Are Bugs a Problem With a Tarp Tent?

[cmoulder]

the biggest problem you will have is when it's hot. You will have to choose between dying of heat or bug bites. A hot NJ made me go away from trap bivy to a mid style tarp with a bug net inner in warmer weather.

That's why we have Duplexes (Duplexi?). It's kinda fun just lying on the sleeping mat watching the gnats, mosquitoes and flies trying to get in.

Duplex bug net mode-1.jpg

[nsherry61]

That is a seriously cool round rock next to your Duplex. It looks like something inflatable that was painted camo on purpose.

[rafe]

Yeah, but not around the northern part of the AT, thank goodness. Northern AT is tick born diseases, not mosquito born ones.

I don't know that mosquitoes care about state boundaries. We certainly have them here in MA, and I've certainly experienced them in VT and NH. Mosquitoes in eastern MA have been found carrying EEE virus. West Nile virus has been seen in all of New England except for Maine and NH.

[nsherry61]

I don't know that mosquitoes care about state boundaries. . .

Of course they don't.

. . .We certainly have them here in MA, and I've certainly experienced them in VT and NH. . .

Yeah, but diseases with mosquito vectors (like most diseases actually) are fairly, if not highly, species specific, and different mosquito species occupy different climatic regions. So, just like African bees haven't been able to invade all of North America, most of the disease carrying mosquitoes are somewhat regional in their presence as well.

. . . Mosquitoes in eastern MA have been found carrying EEE virus. . .

Yeah, but I'd be more scared of being struck by lightning . . . or stubbing my toe for that matter. "Eastern equine encephalitis (EEE) is a rare illness in humans, and only a few cases are reported in the United States each year. Most cases occur in the Atlantic and Gulf Coast states. Most persons infected with EEEV have no apparent illness."

. . . West Nile virus has been seen in all of New England except for Maine and NH.

Again, a vanishingly small likelihood of infection in New England anywhere, or anywhere along the AT for that matter. Probably more likely to be killed by a terrorist than become infected with West Nile on the AT. . . . and if you do become infected ". . . most people infected with WNV will have no symptoms. About 1 in 5 people who are infected will develop a fever with other symptoms. Less than 1% of infected people develop a serious, sometimes fatal, neurologic illness."

The world is only really scary if you dwell on highly unlikely events. People get hooked on gambling to add spice to their life. I wonder if dwelling on highly unlikely events like terrorist attacks, bear attacks or mosquito diseases in North America is just another way to keep us feeling alive.

[rafe]

nsherry: West Nile stats from CDC:

http://www.cdc.gov/westnile/resource...5_07072016.pdf

43,937 cases, 1,911 deaths since 1999. 2175 cases, 146 deaths in 2015.

EEE is much more rare, but there have been cases in my local area (eastern MA.)

These are hardly the only mosquito-borne illnesses of course. Zika is the latest. Malaria was, of course, the biggest killer, I think.

"In 2015, 48 out of 50 states reported WNV infections in people, mosquitoes, or birds. In those states, 2,060 cases of WNV were reported in humans, and there were 119 confirmed deaths (5.8%) in 2015. This is in line with 2014 data, which had 2,205 human cases of WNV and 97 deaths (4.4%)."

http://www.vdci.net/blog/2015-year-in-review

BTW, not writing off or ignoring tick-borne diseases. I'm pretty sure I've had one form or another of Lyme over the years. (Long lasting and/or serious symptoms often attributed to Lyme.)

[Another Kevin]

Aye. And the single greatest advance in medical care: Window screens.

I'd say that's the second greatest advance. The first is flush toilets.

[nsherry61]

nsherry: West Nile stats from CDC: . . . 43,937 cases, 1,911 deaths since 1999. 2175 cases, 146 deaths in 2015. . .

And, to the point, how many of those were along the AT? Let's not blow danger out of proportion. That's like bringing Zika into this discussion below when I doubt there is a single Zika incident along the AT ever.

EEE is much more rare, but there have been cases in my local area (eastern MA.)

And, I'm not denying that diseases exist and cause harm. I am suggesting that there are a lot of more dangerous things to be concerned with than mosquito born diseases along the AT. Take reasonable precautions and then don't sweat it. If you choose not to take prudent precautions, make sure you know the disease symptoms so you can get treated in a timely manner if needed.

These are hardly the only mosquito-borne illnesses of course. Zika is the latest. Malaria was, of course, the biggest killer, I think.

"In 2015, 48 out of 50 states reported WNV infections in people, mosquitoes, or birds. In those states, 2,060 cases of WNV were reported in humans, and there were 119 confirmed deaths (5.8%) in 2015. This is in line with 2014 data, which had 2,205 human cases of WNV and 97 deaths (4.4%)."

