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  1. #21
    CDT - 2013, PCT - 2009, AT - 1300 miles done burger's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mags View Post
    Nothing to do with age. Let us not beat that old horse yet again.
    Some writer I can't remember compiled a long list of quotes basically saying "the youth of today is the worst generation that ever lived." The list of quotes went back to the MIDDLE AGES.

    That horse has been getting beaten for a thousand years now. It's not going to stop.

  2. #22

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    This thread just makes me wonder back to when I was a newbie attempting a thru-hike.
    Of course, this was in the days before social media (even computers)

    So, I had some advice from a friend who had read a book or two and knew who Warren Doyle was. (I certainly didn't)
    I headed out wearing jeans, but had a comparatively lightweight pack at 40 lbs. ('77 AT)

    Was I stupid?
    I would think not, but maybe to some I was.
    (my biggest mistake that year was to think that 2 of us could do the trail on $700)
    We made it from Springer to Delaware Water Gap anyway.

    I lived through it.

    Now, I've done 6 more completed thru hikes and try not to judge others. (not always easy)

    I think the millennials or whatever they prefer to be called will be fine.

    It's a different world and their apps might just save them when our paper maps might just fail us.
    Who knows?
    Don't let your fears stand in the way of your dreams

  3. #23

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    Quote Originally Posted by burger View Post
    Some writer I can't remember compiled a long list of quotes basically saying "the youth of today is the worst generation that ever lived." The list of quotes went back to the MIDDLE AGES.

    That horse has been getting beaten for a thousand years now. It's not going to stop.
    Doesnt make it not true.

    As technology makes lives easier, and lives are lived more and more indoors, each generation loses something.

    We took a quantum leap with the computer age.
    Last edited by MuddyWaters; 05-31-2016 at 21:35.

  4. #24
    Registered User Abi's Avatar
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    I recently came to a fork in the trail, and pulled out my paper map to confirm where I was, when I heard " uh oh!..." from another hiker, insinuating that I must be lost or unsure of my whereabouts because I was looking at my paper map. you should never laugh at someone looking at a map, they might feel uncomfortable using it when they need to. I look at my map to confirm that yes I do know where I am, plus I think I just like maps. I'm trying out a few apps too but find myself using it to see where I've been, not where I'm going. And they crash.

  5. #25
    Registered User egilbe's Avatar
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    Best way of preventing being lost is staying found and pulling a map out periodically to check your location works well for staying found. Never had a paper map run out of batteries, although they can get wet and are prone to blow away in a strong wind.

  6. #26
    CDT - 2013, PCT - 2009, AT - 1300 miles done burger's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by MuddyWaters View Post
    Doesnt make it not true.

    As technology makes lives easier, and lives are lived more and more indoors, each generation loses something.

    We took a quantum leap with the computer age.
    Each generation loses what? A few points off their mortality rate?

    Your argument is basically: yeah, people have been saying this for 1,000 years, but this time, it's really, really true.

    Funny.

  7. #27

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    Quote Originally Posted by Mags View Post
    Nothing seemingly about it. It was indeed opinionated, judgmental, harsh, ***holish, scathing and so on.. Pick an adjective. And a very accurate opinion for those whose outdoor experience is only thru-hiking on the well marked and maintained trails with a large infrastructure to support it.
    Holy crap. The trail of popcorn stopped. I'm lost. What do I do now? Holy crap. Cell ph doesn't work. What do I do now? A, B, C, D,...... Where are the adventurers...the explorers... those willing to forge ahead where there is no trail or route, even if only once in awhile?

  8. #28

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    This is me: I want to see the terrain and another view point. I want to experience a place.

    The skills we acquire bring great rewards as little as a few minutes from cars and well trod trails.

    I found a special mountain lake a few steps from the road, while everyone else wants to take the same photo of Goose Island, in St. Mary Lake, Glacier National Park, for example.

    This is one "safe" example.

    I don't want to tell the places I walk, because inexperienced hikers can so easily find out they are lost.

    In Oregon, I hike PCT side trails. I like that best.
    Last edited by Connie; 05-31-2016 at 23:41.

  9. #29
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    Quote Originally Posted by MuddyWaters View Post
    Charge for rescue when negligent

    Define negligent as depending on a phone app. Lack of skills, insufficient gear for conditions, etc
    Who decides if gear is insufficient?

  10. #30

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    Quote Originally Posted by archie View Post
    Who decides if gear is insufficient?
    A select group of very old men with long white beards who mumble most of the day which is presumed to be wisdom. However, the final decision is made by nature if the gear is insufficient.

