Tyvek vs poly for tarp ground sheet...

[colorado_rob]

If cuben floors weren't so expensive I'd prob go that route. However, as a ground sheet, what advantages do they have over polycro or tyvek?

Well, in the case of zpacks "ground sheets" for zpacks tents, they are sewn nicely into a bath tub shape. One can do this themselves, of course, with Tyvek, as I have recently sort of done this. A little tougher to do with polycro. I would think the cuben ground sheets are also a bit tougher than polycro or Tyvek. But yeah, expensive. Looks like 2-mil plastic is about twice as heavy at polycro, might be slightly tougher, I don't know.

[Dogwood]

I like very thin poly for weight; it's tougher than it seems.

I put a dab of tape in each corner, doubled over so it grabs on each side of the corner. Then I paper-punch a hole through the tape. I then use shepherd hook stakes to hold each corner down, not tight but with a little slack. First thing I do in camp.

Makes it easy to lay down on it, both directions, maybe move the setup around in various spots to make sure I'm not going to be trying to sleep head downhill or rolling side to side. This would be a major PITA when the flimsy stuff blows around in the wind. The tape is felt-pen-marked so I know which side is "clean" and up.

This stable clean platform is nice to have to lay stuff on when I'm unpacking and packing up next morning. As I'm setting up I may remove the corner stakes for other purposes once there is weight on the sheet; if I'm cowboying that night I just leave the stakes in. Over time I have evolved to using four of those very thin titanium shepherd hook stakes for this purpose and leaving them in, those four stakes serving double duty as my extra "batten down" stakes for tent or tarp in a major storm.

The sheet usually lasts a very long time; a corner will tear or stretch out more often and require re-taping, maybe every 20-30 nights. Since the plastic is so light I cut it over-sized and spray all around the perimeter, top & bottom, with permethrin since I cowboy so often. The permethrin needs to be re-applied every 15+ nights or so because it doesn't "take" to the plastic as it does to fabric.

Good stuff. I've used stick on fiber binder ring hole washers to strengthen stake holes in polycro. To prevent the polycro from tearing, like you said you do, I don't put much force on it and attach some of the lightest wt micro bungee cord(1.2 mm) I but at Hobby Lobby or JoAnns fabrics to it to keep it almost taut but enough force that it stays put as a ground sheet with a 3-4" high bathtub edge. i stretch the nine out LOOSELY to my tarp stake so no extra stakes are need. It's the lightest wt bathtub floor I've made yet for a MLD Solomid and MLD Duomid. It's not as durable as Joes's ZPack's 1.o oz/sq yd bathtub floor but for sub $15 I can make two and one doesn't cost me $100+.

[Dogwood]

I agree with you 1.0 CF ground sheet bathtubs last longer than Tyvek 1443 in like conditions. But, again, as you say 1443 is like 1/6 - 1/8 the cost of CF 1.o.

[Engine]

I like very thin poly for weight; it's tougher than it seems.

I put a dab of tape in each corner, doubled over so it grabs on each side of the corner. Then I paper-punch a hole through the tape. I then use shepherd hook stakes to hold each corner down, not tight but with a little slack. First thing I do in camp.

Makes it easy to lay down on it, both directions, maybe move the setup around in various spots to make sure I'm not going to be trying to sleep head downhill or rolling side to side. This would be a major PITA when the flimsy stuff blows around in the wind. The tape is felt-pen-marked so I know which side is "clean" and up.

This stable clean platform is nice to have to lay stuff on when I'm unpacking and packing up next morning. As I'm setting up I may remove the corner stakes for other purposes once there is weight on the sheet; if I'm cowboying that night I just leave the stakes in. Over time I have evolved to using four of those very thin titanium shepherd hook stakes for this purpose and leaving them in, those four stakes serving double duty as my extra "batten down" stakes for tent or tarp in a major storm.