Yeah, it's dangerous. Yeah, taking reasonable precautions is prudent. . . but, back to an earlier quote:

No organism has caused more human deaths than the mosquito.

I think we can safely state that, in North American, mosquitoes are not particularly dangerous and certainly not nearly as dangerous as other human beings.

BUT, I will give you that, outside of other human beings, mosquitoes are the most dangerous animal in the United States. So, maybe we should start bring up mosquitoes as a bigger danger (by far!!) than bears whenever bear safety threads get going. We can compare bears to mosquitoes instead of bears to the risk of dying from a car accident driving to the trail-head.

Actually, I think we should dramatize and exaggerate all the outdoor dangers (falling being the biggest of course) to keep more people from using and wearing out our natural areas. ;-)

[MuddyWaters]

Since yellow fever was eradicated in 20th century (in US), mosquito borne deaths in US are low. Before that, yes mosquitos wiped out tens of thousands per year, whole towns and communities.

MOST people are not succeptible to things like West Nile, etc. Some are, a low percentage unfortunately. I personally knew a retired coworker that died from it, he was 71. Bit by mosquito in his suburban backyard. But most people with healthy immune systems arent affected, especially the very young. This is same for most of these scare viruses. They can be devastating, but they do not result in pandemic becauase it is really only to a small percentage. This is a good thing, because you will never eradicate mosquitos, they are everywhere. Im doubtful that community efforts at mosquito control really do any good at all. At the height of west nile scare, planes would spraying over ballparks where my daughter played...while we were being eaten up by mosquitos in evenings. Did no good if you ask me.

Not saying dont take precautions. But your odds are good. People arent dieing left and right from mosquito bites. Im covered with them currently. still alive....I think.None came while sleeping.

[Wise Old Owl]

Insect protection is luxury, not necessity.
Witness AT hikers that only sleep in open shelters

Under you bag, with hat and headnet on, you are well protected for sleeping.

I like my insect free zone however.
It's a mouse-free zone too....usually. The incontinent little ba$t@rds like to chew on $$$ gear. Particularly food or sweat soaked.

No biggie - Clearly you have not been to CANADA!....

Up north they (mosquitos) are worse than vampires...

Although this image was taken in a different country... It reminds me of what I ran into...

[Time Zone]

you will never eradicate mosquitos,

It may not be impossible to eradicate the specific species which are the main carriers of disease, though:

http://www.bbc.com/news/magazine-35408835

The decision to undertake such a project involves more than merely the question of technical feasibility, though.

[Wise Old Owl]

And, to the point, how many of those were along the AT? Let's not blow danger out of proportion. That's like bringing Zika into this discussion below when I doubt there is a single Zika incident along the AT ever.


And, I'm not denying that diseases exist and cause harm. I am suggesting that there are a lot of more dangerous things to be concerned with than mosquito born diseases along the AT. Take reasonable precautions and then don't sweat it. If you choose not to take prudent precautions, make sure you know the disease symptoms so you can get treated in a timely manner if needed.



Yeah, it's dangerous. Yeah, taking reasonable precautions is prudent. . . but, back to an earlier quote:

I think we can safely state that, in North American, mosquitoes are not particularly dangerous and certainly not nearly as dangerous as other human beings.

BUT, I will give you that, outside of other human beings, mosquitoes are the most dangerous animal in the United States. So, maybe we should start bring up mosquitoes as a bigger danger (by far!!) than bears whenever bear safety threads get going. We can compare bears to mosquitoes instead of bears to the risk of dying from a car accident driving to the trail-head.

Actually, I think we should dramatize and exaggerate all the outdoor dangers (falling being the biggest of course) to keep more people from using and wearing out our natural areas. ;-)

Mosquito born disease continue to be the worlds biggest killer since the discontinued DDT.
I remember now....


We have here in Pennsylvania a Boy Scout Die at Horseshoe Reservation from Encephalitis.... So I I know that first hand...

[Wise Old Owl]

Uh Not to scare you folks....

Wake up..

Deaths 2015

A typical Jogger.

[AfterParty]

That is a seriously cool round rock next to your Duplex. It looks like something inflatable that was painted camo on purpose.

For real thanks for pointing that out!! Nice campsite

[rocketsocks]

That is a seriously cool round rock next to your Duplex. It looks like something inflatable that was painted camo on purpose.

i thought it was the dogs bed, and I was getting jealous, nice one!

[nsherry61]

Mosquito born disease continue to be the worlds biggest killer since the discontinued DDT. . .

