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  1. #101
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    ( Vegans and vegetarians don't get strokes and heart attacks nearly as often, and we live 4 years longer on average )

    There are many confounding factors in the equation of living longer. People who define themselves as Vegan probably tend to have a lifestyle which includes exercise, moderation in alcohol consumption, no smoking, and other behavior choices that enable longevity. To imply that a vegan diet is the root of long life is ingenuous. A plant based diet(not necessarily vegan) is, most likely, a healthy diet; to consider long life, one must factor in exercise, attitude/behavior, environment, and genetics.
    humor is the gadfly on the corpse of tragedy

  2. #102
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    "Perhaps humans will all evolve someday to realize that killing does not have to be a part of life for us anymore. Human discovered the higgs boson, we are certainly smart enough to come up with sane, ethical ways to deal with silly invasive possums."


    Evolution requires selective pressure. I'm betting that the birth rate for vegetarians is much lower than it is for carnivores. I don't think how smart we are as a species has much to do with what we eventually become as a species.....other than extinct. Intelligence is probably an evolutionary dead-end street.




  3. #103
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    I don't have a bit of problem with possum down gloves, down filled sleeping bags, tuna in foil pouches, or that great turkey burger they serve at the Doyle.
    "Chainsaw" GA-ME 2011

  4. #104
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    Quote Originally Posted by halvedspeed View Post
    Oh for crying out loud dude. I was going to just leave it alone.
    Not a single one of those articles is science at all. They aren't written by scienticists, and the people they are quoting are halfwit anthropologist who are taking guesses, not doing ANY scientific research.
    - There is proof change in diet, they discovered fire. But they were still omnivores the whole time. And a vast majority of plants do not give forth useable nutrients to us unless cooked. The one thing that our gigantic brains needed more than anything to function was GLUCOSE. That's it's fuel. When you cook cellulose you get glucose and lots of it. Yes it needs protein and fats, but if you believe that you can't have a big brain on a vegetarian diet, then all children raised in vegetarian households should be brain dead. All the building blocks in the brain (and body for that matter) are found in plants. And if you look at predominately vegetarian primates, their long intestines are way longer than ours because they can't cook cellulose. ( There should have been evolutionary pressure not to eat meat. Vegans and vegetarians don't get strokes and heart attacks nearly as often, and we live 4 years longer on average )
    - if you so fervently believe in evolution, and claim I do not, perhaps take a look at a entirely more believable evolutionary reasoning for such big brain- THE ONE THAT IS EXCEPTED AS SCIENCE THE WHOLE WORLD OVER.At the time there were about a dozen hominid species running around and clubbing everything that moved and pillaging. The dumb ones that couldn't make tools were killed off. Then the ones that didn't make fire were killed off. But the biggest evolutionary win was language. Our brains (specifically the prefrontal cortex) are designed for high level interactions with other creatures. Now we believe that about 4-5 hominid species has the ability to speak languages. They created cities and burried their dead in religious fashion.
    The brain game ramped up speed and evolution chose the winner. Whoever was the smartest most efficient won. (Intelligence also has nothing to do with brain sizes, see elephants, or even female vs male human brains)
    Obviously, we won by running around raping and killing everything that walked on two legs as you can see Neanderthal DNA in our genome. We were the best at language, tool making, infrastructure etc. There IS scientific evidence of that whole situation happening unlike the mere conjecture that big brains require meat.
    - oh ffs seriously with the plants? Now reaction to stimiuli is having a brain? Give me a break. Again- that article is not science. Any botanist worth their salt will never ever say that plants have brains or could ever become anywhere near sentient.
    And again its just assuming glutamate channels=brain. Sea sponges are our genetic ancestor. They gave us our Cannabinoid receptors. But they use it to regulate their homeostasis.
    We use it to help reduce cortisol levels when dealing with annoying pseudoscience.

    If you want me to source anything I will. I just don't have the time to produce the hundreds of evolutionary biology/psychology and neuroscience journals that I just used.

    And to wrap up. You live in an industrialized economy with a hyper abundance of food. There is no genetic, evolutionary, dietary reason to eat meat anymore. I grant that indigenous people still need their goats and chickens to survive but you most certainly do not.
    Perhaps humans will all evolve someday to realize that killing does not have to be a part of life for us anymore. Human discovered the higgs boson, we are certainly smart enough to come up with sane, ethical ways to deal with silly invasive possums -_-

    Sent from my LG-H830 using Tapatalk
    If you wish to believe something that supports your vegan nature, so be it...no skin off my back.
    “He is richest who is content with the least, for content is the wealth of nature.” –Socrates