The sheet usually lasts a very long time; a corner will tear or stretch out more often and require re-taping, maybe every 20-30 nights. Since the plastic is so light I cut it over-sized and spray all around the perimeter, top & bottom, with permethrin since I cowboy so often. The permethrin needs to be re-applied every 15+ nights or so because it doesn't "take" to the plastic as it does to fabric.

Thanks for the tape and stake idea, I'll give that a go.

[saltysack]

I like very thin poly for weight; it's tougher than it seems.

I put a dab of tape in each corner, doubled over so it grabs on each side of the corner. Then I paper-punch a hole through the tape. I then use shepherd hook stakes to hold each corner down, not tight but with a little slack. First thing I do in camp.

Makes it easy to lay down on it, both directions, maybe move the setup around in various spots to make sure I'm not going to be trying to sleep head downhill or rolling side to side. This would be a major PITA when the flimsy stuff blows around in the wind. The tape is felt-pen-marked so I know which side is "clean" and up.

This stable clean platform is nice to have to lay stuff on when I'm unpacking and packing up next morning. As I'm setting up I may remove the corner stakes for other purposes once there is weight on the sheet; if I'm cowboying that night I just leave the stakes in. Over time I have evolved to using four of those very thin titanium shepherd hook stakes for this purpose and leaving them in, those four stakes serving double duty as my extra "batten down" stakes for tent or tarp in a major storm.

The sheet usually lasts a very long time; a corner will tear or stretch out more often and require re-taping, maybe every 20-30 nights. Since the plastic is so light I cut it over-sized and spray all around the perimeter, top & bottom, with permethrin since I cowboy so often. The permethrin needs to be re-applied every 15+ nights or so because it doesn't "take" to the plastic as it does to fabric.

Good idea....does any permethrin actually stick to the poly?


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[saltysack]

So is the poly Mld sells same as window film etc? I think it's $8...pre cut for 2....


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[saltysack]

I have used poly-cro for many years and it is very durable and light weight. Walmart has an off brand of patio door thermal window film that is wide enough for most tent footprints.

Tyvek is noisy unless ran through a washer several times, it is also heavier. I used it for several years before switching.

I have roll of Tyvek left over from building a house, if you want some, pay shipping and it's yours.

Appreciate offer but think I'll just try poly.....


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[saltysack]

If it's largely for use where you live nice to make arrangements for those FL torrential down pours with a bathtub floor and perhaps offering some protection from fire ants and palmetto bugs whatever fabric you use.

The places I camp in this hell hole require a full net......it's doubtful I'd every carry the mid here....can't imagine trying no net in the glades!


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[RockDoc]

I like Tyvek. Good under the tent, good to put down on a shelter platform. Durable, not slippery like nylon. cheap.
We dressed ours up with a few lines of racing bibs sewn on the edges for more width and some visual interest... it has served about 8 years now, still going strong.

[Hosh]

The places I camp in this hell hole require a full net......it's doubtful I'd every carry the mid here....can't imagine trying no net in the glades!


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thread drift warning:

Curious what precautions are need in alligator country. Seems like they would be hard to scare off.

I have heard stories of golfers praying they don't get drug into a lake or canal. It would be pretty scary to wake up with a 10'er outside your tent, cuben fiber or otherwise

[saltysack]

thread drift warning:

Curious what precautions are need in alligator country. Seems like they would be hard to scare off.

I have heard stories of golfers praying they don't get drug into a lake or canal. It would be pretty scary to wake up with a 10'er outside your tent, cuben fiber or otherwise

I'm no more afraid of them than black bears....I thru paddled the 312+ mile st.johns river on my 17'6" expedition SUP in 2012...counted well over 1,000 gators and one was definitely record breaking size well over 15'....less than 50' away...pucker factor was high with that dinosaur. He made the common 10' gators look small. I actually was lil nervous when I stopped to camp that night a few miles later. Only time I stay well away is when they are rutting in late spring.

[saltysack]

thread drift warning:

Curious what precautions are need in alligator country. Seems like they would be hard to scare off.