Maybe we can put this seemingly disproportionate attention to the danger of mosquitoes into a more meaningful context.
Mosquito born disease deaths in the USA apparently total somewhere around 200-300 per year. Seems like a scary number. But, as a comparison, since 1976, depending on the year, the common seasonal flu, in the United States, killed from 3000 to almost 50,000 people per year.

As AT hikers, I don't see us getting overly stressing out over the flu which kills 10 to 100 times more people than mosquitoes.

[rafe]

As AT hikers, I don't see us getting overly stressing out over the flu which kills 10 to 100 times more people than mosquitoes.

I never meant to imply that a mosquito bite is a death sentence. OTOH, I do suggest that effective protection from mosquitoes and other bugs is not really a "luxury" on the AT. And that the need for such protection isn't confined to the south.

As to the effects of cold and flu on the AT -- I know of one retired couple, friends of mine on my thru hike attempt -- who quit their thru hike after contracting severe colds. Having reached that age myself now, it's a real concern. I'm more susceptible, and recovery takes longer when I do get one. It's lovely having a young, robust body and immune system, but not all of us are in that spot.

[Wil]

As to the effects of cold and flu on the AT -- I know of one retired couple, friends of mine on my thru hike attempt -- who quit their thru hike after contracting severe colds.

A little OT but I camped at Garfield Pond in the Whites with a group of north bounders a few weeks ago. One of them had a cough so deep, prolonged and spasmatic that if it were up to me he'd have been taken to a doctor. They wound up doing a layover day I think (I moved on) on a cold rainy day with temps that night forecast near freezing. They were talking about banking a fire to face his tent.

Hope they made it. Hope he's still alive, made it or not.

[nsherry61]

I never meant to imply that a mosquito bite is a death sentence. OTOH, I do suggest that effective protection from mosquitoes and other bugs is not really a "luxury" on the AT. And that the need for such protection isn't confined to the south.

Point taken.

But, now I'm getting pulled in the other direction of debating that grey line of "luxury" item and it probably needing to be defined by the individual, not the community.

To me, toilet paper is a luxury item that I don't even find luxurious.
To me, a tent is a luxury item that I don't even find luxurious. Tarps rock.
To me, a stove is a luxury item that I do use at least half the time and really enjoy when I have it.
To me, mosquito netting is a luxury item, since I can survive without it and I rarely actually even use it.

Dang, I gotta go and this list could go on until I was "Naked and Afraid". Okay, not really, I don't consider food or a water container luxury items.

[Wise Old Owl]

Maybe we can put this seemingly disproportionate attention to the danger of mosquitoes into a more meaningful context.
Mosquito born disease deaths in the USA apparently total somewhere around 200-300 per year. Seems like a scary number. But, as a comparison, since 1976, depending on the year, the common seasonal flu, in the United States, killed from 3000 to almost 50,000 people per year.

As AT hikers, I don't see us getting overly stressing out over the flu which kills 10 to 100 times more people than mosquitoes.

West Nile, Encephalitis, Chikungunya, and now a little thing called Zika.

Maryland and surrounding areas appears to be a "confirmed hotspot"

For those that are interested Here is the VDC for 2015 with detailed explanation. CLICK

"In 2015, 48 out of 50 states reported WNV infections in people, mosquitoes, or birds. In those states, 2,060 cases of WNV were reported in humans, and there were 119 confirmed deaths (5.8%) in 2015. This is in line with 2014 data, which had 2,205 human cases of WNV and 97 deaths (4.4%). Keep an eye out for a future blog post with much greater detail about WNV and its effect on humans, as well as on bird populations.

Eastern equine encephalitis (EEE): EEE is also transmitted to humans by the bite of an infected mosquito, but is fortunately a rare illness for humans, with only a few cases reported in the United States each year. Although some people infected with EEE have no apparent illness, severe cases of EEE lead to inflammation of the brain, often beginning with a high fever, headaches, and vomiting. The illness will often progress into disorientation, seizures, or coma. EEE is a severe mosquito-transmitted disease, with about a 33% mortality rate. Additionally, even survivors can develop significant brain damage. "

[nsherry61]

West Nile, Encephalitis, Chikungunya, and now a little thing called Zika. . .

And, there is not one case of locally transmitted Zika in the continental United States outside of Florida.
And, there are, on average 8 cases of EEE reported nation wide.

Why are we even discussing these?

Your likelihood of dying due to falling is roughly 1000x greater than death by mosquito, so my recommendation is to not get out of bed, especially if your bed has side rails on it to keep you from accidentally falling out of it.