  5. #105
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    Quote Originally Posted by halvedspeed View Post
    Oh for crying out loud dude. I was going to just leave it alone.
    Not a single one of those articles is science at all. They aren't written by scienticists, and the people they are quoting are halfwit anthropologist who are taking guesses, not doing ANY scientific research.
    - There is proof change in diet, they discovered fire. But they were still omnivores the whole time. And a vast majority of plants do not give forth useable nutrients to us unless cooked. The one thing that our gigantic brains needed more than anything to function was GLUCOSE. That's it's fuel. When you cook cellulose you get glucose and lots of it. Yes it needs protein and fats, but if you believe that you can't have a big brain on a vegetarian diet, then all children raised in vegetarian households should be brain dead. All the building blocks in the brain (and body for that matter) are found in plants. And if you look at predominately vegetarian primates, their long intestines are way longer than ours because they can't cook cellulose. ( There should have been evolutionary pressure not to eat meat. Vegans and vegetarians don't get strokes and heart attacks nearly as often, and we live 4 years longer on average )
    - if you so fervently believe in evolution, and claim I do not, perhaps take a look at a entirely more believable evolutionary reasoning for such big brain- THE ONE THAT IS EXCEPTED AS SCIENCE THE WHOLE WORLD OVER.At the time there were about a dozen hominid species running around and clubbing everything that moved and pillaging. The dumb ones that couldn't make tools were killed off. Then the ones that didn't make fire were killed off. But the biggest evolutionary win was language. Our brains (specifically the prefrontal cortex) are designed for high level interactions with other creatures. Now we believe that about 4-5 hominid species has the ability to speak languages. They created cities and burried their dead in religious fashion.
    The brain game ramped up speed and evolution chose the winner. Whoever was the smartest most efficient won. (Intelligence also has nothing to do with brain sizes, see elephants, or even female vs male human brains)
    Obviously, we won by running around raping and killing everything that walked on two legs as you can see Neanderthal DNA in our genome. We were the best at language, tool making, infrastructure etc. There IS scientific evidence of that whole situation happening unlike the mere conjecture that big brains require meat.
    - oh ffs seriously with the plants? Now reaction to stimiuli is having a brain? Give me a break. Again- that article is not science. Any botanist worth their salt will never ever say that plants have brains or could ever become anywhere near sentient.
    And again its just assuming glutamate channels=brain. Sea sponges are our genetic ancestor. They gave us our Cannabinoid receptors. But they use it to regulate their homeostasis.
    We use it to help reduce cortisol levels when dealing with annoying pseudoscience.

    If you want me to source anything I will. I just don't have the time to produce the hundreds of evolutionary biology/psychology and neuroscience journals that I just used.

    And to wrap up. You live in an industrialized economy with a hyper abundance of food. There is no genetic, evolutionary, dietary reason to eat meat anymore. I grant that indigenous people still need their goats and chickens to survive but you most certainly do not.
    Perhaps humans will all evolve someday to realize that killing does not have to be a part of life for us anymore. Human discovered the higgs boson, we are certainly smart enough to come up with sane, ethical ways to deal with silly invasive possums -_-

    Sent from my LG-H830 using Tapatalk

    Ok, I'm just going to ask for citations for the above as there is ZERO evidence to prove any of it.
    I have searched PUBMED and found NOTHING.
    I found plenty of junk science on PETA-type sites, but nothing that would EVER qualify as science.
    Vegan is an incomplete diet, period.
    That is why any physician who doesn't want to get sued will put Vegans on a supplement.
    Heck, some physicians even refuse to treat Vegans.
    Vegetarians are not the same as Vegans, so they can get away with milk and egg products, though still not 100% complete.

    BTW: you know what I did find on PUBMED?
    Almost unanimous agreement to something like, "therefore it can be concluded that there is no proof that saturated (animal) fat or animal protein lead to ANY disease".
    And these are NOT studies sponsored by the beef industry or anything of the sort.
    Only independent studies done and published in JAMA, JON, NEJOM, etc.

    Seriously, I am all for doing whatever you want, but there is way too much junk science out there.
    So if you want to be Vegan, knock yourself out.
    But don't tell people that it's superior to ANY diet, when it's by definition incomplete (B vitamins, COMPLETE proteins, etc.) and all science shows otherwise.

    See you at the Lehigh Gap sometime!

  6. #106
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    Quote Originally Posted by halvedspeed View Post
    If you want me to source anything I will. I just don't have the time to produce the hundreds of evolutionary biology/psychology and neuroscience journals that I just used.
    Why don't you just say thousands? It sounds about as ridiculous and unbelievable.

    I think most vegans get unfairly labeled as zealots because of their beliefs, but it's posts like these that reinforce the stereotype. Rampant proselytizing and presenting misinformation as accepted truth.

