Carrying Water On the AT ~ How Much Is Enough?

[PaulWorksHard]

I'm guessing no one has ever died of dehydration on the AT. IF you are trying to go ultralight, I would try to carry no more than One liter of water. During droughts, or perhaps in PA, you might want to carry more. I see no reason to ever carry more than 2 liters. I tried to plan it so I would be out of water 15-30 minutes before the next source. That being said I did have to do an uncomfortable 10 miles with no water in July in PA once and 5 miles another time. I figure in 130 days of hiking that's not too bad. The 10 miles with no water took a toll on the body, even after drinking 3 liters when reaching water. The next day I was definitely dragging.

[One Half]

I found I can get much further by dropping to just 1 liter of water in hot weather. of course this means filling up before leaving camp or the water source and then just carrying the 1 liter. I always have the ability to carry much more in case of very dry conditions or for just the time in camp (1 trip to water source for dinner and breakfast and hopefully getting started in the morning well hydrated). My most recent trips have been solo so I carry 2 - 1 liter bottles and a 3 liter bladder. But like I said, usually just hike with 1 liter depending on sources.

[Another Kevin]

Do newbs have opinions? Yes. Are they valued? Not much.

The issue I have with that remark is that to you, virtually everyone here is a newb. You've literally spent years living off the grid and under the radar. But how much experience do you have with the "fast and light, only a few days between town stops" hiking style that's so popular here?

Not everyone is hiking in your style. You like to go for maximum length of stay, others go for maximum mileage, or with particular objectives in mind. They'll have different lengths of water carries - or more often, different lengths of time because of speed changes.

I don't much value the advice on water management that comes from a person who has no idea how much they need to get to the next source. I also don't value much the opinion of someone who tells me that I'm carrying a stupid amount of water just because I want to walk past the next source (which happens to be almost a thousand feet of elevation below the trail) and go on to the source after that. I know that I'm big and slow, and I drink more between water sources than some people. And I tend to lallygag more than most, and I use the major trails more often as approach routes to stranger places, places where I may not have reliable information about water. I also know that "camel up" doesn't work for me. If I force water, I feel funny, and hike weakly, until I've pissed it out again. I know that my personal water carry will be higher than most for all those reasons.

Sometimes my water advice to someone I know will be, "I'd carry three litres on that stretch, but you'll be fine with two, you're faster than me," or something. To someone I don't know, I'll describe conditions, but not try to prescribe quantities, unless I'm dealing with a total newb, in which case I'll advise to over-carry until they know how much they need and can make the decision for themselves.

Just my take on things from nearly half a century of occasional weekends and short-sections. My most recent foray into longer-distance hiking was on a trail where I didn't bother carrying more than a litre, because the answer to "where's the next water?" would usually be, "you're standing in it," so it's hardly relevant to the discussion.

[Tipi Walter]

But how much experience do you have with the "fast and light, only a few days between town stops" hiking style that's so popular here?

Not everyone is hiking in your style. You like to go for maximum length of stay, others go for maximum mileage, or with particular objectives in mind. They'll have different lengths of water carries - or more often, different lengths of time because of speed changes.

"Only a few days between town stops" sounds like a terrible way to go backpacking but then as you said that's just me. I go out to avoid towns and civilians and folding money and commerce and fast traffic and motorcycle noise and all the rest. When I return home then I deal with all this crap.

When I was homeless around towns with my backpack and gear I often left the woods to get food and other supplies. It was often every 3 or 4 days.

I see the current Fast & Light fad as a way of backpacking for the new millennium but not relevant to me. How can a backpacker go fast and light if he's on an expedition in a 100,000 acre wilderness or backcountry with a 50 lb food load?? And if he does decide to explore such an area, why in Odin's name would he want to breeze thru all the trails at 20 miles a day and, get this, visit a town every 4 days to resupply for food? It makes no sense.

So, in some ways thruhikers in my opinion are squandering a great opportunity to saturate themselves in the woods with no interruptions if they would be willing to stop the Point A to Point B forced march (Georgia to Maine) and instead, since they have a 4 or 5 month block of time, to use this time to stay out for a month at a time with one food load and explore and exhaust a large backcountry trail system, and in the process use the AT as a link to these other trails---such as the BMT and Bartram and Bartram Western Extension into the Snowbird wilderness etc.

Example: Start at Springer with a large food load and get on the BMT and enter the Cohutta wilderness and do all the trails in the Cohutta and then return to the BMT and head north into the Big Frog and repeat and then go north on the BMT and pull a food resupply after 25 or 30 days of backpacking. Why not? They already have the time allotted for a thruhike.

Then when they reach Fontana on the BMT they could take the AT south over Cheoah Bald and shoot for Georgia (thereby avoiding the pesky GSMNP fees and rules) and once near Standing Indian they could explore the Southern Nantahala Wilderness for several days etc. You get the drill.

Check out the blue blaze opportunities off the AT near Standing Indian---

[Tipi Walter]

In other words, Fast & Light becomes Uninterrupted, Slow and Heavy. "Uninterrupted" being the key point.