I have heard stories of golfers praying they don't get drug into a lake or canal. It would be pretty scary to wake up with a 10'er outside your tent, cuben fiber or otherwise

Hear is a pic from that campsite the next morning over my tent.....


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[Dogwood]

What's better depends on conditions of use and ones' other priorities. Ryan Jordan did a good run down on this BPL thread while referring to the Solomid but is just as valid for the Duomid. https://backpackinglight.com/forums/...ge/2/#comments

One of things I so appreciate in reviews and why decisions were made are when hikers give supporting details like anticipated conditions, THEN, move forward with their gear choices. Helps to provide context and perspective. This is why I like Skurka's and like minded and formulated trip and gear reports/lists. Then "the Skurk" follows up with some general comments about what he liked, he could have done better, what he thought was problematic, etc. That shows development, evolution as a hiker. Helps me understand and make better decisions for myself.

[bret]

Tyvek 1443R kite material has been used 20-30 nights and still like new (3.5oz for solo and 4.4 oz for double). Polycro ripped after a few nights and it's a little more fussy to lay out. I'll tape the edges to prevent ripping before trying again. Often don't bother, but if going somewhere rough/rocky I'll bring one.

[Leo L.]

After some discussions here on WB I made a groundsheet from housewrap, similar to Tyvek but non-slippery.
While it is not really waterproof, I love it, and made another one for my most recent tent, of a similar, but lighter housewrap material.
Its a bit on the heavy side, and it doesn't fold and roll very easy.
Everything else is very positive: Cheap, easy to make, very durable, non-slippery, has a white (= clean) and a dark-grey (= dirty) side, dries very quick when grey side exposed to the sun.
Due to the straps on each corner there is more use to it than only as ground sheet.
I carry it on the outside of the pack and use it as sitpad for every break, or as sleepingpad for a longer noon break every now and then.

[Gambit McCrae]

Tyvek is a great DIY material. Its cheap and easy to replace/ try new ideas out with.

I have used a tyvek sheet for a ground cloth for under my tarp for 3 trips now and although I have not had bad weather, it has held up really well. I got some grommets to put in the corners, and they have worked well too.

[cmoulder]

I use a Tyvek housewrap bathtub in my Duomid. it is easy to fold the corners like a box and tape them with duct tape, using some pieces of bamboo chopsticks in the corners as stays to help the bathtub hold its shape. It is held in place with 2.5mm shock cord attached to the corners of the Duomid, and plastic hooks to attach/release quickly.

duomid tyvek bathtub.jpgDuomid shock cord closeup.jpg

[saltysack]

I use a Tyvek housewrap bathtub in my Duomid. it is easy to fold the corners like a box and tape them with duct tape, using some pieces of bamboo chopsticks in the corners as stays to help the bathtub hold its shape. It is held in place with 2.5mm shock cord attached to the corners of the Duomid, and plastic hooks to attach/release quickly.

duomid tyvek bathtub.jpgDuomid shock cord closeup.jpg

Perfect!!! Exactly what I was thinking...any pix of chop sticks in corners?


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[cmoulder]

Sorry, I don't have a pic of that but it's fairly easy to describe...

After the corners are folded, make a small hole in the corner crease where you want to attach the shock cord, which is about in the middle. Feed the shock cord through the hole to the chopstick (about 4" long) and then tie it to the chopstick. Align the chopstick along the inside of the corner and the hole where the shock cord exits, and then tape it in place with a piece of duct tape.

[saltysack]

Sorry, I don't have a pic of that but it's fairly easy to describe...

After the corners are folded, make a small hole in the corner crease where you want to attach the shock cord, which is about in the middle. Feed the shock cord through the hole to the chopstick (about 4" long) and then tie it to the chopstick. Align the chopstick along the inside of the corner and the hole where the shock cord exits, and then tape it in place with a piece of duct tape.

I wonder if this set would would work with poly? You use the lighter kite tyvek or std house wrap?


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