  7. #107
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    Odd that vegetarians/vegans would object to the culling of possums in New Zealand given that they are responsible for destroying vegetation , eating eggs of birds in decline already as well as spreading bovine tuberculosis.
    Another case of people that don't know, pretending that they do.
    This is a kea, one of the birds endangered by possums (BTW, a very clever bird , don't leave your pack unattended...)
    kea.jpg
    and this is the typical damage left by possums :
    possum damage 1.jpg
    possum damage.jpg

  8. #108
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    This is one of the funniest threads I've read in a while, not sure how I missed it originally. Surprised to see there a couple of other Louisiana residents posting on white blaze. Carry on with the posting, I've got to head home and get ready to fry some fresh, never frozen speckled trout.

  9. #109
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    For the few (...) that have not seen a kea in action , here it is :

    for the ones that have not read my previous comment, the introduced possums eat kea's eggs.

  10. #110

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    Yes, but can a Kia be juggle?

  11. #111
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    Wheelie bins, lol.

  12. #112

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    Quote Originally Posted by halvedspeed View Post
    Oh for crying out loud dude. I was going to just leave it alone.
    Not a single one of those articles is science at all. They aren't written by scienticists, and the people they are quoting are halfwit anthropologist who are taking guesses, not doing ANY scientific research.
    - There is proof change in diet, they discovered fire. But they were still omnivores the whole time. And a vast majority of plants do not give forth useable nutrients to us unless cooked. The one thing that our gigantic brains needed more than anything to function was GLUCOSE. That's it's fuel. When you cook cellulose you get glucose and lots of it. Yes it needs protein and fats, but if you believe that you can't have a big brain on a vegetarian diet, then all children raised in vegetarian households should be brain dead. All the building blocks in the brain (and body for that matter) are found in plants. And if you look at predominately vegetarian primates, their long intestines are way longer than ours because they can't cook cellulose. ( There should have been evolutionary pressure not to eat meat. Vegans and vegetarians don't get strokes and heart attacks nearly as often, and we live 4 years longer on average )
    - if you so fervently believe in evolution, and claim I do not, perhaps take a look at a entirely more believable evolutionary reasoning for such big brain- THE ONE THAT IS EXCEPTED AS SCIENCE THE WHOLE WORLD OVER.At the time there were about a dozen hominid species running around and clubbing everything that moved and pillaging. The dumb ones that couldn't make tools were killed off. Then the ones that didn't make fire were killed off. But the biggest evolutionary win was language. Our brains (specifically the prefrontal cortex) are designed for high level interactions with other creatures. Now we believe that about 4-5 hominid species has the ability to speak languages. They created cities and burried their dead in religious fashion.
    The brain game ramped up speed and evolution chose the winner. Whoever was the smartest most efficient won. (Intelligence also has nothing to do with brain sizes, see elephants, or even female vs male human brains)
    Obviously, we won by running around raping and killing everything that walked on two legs as you can see Neanderthal DNA in our genome. We were the best at language, tool making, infrastructure etc. There IS scientific evidence of that whole situation happening unlike the mere conjecture that big brains require meat.
    - oh ffs seriously with the plants? Now reaction to stimiuli is having a brain? Give me a break. Again- that article is not science. Any botanist worth their salt will never ever say that plants have brains or could ever become anywhere near sentient.
    And again its just assuming glutamate channels=brain. Sea sponges are our genetic ancestor. They gave us our Cannabinoid receptors. But they use it to regulate their homeostasis.
    We use it to help reduce cortisol levels when dealing with annoying pseudoscience.

    If you want me to source anything I will. I just don't have the time to produce the hundreds of evolutionary biology/psychology and neuroscience journals that I just used.

    And to wrap up. You live in an industrialized economy with a hyper abundance of food. There is no genetic, evolutionary, dietary reason to eat meat anymore. I grant that indigenous people still need their goats and chickens to survive but you most certainly do not.
    Perhaps humans will all evolve someday to realize that killing does not have to be a part of life for us anymore. Human discovered the higgs boson, we are certainly smart enough to come up with sane, ethical ways to deal with silly invasive possums -_-

    Sent from my LG-H830 using Tapatalk
    Ah, I remember these days fondly. Although, they weren't rooted in fact but more of a desire to see less cruelty in the world. However, there is no doubt (and the fossil record agrees) that meat-eating and the tools designed for meat-eating fueled the rise of Homo Sapiens. There is no question that one can live a long, happy lifestyle without meat-eating these days but evolutionary urges are hard to dispel. It is certainly your right not to patronize businesses with practices you do not agree with but, make no mistake, meat-eating will not stop as long as Homo Sapiens exist.

  13. #113
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    The "unethical" part is the person who created the video. They are the ones who made this video (sacrificing one of their dear creatures) all in an effort to create an emotional response.

    Any time I see something like this, I want to know who was behind the creation of the video, that will often tell you more than the video itself.

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