[Hosh]

It's pretty frequent to find internet forums where a handful or a single individual that self idolize and try to dominate the conversation. Lot's of heroic personal stories or maybe lies, pictures of themselves conquering the world, and a general disdain for anybody who doesn't use their gear, hike their hike or follow their mantra.

Personally I enjoy reading experiences and opinions from others who have been in a diverse set of environments. Whether it be a well worn trail, deserts, dense forest, trail less wilderness or high alpine tundra. I can still find information that helps sharpen ones knowledge and skills.

Unfortunately it sometimes comes with a "know it all" "done it all" or 2 that have to be tolerated or even occasionally admired.

[Tipi Walter]

It's pretty frequent to find internet forums where a handful or a single individual that self idolize and try to dominate the conversation. Lot's of heroic personal stories or maybe lies, pictures of themselves conquering the world, and a general disdain for anybody who doesn't use their gear, hike their hike or follow their mantra.

Personally I enjoy reading experiences and opinions from others who have been in a diverse set of environments. Whether it be a well worn trail, deserts, dense forest, trail less wilderness or high alpine tundra. I can still find information that helps sharpen ones knowledge and skills.

Unfortunately it sometimes comes with a "know it all" "done it all" or 2 that have to be tolerated or even occasionally admired.

And yet you have no opinion on long trips w/o resupply vs long trips with frequent resupply? Saying "self-idolize" is a convenient way for you to keep from exploring any of the points we have discussed.

[Dogwood]

C'mon it's a thread on water management.

Uh oh, maybe another pissed off anti WB WB is anti UL thread on BPL?

[Secondmouse]

I say carry at least a liter if you start feeling dehydrated chug it.

if you start feeling dehydrated, it's too late to chug it...

[Tipi Walter]

C'mon it's a thread on water management.

Uh oh, maybe another pissed off anti WB WB is anti UL thread on BPL?

The conversation started about water and the chance of needing to carry more water---8 lbs more? 16 lbs more? And then really became about water management with packs holding a lot more water weight. Then the talk shifted to Dry Camps and how much water would be needed to stay overnight at a dry camp.

Being a forum discussion, the posts evolved to talk about camping in creek valleys where water is plentiful versus camping on ridgelines where water ain't . . . plentiful. Then Dogwood brought up backpacking has no rules and forum replies herein are opinions based on what someone else believed worked for them. Then ties these "opinions" into water logistics. Btw, in a drought my opinion is that you'll be carrying more water to your camps as shelter sources could be dry.

Then Another Kevin brought up a whole different subject called "Hiking Style" and especially the fast & light style. I joined in on the fray.

I can make no sense of this one though---

Uh oh, maybe another pissed off anti WB WB is anti UL thread on BPL?

[Secondmouse]

the thread is titled "carrying water on the AT", so I assumed it meant how much do I need to carry between water stops on the AT. silly me...

my answer to that is it depends on my personal fitness, the temperature, and elevation change. usually I'll budget about 1/2L per mile but I like to sip frequently from my water bladder so my mouth is never dry.

maybe I carry more water than I should but I find I almost never get a headache this way...

[Lnj]

Best to always err on the side of caution when it comes to ones safety, especially when considering dehydration. That's a serious mood killer. Go with a worst case scenario to start, then when/if you see you don't need all that much... you can always pour it out on the ground and its still LNT. No harm no foul. However, should you underestimate your need and find yourself in a tough spot and no water for more miles than you can make... well that's a problem.

[Another Kevin]

TThen Another Kevin brought up a whole different subject called "Hiking Style" and especially the fast & light style. I joined in on the fray.

Uhm, a hiker's hiking style doesn't affect how much water has to be carried? You and I have very different styles, but we are both slower than the Fast & Light folks, which means it's going to take either one of us longer to get to the next water source, and we'll most likely be drinking more on the way. (Particularly if you're sweating away humping that three-week food carry. More power to you, seriously! I don't foresee ever having the time to get into the sort of physical condition that long an unsupported trip demands, or to have my equipment tuned well enough to do without a town stop for that long. I'm a little envious, even as I shake my head.)

[garlic08]

One should also note that this thread is in the Ultra-Light Hikers Forum.

[MuddyWaters]

One should also note that this thread is in the Ultra-Light Hikers Forum.

Well, im reasonably light. I tend to go 10 miles without taking a sip quite often if its not real hot.

Often while carrying 2L anyway. Just dont want to slow down or stop to drink.
In any case , start well hydrated from a source, and really never need more than 2L on AT, even in drought.

[PaulWorksHard]

Tipi,
You are obviously knowledgeable about backpacking and contribute a lot to the forums. Am I a confused about the website's purpose? It is WhiteBlaze.net, correct? It is "a community of Appalachian Trail enthusiasts", correct? Seems to me you really don't approve of thru hikers or white blazers for that matter. Am I missing something?

[capehiker]

Tipi,
You are obviously knowledgeable about backpacking and contribute a lot to the forums. Am I a confused about the website's purpose? It is WhiteBlaze.net, correct? It is "a community of Appalachian Trail enthusiasts", correct? Seems to me you really don't approve of thru hikers or white blazers for that matter. Am I missing something?