  11. #31

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    Quote Originally Posted by archie View Post
    Who decides if gear is insufficient?
    Usually SAR, followed by courts

  12. #32
    Garlic
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    Quote Originally Posted by archie View Post
    Who decides if gear is insufficient?
    The HHCOH (High Holy Council of Hiking), of course!

    I've heard, "There is no such thing as a smart accident." I try to remember that when someone gets in trouble, especially me. As long as there are humans, there will be accidents and people getting in trouble. And there will be those willing to go into harm's way to help them out.

    Our society often accepts the damage done by a powerful tool. Using a chainsaw entails increased risk in exchange for much higher production. The automobile age certainly introduced a lot more risk into our lives, yet we live with that. Dare I bring up firearms? Information Technology must have a high level of risk with such a powerful tool. Many of us are carefully trained or licensed, but some of us are like children playing with a loaded gun. Accidents will happen.
    "Throw a loaf of bread and a pound of tea in an old sack and jump over the back fence." John Muir on expedition planning

  13. #33

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    There is a kickoff event for the PCT.

    There is a gear shakedown available there.

  14. #34
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    Hey guys! I'm a millennial and I use paper maps! Gotta save that phone battery life for my selfie-with-bear-instagram-post.


    I wonder what the old timers knocking technology would have done if the technology of today was available to them when they were inexperienced kids? Or were they born luddites?
    "I am learning nothing in this trivial world of [humans]. I must break away and get out into the mountains to learn the news." --John Muir

  15. #35
    Getting out as much as I can..which is never enough. :) Mags's Avatar
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    Technology is a wonderful tool. As garlic said, knowing how to properly use the tool is even better.
    Last edited by Mags; 06-01-2016 at 09:55.

  16. #36

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    Quote Originally Posted by MuddyWaters View Post
    Most people are simply stupid.
    Especially the millenials
    And more and more of them are showing up to hike all trails due to facebook.

    There a book out there "The dumbest generation: how the digital age stupefies young americans and jeopardizes our future"

    Worth reading
    I encounter this all the time
    Young people that cant do a simple thing worth a f#$k.
    Do you have any room up in that ivory tower of yours? The range of stupidity and idiocracy knows no age. Have you seen the funnel cake line at a county fair? Or been to Wal Mart lately? Lastly, nobody seems to acknowledge that GenX and baby boomers are partially responsible for poor parenting. They want to blame everyone else except for their own actions.

    I'm currently thru hiking the AT. You know who are the biggest whiners on the trail? I'll give you a hint. They were born before 1980.

  17. #37
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    Quote Originally Posted by capehiker View Post
    You know who are the biggest whiners on the trail? I'll give you a hint. They were born before 1980.
    Time tends to breed a cantankerous variety of human. Just give it some time.

  18. #38
    CDT - 2013, PCT - 2009, AT - 1300 miles done burger's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by capehiker View Post
    I'm currently thru hiking the AT. You know who are the biggest whiners on the trail? I'll give you a hint. They were born before 1980.
    Maybe it takes a certain amount of life experience to distinguish a crappy trail like the AT from a good trail like the PCT.

  19. #39
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    What's different about the Millennials is that they had parents like my wife and me doing all the stuff that this article condemns [1]. I don't think they're irretrievably damaged, but they've got catching up to do.

    Now that my daughter is grown, she occasionally reminisces: "I can't believe the stuff that you and Mom let me do! Xxxx's parents never would have let her do that!"

    "Could Xxxx have been trusted with that?"

    "Hmmm. No. Not really."

    "Could you?"

    "Of course."

    "Might there be a connection?"

    The ones who are making the big mistakes now are the ones who weren't given enough freedom to make little mistakes when they were young.
    ----
    [1] Yes, I include myself. If I'd had my way about child-rearing, the neighbours would have called social services. The kid could have handled it.
    I always know where I am. I'm right here.

  20. #40
    Getting out as much as I can..which is never enough. :) Mags's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Another Kevin View Post
    What's different about the Millennials is that they had parents like my wife and me doing all the stuff that this article condemns [1]. I don't think they're irretrievably damaged, but they've got catching up to do.
    I'm firmly in the Gen X camp. And, unlike most of these generational stereotypes which are really about a very small socioeconomic group, I did not grow up privileged.

    What I did have is an ethnic, working-class, Catholic mother. The parents in this article have NOTHING in the over-protectiveness department over her.

    Generational stereotypes are bunk..but perhaps I'll gleefully poke fun at the stereotype I come from..
    Last edited by Mags; 06-01-2016 at 17:52.
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