm too much of a weight weenie to carry a hammock.
I'm not lost. I'm exploring.
There's no water between Lakes hut and Madison, IIRC. Or between Lafayette and Haystack. There is actually a quite reliable water between Lake of the Crowds and Madison Hut from a marked spring just off the AT just south of Sphinx Col. A lot of folks miss this spring as they elect to blue blaze over Mt Clay via the Mt Clay loop and skip the actual AT route which runs west of Mt Clay. I have never seen this spring dry. The Sphinx trail turns into a stream bed as it drops into the Great Gulf. Usually there is water within 1/4 of mile of the AT junction. There are some boggy spots along the trail between Edmonds Col and Mt Adams that usually have water, they are just cloud bogs with no active flow so they should be regarded as unreliable and in need of filtering.
The warning about Lafayette and Haystack really needs to be expanded. There is no even moderately reliable water source between Liberty Springs campsite and the low point in the ridge between Lafayette and Garfield unless the hiker takes the blue blaze down to the Greenleaf Hut (about a mile and 1000 foot vertical drop).
With respect to camping, folks are giving you incorrect information, I wish it were a simple as an absolute 200 foot rule but its far more complex. In many cases in the whites you can set up a tent and camp right in the middle of the AT. This WMNF document is the only source that counts and even it doesn't cover things 100%https://www.fs.usda.gov/Internet/FSE...rdb5363715.pdf. The FS will occasionally designate otherwise legal camping areas as no camping/regeneration areas. These are usually just wide spots just off the trail that get heavy use. They do not post these closures anywhere except at the actual location.
I have met folks who use hammocks and they feel its preferable. In the dense spruce fir zones up near treeline, there are frequently large enough trees to hang from where the ground is totally unusable for a tent.
Now PeakBagger, If you read the brochure which you most helpfully linked to for us, you will note the statement quoted below, which pretty clearly states that there is no camping within 200 feet of the trail (at least along the AT corridor) except where noted otherwise, such as near shelters. The actual practice as stated on the signs along the trail is a 1/4 mile buffer zone, marked by nicely laminated paper trail signs.
The many obvious camp sites located near and practically on the trail along the AT corridor are completely and entirely illegal and highly frowned upon by both the forest service and other hiker that have to see the wear, tear and clutter of these inappropriately used locations.
Quote:
No Camping, Wood or CharcoalFires within 200 feet of:
The following trails:
. . .
• Appalachian Trail corridor from the summitof Mt. Moosilauke to the Connecticut River(except at shelters)
. . .
End quote
It is also worth noting, there there are also lots of "illegal" camp sites that are a ways off the trail, although not fully 200 feet, that are nicely hidden down a short side trail, sometimes even within the 1/4 mile buffer of the huts/shelters that, although technically illegal, are fairly responsible spots that are acknowledged and even recommended by AMC staff at times. So, I would suggest there is often a bit of reasonable and responsible flexibility in how we, as a community, interpret the more explicit rules or laws.
However, it is NEVER appropriate or legal to camp on or close to the trail!!
Last edited by nsherry61; 01-27-2017 at 12:40.
I'm not lost. I'm exploring.
nsherry61 you are correct in theory... long as you are 1/4 mile or more from a hut, a campsite, a road heat, a water source and below tree line you can camp. In practice however, a hiker will be very hard pressed to find a suitable camping spot (levelish ground, water source nearby, not in thick brush) unless he is at a designated spot. Add on to that the fact that the Whites are so heavily traveled that those very few suitable spots are very likely to be taken, particularly on weekends. Much better I think to just plan to stay at a designated spot and pay the caretaker fee.
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