That's been the irony for years on here. Tipi admittedly loathes thru hikers and anyone who enjoys hiking the AT.

[MuddyWaters]

That's been the irony for years on here. Tipi admittedly loathes thru hikers and anyone who enjoys hiking the AT.

Who wouldnt loathe people that travel in "trail families", party their way up the trail town to town, go ratbox to ratbox only, leave trash and gear at ratboxes, stay in town if it rains, etc?

Most thru hikers arent out there to enjoy nature, they are out for other reasons. Only fools think they are admirable. In the spring south of damascus, they are nothing but a clown show.

Whiteblaze.net has a large section of " other trails" too.

[Tipi Walter]

Tipi,
Am I a confused about the website's purpose? It is WhiteBlaze.net, correct? It is "a community of Appalachian Trail enthusiasts", correct? Seems to me you really don't approve of thru hikers or white blazers for that matter. Am I missing something?

Just because I present another way of backpacking the AT---By using it to connect blue blaze trails and staying out longer with one food load (read my post 44)---DOES NOT MEAN I disdain all thruhikers. And where have I criticized Whiteblaze???? You may dislike one of my posts but don't jump to other conclusions. And if I really hated thruhikers or the AT I wouldn't have spent so many days recently backpacking on the thing---(not to mention all the time I backpacked on the AT in the 1980s)---

https://tipiwalter.smugmug.com/Backp...-In-Mt-Rogers/

https://tipiwalter.smugmug.com/Backp...son-Highlands/

That's been the irony for years on here. Tipi admittedly loathes thru hikers and anyone who enjoys hiking the AT.

I have written about the thruhiking mindset repeatedly in my trail journals and have done several trips on long trails with thruhikers. I understand MuddyWaters' post below and where he is coming from as I too have made a list of things thruhikers seem to represent TO ME---My Opinion Only. He pretty much summarizes my feelings both about some thruhikers and especially my dislike of the rat box shelter system.

He doesn't mention some thruhiker's tendency to sit at trail shelters "Holding Court"---an affliction common with thruhikers. What is holding court? All this was discussed on an earlier Whiteblaze thread---See---

http://www.whiteblaze.net/forum/show...=1#post1992192

http://www.whiteblaze.net/forum/show...=1#post1993226

Who wouldnt loathe people that travel in "trail families", party their way up the trail town to town, go ratbox to ratbox only, leave trash and gear at ratboxes, stay in town if it rains, etc?

Most thru hikers arent out there to enjoy nature, they are out for other reasons. Only fools think they are admirable. In the spring south of damascus, they are nothing but a clown show.

Whiteblaze.net has a large section of " other trails" too.

Yes, I like the way your mind thinks even though you are probably being sarcastic. "Only fools think they are admirable" is a little left field. But you're right, WB has an Other Trails section. I post most of my trip reports here on "Other Trails" or on the "BMT" Forum. Backpacking the AT is still backpacking, despite the frequent town visits and motel stays and rat box shelters etc.

One thing I can't understand is the depressing tendency of AT backpackers to bail into towns so often for either food resupplies or worse, to avoid challenging weather. Every winter I gather up numerous online Trail Journals from AT thruhikers and I'm amazed by how often they get off the trail to avoid snowstorms or deep cold events. Here is one example but I won't mention the guy's name. (I brought out his trail journal on a very long and very snowy backpacking trip of my own)---

PITIFUL TRAIL JOURNAL ACCOUNT
This jewel is from ******, an Appalachian Trail backpacker describing his experience with snow on the trail on February 9, 2016 (remember I was in deep snow on Brush Mt in a tent and loving it while he was hating it). Here's part of his entry from that day:


"Let me tell you how I really feel. F*** snow. Snow is no joke. It's a hateful bitch. Meteorologists suck, and so does snow. The forecast was for a max of 6 inches over the course of two days on the mountains. We woke up to 6 inches after the first night and the snow was not stopping."


"******* was ambitiously planning to hike 15 miles, but the rest of us were already formulating contingency plans. It took me only an hour of hiking with the snow stinging at my face to realize I needed to get the f*** off the mountain ASAP. Although the snow was light and powdery and not nearly as difficult to walk in as the snow in the Smokies, I had developed icicles on my hair and felt as though I had sandbags tied to my ankles. **** caught up with me before reaching Flint Mountain Shelter (our designated lunch spot) and he commiserated with me on finding a way out of the snow."


"We waited for Sun Down while at the shelter and decided to call Uncle Johnny's for a shuttle from Devil's Fork Gap, a few miles down the trail. **** handed me the phone to "work my magic" and procure us a ride. Within an hour and a half, we were in a warm van with Jeff, the hotel manager, and Jerry Garcia, the hostel mascot."


MY OPINION?
"We were in a warm van" is about the most depressing thing I've read this year.

Just a sample and you get the drift.

[garlic08]

I hope the OP got her answer. Typical forum output--for every ten responses you get eleven opinions (mea culpa).